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1964 No Logo Deluxe Reverb Strange Issue

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  • #31
    My engineers did very well with practical as well as theoretical stuff. One technician with 10 engineers worked perfectly.
    And my practical experience and skills aren't too bad either.
    yes. of course overlap. it depends on what the job is. Are your 10 engineers and one technician responsible for designing things or are they responsible for maintenance and repair of things? I think in my pro audio repair facility that ration would be reversed. Just saying one is not superior to the other, just doing different jobs.


    In one life I serviced juke boxes, and trained techs how to do it. Seeberg jukes have a mechanism - the mechanical part that scans back and forth and picks up the record and plays it - that is a mechanical marvel. A motor on a frame that drives cams and clutches and gears. Seven moving parts just to make a tiny brush quickly sweep up and down as the tone arm goes by to brush any lint off the stylus. Tone arm assembly slid side to side to get on the proper A or B side of a record. There were stacks of blade switches, oiling points, adjustment screws. I am truly impressed with this complex machine. Unfortunately whoever designed it never worked on them. Instead of an access door in the rear of the juke so you could put it in front of your nose, they made the whole mech and magazine slide forward - after you removed the front of the jukebox - and then it was hinged so it could be tilted towards you to expose the rear. And there was even a brace and chain to allow it to be suspended in that position.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    • #32
      Just saying one is not superior to the other, just doing different jobs.
      Agree and would like to add...and sometimes doing the same job with a different approach. What counts are efficiency and results. I don't like this technicians vs. engineers or engineers vs. physicists stuff. But I admit that often different "languages" and methods are used. I try to stay away from generalization and prejudice.

      I hope you are not telling me that this forum is for technicians only?

      That said, I have the highest respect for your experience and analyzing skills as well as your patience with posters.
      And I would not have interfered in your response above if I would have seen it before my posting as "too many cooks spoil the broth" and I don't think you need my help.
      Last edited by Helmholtz; 07-13-2018, 03:37 PM.
      - Own Opinions Only -

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      • #33
        I hope you are not telling me that this forum is for technicians only?

        No no no no...

        I never intended it to be an us versus them thing, I was just expounding on that aspect of electronics. I was the technical rep for an amusement product many years ago. The engineers came over from the UK to show me the product and how it worked. It was then up to me to support the product, train others in its use, and in fact even tweak the circuits to do extra things we wanted. I was the monkey crawling under the thing. They were the guys who came up with the design in the first place.

        I love to see new cooks in the broth. I like to see people put the same idea into words as I did, but using totally different words. Likewise I often restate someone's point in a different manner. The more ways something is presented, the more likely it will reach someone trying to understand.

        So many novice techs are afraid of the technology involved, and I like to present things in a casual dis-arming manner to help them relax and look at the circuits. And as useful as a network analyzer might be, I want kids to know you don't have to have one to work on your old Fender.
        Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Enzo View Post
          ... As useful as a network analyzer might be, I want kids to know you don't have to have one to work on your old Fender.
          Damn, I'm glad someone finally said it. Whew!

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Tone Meister View Post
            Damn, I'm glad someone finally said it. Whew!
            Who claimed the contrary?
            You don't need a scope for simple repairs. But it helps to understand what's happening. Things change when you start to design your own stuff. Measuring is the key to understanding.
            Same with simulations.
            Why not use an analyzer when it's available and may give some clue?
            - Own Opinions Only -

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            • #36
              cerrem more or less did.

              Nothing wrong with using everything at your disposal. The OP was concerned that his amp lost level.
              Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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              • #37
                The OP was concerned that his amp lost level.
                Yep, and he hasn't reported back since post #19, keeping us idling.

                cerrem more or less did.
                ...and I proved him wrong without using an expensive analyzer.
                Last edited by Helmholtz; 07-14-2018, 11:14 PM.
                - Own Opinions Only -

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Helmholtz View Post
                  Yep, and he didn't report back since post #19, keeping us idling.
                  I tend to do that here sometimes. The info Luth needed was given and he's right in the middle of a project and on to some new issue now... Too busy to post until he has his new questions sorted out It's what we do
                  "Take two placebos, works twice as well." Enzo

                  "Now get off my lawn with your silicooties and boom-chucka speakers and computers masquerading as amplifiers" Justin Thomas

                  "If you're not interested in opinions and the experience of others, why even start a thread?
                  You can't just expect consent." Helmholtz

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                  • #39
                    OK, back at it. I have not been ignoring this thread, I have been very busy with other things that came up and gone for the past weekend.

                    Also WHOOPSY, in the post that I typed way out up to 140UF, that was supposed to be 40UF. Sorry bout that. Yeah it's a cheap meter but it was my fault on the post. I had it checked by someone today with a better meter and he got 35UF.

                    The owner has chosen to recap the amp.

                    One more question.

                    On pin 1 of V5 the schematic and layout show +270V, could that be a typo? The actual reading there is around 414 or there abouts not near the amp right now going on memory. All resistors check OK. The wire feeding pin 1 is connected to a 200K resistor which the other side of the resistor is connected to the junction of the 100K and 10m which is feed directly off the filter cap. Wouldn't the voltage on pin 1 be a lot higher than 270V?
                    It's all about the bass. Lock in the groove and stay out of everyone else's way.

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                    • #40
                      That would be the trem tube (I think, there are no V#'s on 1964 Fender schematics ). Is the tremolo working? Clearly something is hinky with the ground for the cathodes of that tube because the high plate voltage would be a symptom of the tube not drawing any current. Perhaps this could be the case for other tubes or circuits as well.?. Any other grossly high voltages? Panel controls that either don't work or seem to work incorrectly?
                      "Take two placebos, works twice as well." Enzo

                      "Now get off my lawn with your silicooties and boom-chucka speakers and computers masquerading as amplifiers" Justin Thomas

                      "If you're not interested in opinions and the experience of others, why even start a thread?
                      You can't just expect consent." Helmholtz

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Is that with the trem off that you get the 400V at the plate? Voltages shown are with oscillator running. I wouldn't worry unless there is a trem fault.
                        Originally posted by Enzo
                        I have a sign in my shop that says, "Never think up reasons not to check something."


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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by g1 View Post
                          Is that with the trem off that you get the 400V at the plate? Voltages shown are with oscillator running. I wouldn't worry unless there is a trem fault.
                          I thought of that too. Then I thought it shouldn't much matter since it's the signal path that interrupted on the oscillator and nothing about it's idle current. I still thought 414V was high. High as in no current at all.?.
                          "Take two placebos, works twice as well." Enzo

                          "Now get off my lawn with your silicooties and boom-chucka speakers and computers masquerading as amplifiers" Justin Thomas

                          "If you're not interested in opinions and the experience of others, why even start a thread?
                          You can't just expect consent." Helmholtz

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Yes it's the trem tube. Yes the trem works and works well. That was the only one that was out a lot, I'll double check the voltages on the other tubes again to make sure. All controls are working. The amp will get a full test tomorrow. I'll also take a look at the grounds.
                            It's all about the bass. Lock in the groove and stay out of everyone else's way.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              The reading would have been with the trem off, nothing connected to the RCA.
                              It's all about the bass. Lock in the groove and stay out of everyone else's way.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Chuck,

                                Rechecked everything today and the trem tube was the only one showing high voltage. I checked a few things and found that one of the cathode ground wires had a bad solder connection, it pulled right off the brass ground plate. Fixed that and retested with the trem on and all is OK.
                                It's all about the bass. Lock in the groove and stay out of everyone else's way.

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