Kay "kleenex or "Barney Kessel" pickups

[EFK]

Can anyone definitively say who made these? As far as I am aware, the flat-top "kleenex" pickups and the angular top "Barney Kessel" pickups were the same P90 type pickup with different covers. I just picked up a Kessel type entirely on a whim, because it's so clean, and I have to say - this is a REALLY well made, quality pickup. I was expecting it to be kind of half-assed being that they were made for so-called budget guitars, but this thing is very nicely made. the bobbins, if rounded at the corners instead of squared, would fit right into a Gibson P90 cover. Polepieces are a lot more massive, though, and keeper looks a bit bigger with comparable dual long mags.

Anyway - this may all be ho hum to the professionals here, but I really admire the construction and would like to know if there is any documented information as to who was making them. This one is *I think, if I am reading the date stamp correctly,* 1966 so it might be Japanese?

[Possum]

I have no proof but am pretty sure they were a DeArmond or DeArmond Rowe product. DeARmond was an amazing pickup designer, there are a bunch of tricks in the Kleenex box pickups, very well thought out design.

[David King]

Photos? Please...

[jonson]

Allways been my undertanding that the Speedbumps/Kessels and Kleenex were made by Kay themselves and not Dearmond.

[Possum]

Actually I think there is a patent on the Kleenex pickup, I seem to recall one but can't find it in my stash.... I kind of doubt that Kay made that particular pickup, the pole pieces are about the same I've seen on DeArmond stuff before. No proof of any of this though....

[EFK]

Here is a link to a bunch of photos:

Kay Pickup Photos by moldyoak | Photobucket

Here's some measurements of the pickup itself:

Baseplate is thin brass, .035 thick and 3.260 X 1.255. It is not threaded for poles.
Bobbin is .372 overall height, 3.235 X 1.180. Coil height is .265.
Magnets - .130 thick X 2.5 long X .5 wide
Polepieces - .945 overall length, large heads are .205 diameter, threaded portion is 6/32 thread
Keeper is 2.812 length X .255 wide X .130 thick. Holes are not threaded.
The two assembly screws/nuts are steel. Cover is plastic of some kind. The pole screws are threaded into the bobbin itself and as you can see, they can only screw down so far, so a lot of the screw is protruding upwards. This is because the inside of the cover is tall or "domed" so they need to protrude up this far to actually protrude out of the top of the pickup cover.

This bobbin and baseplate could easily be trimmed to fit inside a modern Gibson soapbar cover but of course there's the issue of the height of the pole screws.

DC resistance measurements, magnet gauss at poles and inductance readings are in pictures.

The little folded piece of black paper you see in some photos was wedged between the baseplate and magnet on one side, and folded upward alongside the coil. Don;t know why it's there but I suspect it was to keep the whole assembly tightly fitted into the cover.

I don;t see any evidence of any wax or potting.

It looks like a really nicely made pickup, but I have no idea how it sounds.