what about tube pedal

[kldguitar]

who know more about tube pedal? how about it?
why fewer people use it? expensive or other reason?
why only have fewer kind of tube pedal?
Does solid amp with tube pedal make sound warm like tube amp?
Thanks
http://www.kldguitar.com

[raycroft]

don't know, brother. never heard of it.

[kldguitar]

don't know, brother. never heard of it.

Do you hear TK999

[drlowlow]

I am not farmiliar with that particular pedal but I can give some insight to why there are less tube pedals than solid state. The first concern is the fact that tubes need a much higher voltage than solid state components to operate correctly. there are tube-works pedals that use solid state components with tubes but they don't really operate the tube at its recomended voltage so the sound is ultimately not really tubey (at least the ones I have seen). there are a few high quality tube pedals on the market that feature high voltage tube operation but the economics of producing these types of pedals isn't very good for the companies that make them. It is alot cheaper to get a couple op amps running from 9VDC then build something that needs the higher voltage and current. there are a few effects that without the use of integrated components would not fit a chassis most musicians would tolerate on their pedalboard so there is no market for it. Depending on what effect you want you might be able to find a tube pedal that will do it but look at paying an exponential price for it in comparison with a comperable solid state device, it is up to you to decide if the sound is worth the price point. Of course do some research into the particular pedal you wish and find out if it really uses the tube "correctly" or if it is a mere psydo tube there to look pretty and make sure it sounds right for you.

[Enzo]

Also, by its very nature, an effect pedal sits on the floor and gets kicked around. This will not be a very reliable place for tubes.

[Suburbanite]

I tried out some of the electro harmonix range a while back and must admit was very impressed, they have some 18v models and there are some old mains powered ones, but the thought of "valves+foot+beer=pop" put me off

You can find some nice pre-amps out there to slap on top of your rig, pick them up on ebay for reasonable prices, I use one for my vocals, all though for guitar you just can't beat a good valve amp

[frank.clarke]

Does solid amp with tube pedal make sound warm like tube amp?

http://www.kldguitar.com
No, that's the problem. You can pick up a tube amp for $100, put in a resistive load, then use it as a huge pedal in your signal path.
There are decent tube pedals out there, they just aren't fashionable.

[d95err]

The real "magic" in a warm tube sound is in the poweramp. If you have a good tube poweramp, you can get it regardless if you have a solid state or tube preamp. If you don't, well then you can have as many tubes in the preamp you want, you still won't quite get there... ;)

[Liam]

Do you hear TK999

Never tried one, but I'll bet Ibanez sell a lot more Tubescreamers than they do Tube Kings.

I realise you are probably just doing a bit of market research, but you seem to be barking up the wrong tree here.

[kldguitar]

The real "magic" in a warm tube sound is in the poweramp. If you have a good tube poweramp, you can get it regardless if you have a solid state or tube preamp. If you don't, well then you can have as many tubes in the preamp you want, you still won't quite get there... ;)
Power amp is important. good power amp is enough

[lowell]

the seymour duncan twin tube classic is a KILLER sounding pedal... imo. warren haynes w/ allmans tone.

[Guitarist]

I called New Sensor and they are no longer selling their 12V to 200V step up toroid transformer (or the two tube case:(.
Anyone know another affordable source for a tube friendly toroid or who make theirs?

All the transistor/fet/chip pedals i've heard are NOT as toneful as a tube preamp whether pedal or rack. Most guitarist, i'd think 95%, could tell the difference right away. I sure can. Even the Rocktron Silver Dragon or Todd Brindle's Dr. Blade (out of production) blow away boutique/tuned fet types @$180! Better a low Voltage tube (+OP amp, opt.) than any sand-based distortion pedal. Another idea would be to run the heaters at 24 volts then add a voltage doubler/tripler to get some half-assed voltage on the plates. We don't need MEGA gain, summing as the output level, because it is a pedal, just distortion. Wire it up, put in trimmer resistors at the grids/plates then swap in a few tube types and settle on your values. Hmmm, maybe that what I should do next;).

Guitarists NEED more of these, the economics will take care of themselves. We just need the perfect toroid. 1 amp X volts AC for the filiments and perhaps a low VA sec. winding for the HV string.

There is a high bar to beat though, and that is the Silver Dragon which embarrasses even Mesa preamps at times. I don't know how they did it but some mad-ass Japanese rock-metal fan, tech-heads really designed a "nuke the competition" type of stomp box with that one. It is easily the best distortion device I have ever intimately heard (though I haven't heard everything). This includes a Mesa pre, kelley DS-1, 3tube ADAand all modellers inc. GR3, Zoom 2t...
Want to take the audition? Using one of those will help. It almost makes modding preamps a wasted effort.
Also, it is proported that cryo. treated tubes are stronger mechanically and are really affordable (eBay) so that might be a design inclusion (also for outputs tubes). Your STOMP box may survive a 250 lb. rocker kicking with a accelerating Dayton aimed "generally" at the switch. Not to mention, flash pots ("..what already out of flash powder? OK try this here stuff" BOOM!), Zack Wilde beer spurts and regular power surges.

Oh, I guess another bar is the L. Carlton or R. Ford Dumble lead tone. Oh yeah.

[52 Bill]

I called New Sensor and they are no longer selling their 12V to 200V step up toroid transformer (or the two tube case:(.
Anyone know another affordable source for a tube friendly toroid or who make theirs?
Why not do what experimenters have done for years. If you take a 220vac to 12vac power transformer and wire it backwards, you have what you are looking for. Or try a 120vac to 6vac transformer with 12vac applied to the the 6vac side.

[Guitarist]

Bill,

That is a great idea but unless outside of the case I always got hum from them. Perhaps just cheap, unshielded transformer I guess. That EH toroid was great- 1/2 the price as Hoffman's which I just relocated here... http://www.hoffmanamps.com/MyStore/perlshop.cgi?ACTION=thispage&thispage=parts1.htm&ORDER_ID=979848998

[lowell]

check out these: http://www.nuvotem.com/en/contacts/usa.shtml

[Guitarist]

Edit to above: The above PS toroid is made by Amveco and available at Digikey:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=TE70001-ND

Hoffman's price is good too considering the relevent info he's provided.

I had asked Amvveco for a transfomer like this but a "dual duty" type. Like we're used to, but toroid and just for preamps. Dang, how hard can this be?

[Steve Conner]

All you need is two small toroid transformers back to back. A 120V to 6V and then a 6V to 240V. You use the 6V intermediate winding for your heaters.

If you buy a bunch of international-type transformers (two independent 120V primaries) that covers you for everything.

Applying 12V to a 6V winding will just saturate the transformer and burn it out.

[Guitarist]

Steve,

I hear you saying that there is just one transformer type required: 120V X 2 Primary and 2 x 6V Secondary. I located that part here: http://cgi.ebay.com/12-12V-25VA-Toroid-Toroidal-Power-Transformer_W0QQitemZ370035979822QQihZ024QQcategoryZ7315 2QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

I think that putting the 4'th stage as 2 x 120 Volts in SERIES will give yea the revered 220V to really pull the tone through. No-one on Earth makes a single toroid with these secondaries? I guess if EH and Rocktron use wallwarts then maybe we should too. Even though these donuts are 3' round by 1.5' high. Having two in an enclosure is going to take up a LOT of space. Sourcing a suitable stomp box is interesting. I saw a stainless steel tissue box that had a hinged bottom that might work well. It had an oval opening on top.

One more ?: If the Amveco specs as:
Parallel Output Voltage @ Current 9 VAC @ 178mA
Maximum Power 1.6 VA

How many 12ax7's plates can that support? I am guessing quite a few ;)
How about a ECLL800 or 6BM8? (single tube: output-PI driver and output tube in one) Now that would be liberating!