Ultimate Tone ?!?

[Chuck H]

The point was raised in another thread that the constant tweaking in search for the ultimate tone from an amp is futile because it's different for everyone and there are too many important types of tones for one amp to do them all well. I would agree with this. But I still think tweaking an amp as close to the tone in your head as you can get it is a justified effort.

I'm starting this thread to try to get an idea what players hear and love. Who better than we here who love, play and build our gear.

What recorded tone, that most people would be able to reference and recognize, really turns you on. The one you hear and think 'Man, I love the guitar tone on this track'.

Obviously most of us probably have several. I'll start off with two of my favorites.

Midnight Rambler (Rolling Stones) the low parts. The guitar is just so spongey and crisp at the same time. Killer. AND... The intro guitar for the Beavis and Butthead theme. Anyone else ever notice that one?

All entries appreciated.

Chuck

[daz]

Wow, where do i start?! Pretty much anything from SRV or Brad paisley gives me an instant broner. (yeah, the "r" was there to keep it clean) But i could list many songs/players. How about the tone on the solo in blue collar man by styx? Name any of the older to mid era townsend tones...man o man ! Those rhythm tones were perfection. For the most in your face nasty but awesome fuzz, check out 3 dog nite, mainly the older tunes. Or if i really want to hurt myself, the guitar tone in the stone's 'monkey man" is painfully good, especially that opening riff....how in gods name did such an orgasmic tone ever come to be ?! I could go on, but why...

[defaced]

That super buttery clean Chevelle uses on the album "Wonder What's Next". Send the Pain Below and Closure are two tracks it's prevalent on.

And for high gain, there isn't a recorded example of what I hear in my head. But I will say the Uberschall, the Deliverance and the SLO 100 are all high gain sounds I really like, and all for very different reasons.

[Mandopicker]

When I need a tone fix...depending upon my mood, I like throwing on just about any Steely Dan album or even to listen to some Buck Owens for that super tasteful Don Rich. (Love the steel guitar too!)

There certainly is whole lot of great tone in between.

Great thread!

[txstrat]

Great thread.
I like SRV and the likes very much probably due to the TONE of the strat through a Fender amp. For the "clean section" reference I would say "Lenny" from the Texas Flood album. And for the overdriven one I'd say "Crosscut saw" from the SRV 3 disk compilation or maybe "Taxman".
I really like it when I hear the pumping power tubes in "Crosscut saw".

[theunrulychef]

Hmm, it's like asking what we're all wearing today.

These all tend to give me the willies down my spine every time though:
Link Wray - Rumble
Neil Young & Crazy Horse - Loose Change (from the oddball album Broken Arrow)
Santo & Johnny - Sleep Walk

[Robert M. Martinelli]

"Clean" sound: Wayne Krantz on Donald Fagen's "Great Pagoda Of Funn" ( BTW his solo on that track is a masterpiece IMHO, check it out! )

"Blues" sound:SRV's "Lenny" ( "hoarse", but gentle and buttery Fender tone )

"High Gain" sound: Joe Satriani's tone on "Revelations" ( tasteful, toneful, never obtrusive )

Anyway, all of the above examples are also very much "touch dependent", as we're talking about three geniuses who grace(d) their playing with an incredible amount of dynamics and touch control.

This reinforces my belief that the player's touch is at the top of the list when it comes to "tone-making" ( the #2 being a guitar/amp combination capable of fully capturing all the subtle variations a gifted player can "throw in" in his playing ).

JM2CW

Best regards

Bob

[rathmann]

Hmm, it's like asking what we're all wearing today.

No kidding!

Brian May's various tones on "News of the World" really are what started me down the path of the ultimate tone search.

Distorted lead tone - We Will Rock You
Rhythm tone - It's Late

But really pick any Queen song and Brian's tone is incredible and perfect for the mood of the song.

Similarly, any of Dave Gilmour's stuff from DSotM through to The Wall.

As far as a single track, check out Eddie Hazel's lead on Maggot Brain.

The peak of the EVH tone was on Fair Warning. Kind of thin a mid-heavy by metal standards today, but the crunch tones on Meanstreets and Unchained defined the sound of hard rock / metal for at least a decade. The leads on Hear About It Later and Dirty Movies still give me chills.

As far as heavy, high-gain distorted metal tones goes I've always dug Adam Jones (from Tool)

[cminor9]

This is fun, I'll play!

Clean: Just about anything by Barney Kessel or Larry Coryell. Maybe too obscure for this discussion, but the tele tones on Volebeats recordings (particularly The Sky and the Ocean) are delicious and make me stop what I am doing to admire them!

Lead: Slash solos on old Guns and Roses tunes, particularly the first solo on Knocking on Heavens Door. John Mayer's solo on Gravity (live version on the Try album)

Crunch: AC/DC Back in Black, ZZ Top cheap sunglasses. Also, many of the tones on Stone Temple Pilots' Core album are quite nice.

[hasserl]

So many different players/tones, it's hard to list an ultimate.

But here's a couple of really righteous examples of tone IMO:

YouTube - Greg Martin digs into his 1958 Les Paul

YouTube - Greg Martin digs into his 1958 Les Paul

YouTube - Sean Costello 'Hucklebuck' Crossroads Cafe, Antwerp 071125

YouTube - Sean Costello 'Hucklebuck' Crossroads Cafe, Antwerp 071125

YouTube - "Desdemona" - Derek Trucks Guitar Solo

YouTube - "Desdemona" - Derek Trucks Guitar Solo

YouTube - Marshall Tucker Band Ramblin On My Mind -original MTB!

YouTube - Marshall Tucker Band Ramblin On My Mind -original MTB!

YouTube - Jimi Hendrix - Little Wing (Royal Albert Hall) Stereo

YouTube - Jimi Hendrix - Little Wing (Royal Albert Hall) Stereo

[tubeswell]

Larry Carlton on Kid Charlemagne

Pete Green

Hank Marvin's sound on the Shadows version of 'Stardust' (and the trem) & of course Apache

John Fogarty on Born on the Bayou

Dick Dale on Misirlou (Pulp Fiction version)

Otis Rush on All Your Love

George Harrison on Come Together

Eric Clapton on Hideaway

SRV on Mary Had a Little Lamb

Dalibor & Dinko from The Bambi Molesters on Theme From Slaying Beauty

James Burton on Suzie Q

Brian Setzer on Stray Cat Strut

Chuck Berry on Johnny Be Goode

Jimi Hendrix on Red House

Jimmy Page on Whole Lotta Love (esp. the solo) & The Lemon Song & D'Yer Mak'er

Mark Knopfler on Sultans of Swing

Neil Young on Cortez The Killer

Billy Gibbons on La Grange & Tush

Elliot Easton on Let the Good Times Roll

Brian May on I Want to Break Free

Hubert Sumlin on You'll Be Mine & Smokestack Lightnin'

any Elmore James

even Josh White (and he was acoustic)

They all added something to the mix

[Spookyman]

Malcolm Young acheives great things although I'm told often he is actually playing through a bass amp... not sure if that is true or if so what amp it is.

SRV on Pride and Joy

John Lee Hooker on almost everything he played

Creedence Clearwater Revival on Born on the Bayou

Angus Young on the Back in Black album - the intro to Have A Drink On Me

The guitar on Little Feat's Dixie Chicken

Keef on So many tracks, but the live sound that was captured on the Flashpoint album was great

Boss coming back into office, must go, will post more later...

[PremiumPlus]

Hendrix / Red House
Larry Carlton / Don't Take me Alive, Kid Charlemagne
Robin Trower / Bridge of Sighs
Keith Richards / Midnight Rambler
Lennon/McCartney/Harrison The End
Lennon/Harrison Ticket to Ride
Billy Gibbons/ Blue Jean Blues
Jimmy Page/ How Many More Times, The Ocean

Oh Yeah!!!

[anthillrich]

+1 on the Eddie van halen Fair warning tone. i am not crazy about most of the EVH tones( vh II was about the worst), but mean streets, sends a chill up my spine. what kinda marshall was that anyway?

for clean, Mark knopfler's tones on the "BROTHERS IN ARMS" album.

and about a million other great tones i can think of. In fact, i wish i had one "ultimate tone" in my head, i'd just go buy that particular amp and be happy.

[theunrulychef]

Originally Posted by anthillrich

and about a million other great tones i can think of. In fact, i wish i had one "ultimate tone" in my head, i'd just go buy that particular amp and be happy.

Yeah, but then what would you build nights & weekends?

Here's another one: Spoon. Pretty much all their records have Grade A guitar tones.

[cminor9]

Originally Posted by theunrulychef

Yeah, but then what would you build nights & weekends?

Here's another one: Spoon. Pretty much all their records have Grade A guitar tones.

+1 on spoon.

I believe that just because you like a tone, doesn't mean you want to sound that way. Of all the people I mentioned, while I like their tone, I personally don't strive for that. Maybe certain bits and pieces, but you've gotta find your own voice.

[yunger]

jimi hendrix - bleeding heart at royal albert hall. something about that show was untouchable...acoustics, cranked amp, i don't know. gotta mention machine gun at the fillmore as well.

kenny burrell playing clean in midnight blue and girl talk. of course this guy could make any amp sound good.

zztop - blue jean blues

roy buchanan - almost everything but particularly five string blues.

these are the first that come to mind anyway.

[Robert M. Martinelli]

I just realized I forgot Eric Johnson's clean Strat sound on "Manhattan".

Cheers

Bob

[sportster4eva]

I'm going to mention a couple of my faves just for grins.
REM's Monster album.. I don't know why but I just love it.
James Gang's Rides Again album. The intro to "The Bomber" is just scary good.

[kleptocracy]

I may not be after the same kinds of sounds that a lot of you are. But there's a lot of tones I love that I'm not interested in recreating myself, and you guys have hit a ton of 'em here: Hendrix on Red House for sure, Dick Dale in general, Mark Knopfler in general, etc.

BUT...may favorite tone of all time is some seriously slick sludge courtesy of a little three piece called Floor:

YouTube - Floor-Scimitar

YouTube - Floor-Scimitar

Give that clip 30 seconds, and then realize that's all guitars. No bass. No studio wizardly. That's just two guitars. That tone slays me.

I'm not sure this qualifies as a "clean" sound, though it's surely not a hi-gain sound, but check out the guitar that comes in at 5:41 in this clip:

YouTube - Godspeed You! Black Emperor - Moya

YouTube - Godspeed You! Black Emperor - Moya

[Chuck H]

Wow... I'm STUNNED by all the entries. There's sooo much diversity.

Hasserl get's kudo's for choosing all live clips. If you can do it live...

Everything is killer in it's own way. Vive la differance to those outside the "box". But some entries I have to scrounge around for. I had hoped to keep this within the range of "air play" so EVERYONE could get the mental image... "Oh yeh, that IS a great tone"...

But at this point I'm loving all the entries. So if you have an obscure one, try to include a link so we can hear it without too much effort.

I'm not trying to set any rules or anything. I'm just trying to keep this thread interesting for all viewers so it doesn't die out. I'm sure anyone reading this wants more just like I do.

Chuck

[PremiumPlus]

Can I play twice?

Jeff Beck, Goodbye Pork Pie Hat.

I heard it this morning as I left for work and can't get the TONE out of my head. What a sound...

[anthillrich]

i want to add two more sounds.
Andy Summers tones are incredible. use any police album as a reference.

and then there's a sound from the 80's that i cant help but love. it's that real thin/percussive sounding clean strat/tele tone. ultra clean plinkity plinkity rhythm guitar sound. uh, think "Holiday" from Madonna. yes, a guilty pleasure. feel free to poke fun.

[Loogie]

Anything that comes out of Bill Frisell or Mark Knopfler.

[R.G.]

Originally Posted by Chuck H

Wow... I'm STUNNED by all the entries. There's sooo much diversity.
...
I'm just trying to keep this thread interesting for all viewers so it doesn't die out. I'm sure anyone reading this wants more just like I do.

(a) I'm not sure everyone wants more.
(b) Why are you stunned?

The perception of tone is much like, um, noses, I guess. Everybody has one (or more!) and they're all different. Just as importantly, what they think of someone else's doesn't have much to do with what a third party thinks of the same nose. Being stunned at the diversity seems ingenuous to me. Basically, every musical tone ever recorded *was* recorded because someone thought it was great tone at the time.

At a more academic level, it may well be impossible to ever share the perception of tone. Not only can there never be any disagreement about matters of taste, it may be impossible to ever know what someone else hears a tone as. For an example, read a bit on the paradoxes of musical pitch. Start here: Diana Deutsch's Audio Illusions : Musical Illusions and Paradoxes : Deutsch's Tritone Paradox.
When people can't agree on whether two notes are ascending or descending, it starts looking bleak for thinking they hear the same thing, doesn't it?

So IMHO the only purpose of prolonging a thread of "hey, list what you think is great tone" is prolonging the thread for some reason.

[Steve Conner]

Originally Posted by Loogie

Anything that comes out of Bill Frisell or Mark Knopfler.

Woot, another Bill Frisell fan

But yeah, what RG said. This isn't an "ultimate tone" thread, it's a "My favourite tone" thread, and the distinction is subtle but important. It's the kind of distinction that starts flamewars, if not world wars.

[theunrulychef]

Originally Posted by Steve Conner

It's the kind of distinction that starts flamewars, if not world wars.

[Chuck H]

Hey, Take it easy R.G. Who pissed in your Cheerios. I just posted supporting you on another thread too. And I'm now getting "ingenuous" back. Don't be a needle at the baloon party. Sure it's kinda bubble headed, but we're having a little fun.

And as for "stunned", it's true enough for many of the entries. It's fun for me to hear how each tone has specific properties that the players exploit. The marriage of the tone and the player creating something greater than the sum of it's parts and all. Makes me think as a builder and a player about how to approach the whole picture.

I'm sorry you don't want more. But why would you bother with an inflamitory post? It's something I have considered. Mabe you will too.

Steve, your right about the title not representing the thread. I'd change it if I could. But this isn't a really meaty or serious thread anyhow.

Peace

Chuck

[Steve Conner]

Oh well, in the spirit of the thing, I'll offer several tones that I think deserve to be called "ultimate" in one way or another.

James Hetfield's rhythm guitar on older Metallica stuff, before they cut their hair and started hanging out with Bob Rock and playing through Leslie speakers. It's not pretty or boutique, but for sheer brutality, I give it a cookie.

Eric Clapton on the Beano album. Bridge pickup on a Les Paul, tone knob all the way down, treble boost pedal, cranked JTM45, say no more.

Wes Montgomery on anything. He had a unique tone to start with because he used his thumb and fingers instead of a pick. I once heard a recording of his on a radio jazz show where he was playing live through some old broken-down amp that was distorting quite a lot. The result was possibly the fattest, greasiest jazz tone I've ever heard, that still stands in my mind as a benchmark for what I'd like to sound like myself. The radio DJ just thought it was "great in spite of the distortion."

[defaced]

This is one of those guitar tones you don't make an album out of unless you're a drone band, but for one song of a certain emotion, this is ace:

YouTube - SOUNDGARDEN 95 LIVE - 4th July - Stockholm

YouTube - SOUNDGARDEN 95 LIVE - 4th July - Stockholm

[R.G.]

Originally Posted by Chuck H

Hey, Take it easy R.G. Who pissed in your Cheerios. I just posted supporting you on another thread too. And I'm now getting "ingenuous" back. Don't be a needle at the baloon party. Sure it's kinda bubble headed, but we're having a little fun.

First off, let me apologize if it sounded like I was after you. I didn't mean to be. And I *do* get my cheerios pissed in regularly...

Peace, two.

[Steve Conner]

Yay, Soundgarden!

I used to be in a band that did 4th Of July as a cover, and I think the tone here is mostly in the tuning. IIRC, you drop the low E to D and then tune all the strings another whole tone down, so they're practically falling off the guitar. I used a .052 low E.

[Chuck H]

+1... But now we're talking about guitar tone and not amp tone. Not that it matters.

It's worth noting that SRV used twelve's slacked down a full step much of the time. This was a big part of his tone. I use a set of ten's with an eleven for the high E and tune to Eb. Guitar setup is a major part of tone. And just as importantly, feel. If the guitar "feels" right for the tone of the amp you can go beyond just executing the motions in a technical sense and begin expressing yourself. I'm also a proponant of using different gauges for alternate tunings. Most MFG's indicate the tension of their strings at pitch and this allows you to approximate and build a set that's just right for alternate and drop tunings.

IMHO

Chuck