bugera 333xl schemaics ????

[wyomingrocks]

Why would a company not offer schematics for there products, to me that product becomes useless at that point. I bought a bugera 333xl in july and it had a problem, they ended up sending me a new amp back. Great customer service all the way through by the way. But I would like to get a schematic for it, I have checked every where online and can't find one. I contacted the company and they won't release them. I don't understand why? Some company's like traynor have a schematic link right on there site. I have a brand new one never opened I guess I will eventually put it on ebay. That is to bad for me because sound wise it is one of my favorites.

[trevorus]

They don't want other non-autorized people working on their stuff. Not that uncommon. Sorry man.

[Danglin' Fury]

What REALLY sucks about Bugera is it is a spin-off of Behringer. I have taked to Behringer dealers and they have told me that when people bring their amps in to get serviced, their corporate office tells them to throw them in the trash. A certified amp shop here in Tulsa has told me they can't even get a schematic for ANYTHING Behringer or Bugera. Really lame if you ask me. If you start comparing the Bugera amps with certain Peavey amps,(333=XXX, 333xl= JSX, 6262= 6505, etc...) you will start to see a little reverse engineering going on.

[Enzo]

I'd say their amps are designed to remind you of those PV models, but inside they are not all that much of a copy.

Only Behringer authorized repair station are allowed access to the schematics. We all have to sign a non-disclosure agreeement, so we cannot distribute them. Your pal in Tulsa must not be a Behringer authorized repair facility then. it isn;t a matter of how good a tech you are, it is a matter of having the business relationship with the company or not. For example Fender doesn;t sell to anyone but their dealers.

Each manufacturer has his own policy about documents. There are a couple issues. One is copyright/patent infringement. I mean this is a tube amp, and not many electronic things are simpler than tube amps. ANy technician can sit down and draw out the schematic if he has the unit in hand. But part of defending your product is limiting access to the particulars. Yes, everyone knows all you have to do is walk in a store and buy one and trace out the circuit, but they don;t make it easy for you to do so.

SOmeone like Peavey is very free with schematics, but they never went through a huge patent infringement suit with Mackie like Behringer did. Behringer lost big time. They tend to be a bit snake bit.

ANother concern is liability. If I hand you a schematic, I am giving you tacit approval to work inside the unit. Little Johnny electrocutes himself working on his amp, then mom and dad are suing ME.

A factory provides a service network, so your product can be serviced when needed. or they have an exchange program. SO they have covered your need for a schematic.

I neither agree or disagree with this sort of policy, it is simply a fact of life in the business.

[wyomingrocks]

I sort of know where they are coming from, but me as a consumer. It just plain sucks. Out of all the marshalls and mesa's and other amps I have owned for what ever reason the bugera just plays in the top 10% for me. I can look at it and tell it is cheaply constructed. I had one die the first day and another die about after 3 months. They ended up replacing both with very little hassle, but this next year my warrantee runs out. So that goes out the window. If I keep it I guess I will end up tracing it out like you comment on. I guess there wouldn't be nothing illegal for me to post a hand drawn schematic somewhere without my signature? I wasn't aware of there big law suit. I will probably sometime down the road try out a used jsx, which is supposed to be very simular but with peavey quality. At 550.00 or what ever it was new, I can make a pretty good dent in another new one with shippng and all if I had to send it of and get it serviced. As they say, it suck to be you. But in this case it sucks to be me. I won't cry over it though there are plenty of amps, that never changes. I owned the JVM for about 6 months before they released the schematic. If I wait long enough some where some time, some one will leak out. Anyway I just thought I would ask. As always thanks for your input.

[Enzo]

You haven't mentioned the nature of the problems the amp had. I personally don't think most tube amp repairs are much of a challenge, since most are just broken parts or tube failures. We can always find screen resistors or output transformers without schematics.

[wyomingrocks]

The first one I had just quit working after I brought it home. The external fuse was good. It died while it was in stand by. No sound, it seems like the front panel light still lit and the tubes lost power (something to that effect). I returned it and they gave me a new one.

The second one died, there is a picture around here that is almost exactly like my problem. The connector coming off the transformer shorted out. The tech I sent it to, changed connectors and he said he still didn't like the sound of it. He ordered a replacement board, it did not come in for two to three weeks, I called him and he said he would check on it. A couple days later UPS delivered what I believe to be a brand new one to my door.
I still haven't even opened it. It was sent straight from the manufacturer.
In the mean time I bought the TSL's and have been playing them for the past two to three months.

I can tell you one thing, poking my nose in that bugera and comparing it to the tsl is like comparing grade school to college. Since I am not an amp tech by trade, it takes me longer to get my bearings inside an amp. I guess like anything the more you do something the easier it becomes. I remember when I first started out being a tech, I would look at what seemed to be a confusing bunch of parts connected together but they became easier and easier as the years went by and eventually I didn't have to reach for my schematics all the time, I could just check key places and solve my problem more efficiently. I am still far from that with amps because I have only worked on 5-6 of them. But I have learned a ton on this forum thanks to you Enzo and many good folks out there who donate there time to help out amp owners like myself. I would imagine if I sat down for an 8 hour day I could probably trace out most of the bugera and it would be a keeper for me, like I say I really like the tone alot. I may end up keeping it, it just seems like it is not a matter of if, but when it will go down on me. Out of the 10 years I was a tech I never did find a problem I couldn't fix, but for someone not that familiar with amp circuitry I have to wonder if it is more trouble than it is worth.

[Blackzar84]

Originally Posted by wyomingrocks

The first one I had just quit working after I brought it home. The external fuse was good. It died while it was in stand by. No sound, it seems like the front panel light still lit and the tubes lost power (something to that effect). I returned it and they gave me a new one.

The second one died, there is a picture around here that is almost exactly like my problem. The connector coming off the transformer shorted out. The tech I sent it to, changed connectors and he said he still didn't like the sound of it. He ordered a replacement board, it did not come in for two to three weeks, I called him and he said he would check on it. A couple days later UPS delivered what I believe to be a brand new one to my door.
I still haven't even opened it. It was sent straight from the manufacturer.
In the mean time I bought the TSL's and have been playing them for the past two to three months.

I can tell you one thing, poking my nose in that bugera and comparing it to the tsl is like comparing grade school to college. Since I am not an amp tech by trade, it takes me longer to get my bearings inside an amp. I guess like anything the more you do something the easier it becomes. I remember when I first started out being a tech, I would look at what seemed to be a confusing bunch of parts connected together but they became easier and easier as the years went by and eventually I didn't have to reach for my schematics all the time, I could just check key places and solve my problem more efficiently. I am still far from that with amps because I have only worked on 5-6 of them. But I have learned a ton on this forum thanks to you Enzo and many good folks out there who donate there time to help out amp owners like myself. I would imagine if I sat down for an 8 hour day I could probably trace out most of the bugera and it would be a keeper for me, like I say I really like the tone alot. I may end up keeping it, it just seems like it is not a matter of if, but when it will go down on me. Out of the 10 years I was a tech I never did find a problem I couldn't fix, but for someone not that familiar with amp circuitry I have to wonder if it is more trouble than it is worth.

This Monday, i just bought a brand new Bugera V55HD from my favourite local shop. I tried it for a few minutes in the shop, it sounded kinda weird, "kinda ossidating pots sound" comin outta the cab, than it stopped as the amp warmed up while i was playing, and it was fine to me, i just thought it was just the valves warming up.
I carried it at home, and start to playin it, in triode mode at less than half volume, 16ohm cab correctly matched. I played it for 3 quarters of an hour, than i turned it off. After half of an hour i decided to play it a little more, cos i liked it so much, and there was the BIG FUCKING surprise.
As done before, stand by for few minutes and than i switched it on, and no sound was comin out of it...all volumes up and no sound, than i just turned up the clean a little more and than a LOUD LOUD noise came outta the amp, and the only way to stop it was turning off the amp, and so i did.

I just carried it back to the shop and sent to the authorized tech service. I'm pretty pissed off about this, i just don't get why they sell these amps if they break up so easily...and i'm seriously thinkin about not keepin it, even after th reparation, cos i read that they are cheap, and i already knew that, i just didn't think they were SO cheap...
Bad thing is that i'm not an amp technician at all, so i don't know how the hell to fix it. Warraty lasts for a year, and after that??? What if it breaks up again???