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Reply With QuoteWell, I took the plunge and bought one, I'll let you guys know how it sounds when I get it. It's suppose to sound like a real vintage 30 celestion, we will see.
SLO.....
http://cgi.ebay.com/12-inch-VINTAGE-...QQcmdZViewItem
If these sound like the real deal then its a good deal but? If not? Hmmmm
Anyone know these folks?
SLO
Well, I took the plunge and bought one, I'll let you guys know how it sounds when I get it. It's suppose to sound like a real vintage 30 celestion, we will see.
SLO.....
can't beat the price. as it turns out, there are some of the rebuild shops that sell V30 clones that are pretty much the real deal -- they take a V30 recone kit and magnet, and mount them on a generic bracket. to me, that's a V30. IIRC orange county speaker repair does this sort of thing on eminence frames.
now matter how you slice it, your price is a good one. an eminence governor wholesales for $32 when you buy them by the container.
Hey Bob,
I should get myy V30 clone Monday so I can rate it. Looking at the folks who already bought from this guy they seem to like these speakers he's selling.
The story is that this fellow bought a bunch of OEM speakers from a manufacturer cheap and decided to Ebay them off but he also wantes to start a speaker building biz here in the USA and sell clones at a cheaper price than celestion. I wonder if he got these from Dave at Avatar? who knows....
here is the site,
http://warehousespeakers.com/phpBB2/index.php
I figure I can get an idea of the speaker sound even though its not broken in so maybe this will turn out to be one of those great deals. I sure hope so.
Anyway I wanted to post so if these do turnout to be a good deal you all can jump on this deal while he has the first batch. If not, no big deal.
Heck, I found these while looking for a replacement speaker for an amp I'm gonna sell to a friend. The amp has been without a speaker for a long while and I figured what the heck, i'll give it a shot. The speaker frame looks just like a celestion and the paper looks the same too.
SLO
Well I got the speaker in today and unboxed it and the speaker frame is exactly like the vintage 30 frame except in a grey finish instead of gold like the Celestion V30 has. The paper and cone look exactly like the real deal vintage 30 and the magnet looks exactly like the vintage 30 too. A real clone in build from the looks, its a heavy speaker.
Well how does it sound???
I paired it into a 2x12 open back SS Peavey renown cab as this amp will show what sounds good or not. I didn't get a chance to run my fender bassman head thru it yet.
I paired it with a real celestion vintage 30 that was put together in the UK and here is what I found. Trying both speakers thru the peavey SS 2x12 combo amp the speakers sounded almost Identical except the V clone had less hi's in it. The real deal celestion V30 has a loose paper movement as it was broken in so comparison isn't easy since I didn't get a chance to break in the new V30 clone but the clones mids and lows are so damn close to the real deal V30 its great, almost dead on. The real V30 has a slight bit of harsh hi endness I never cared for even though I do like its tone. The V30 clone has a smoother hi end. but still close to the hi's the real deal V30 has just less hi's.
Over all I need to break in the new clone but for the hour and a half I played thru it loud and soft was the most closest sounding V30 I have heard to date as I tried the eminence V30 clone and it never did sound much like a real V30 to me.
Is it a good deal for $21.00 I would say yes so far so good.
SLO
thanks for the update. it would be very interesting to know how the speaker sounds after some break-in, so be sure to keep us posted.
i also notice a little harshness in the high end of the V30. but then i've always been a fan of speakers that don't sound excessively sharp on top.
Hey Bob,
I'm going to try and do a breaking this coming week if the wife permits
The funny thing about this is that this speaker sounds darn good in the Peavey renown as where all the rest of the speakers I tried didn't sound all that good other than the real V-30 in the renown which sounded good but a bit flubby on the low end with the bass turned up. The clone didn't have that flub.
The V-30 clone feels real tight though, thats the one thing I wonder about as It seems a bit tighter than the others when you take both hands and try to move the paper back or forward. The real V-30 is a loose moving speaker when you use your hands to move the paper. I always try to be real careful when I do this.
I tried running a Peavey Bravo tube (EL84) 25 watt amp thru the clone last night at low volume and the bravo is a very bright sounding amp but sounded good with this clone speaker.
But the real test would be break it in and then crank my other amps thru it too. I did hit it hard yesterday with very hi volume from the PV renown and it held its own very well. One other thing I did notice was the clones magnet is a tad bit bigger than the real V-30 speaker, I didn't catch that til real late last night.
A few years back I went thru some eminence speakers from Avatar one was a greenback clone and the other was a V30 clone. Both of those speakers just did not seem to be very close to the real speakers they were suppose to be clones of but they did sound ok. I wound up selling them on Ebay as I wasn't real happy with them. I am more a fan of celestion, but in saying that even celestion doesn't always hit the mark of tone I like, the V-30 and the
G12M-70 seem to be more what I like. I may buy two more of these clones to install in the renown permanent after I do a break in if all goes well.
I mixed the clone 30 in the renown open back with another 2x12 fully enclosed cab last night and the clone 30 mixed well with the G12M-70s in that 2x12 cab. That was a suprise to me.
SLO
how heavy is the doping on the rim of the new speaker?
Hey Bob,
The doping looks about the same as the real V-30 so that is suprising that it feels stiffer.
It definitally moves when played and I don't hear any wierd oddities in the sound. I cranded it up again today for an hour while the wife was gone shopping so it seems to sound just like the real V-30. Hmmmm, maybe stiff from needing to be broke in.
I'm gonna keep beating it up this week to see what happens.
SLO
I drove down there to meet the guy as I live a couple hours away. I bought a bunch of them for some projects I have going on, so I hope they are as good as you say. I also tried few of the "Classic" version too - supposed to be brighter and like the 80w celestion.
The guy seems to be a really nice guy. He offered a money back guarantee if I discovered I didn't like them, so there was not that much to lose.
Thorny,
Yes David seems to be a cool guy to deal with. I just ordered more of these as I found that looking at the speaker frames at the rims they are actually real celestion frames, someone grinded the logos off smoothly but I still see the logo there faintly.
Thats why I bet these were painted with a grey crinkle paint. Paint looks good too. I just moved that V clone to a 1x12 open back cab and it sounded good in that too.
David said the paper on these are from the manufacturer that makes for celestion so if the paper and the frames are celestion then its a real celestion, I did comparisons again a little while ago with a friend that plays guitar and he said the real vintage 30 and the clone sound the same to him.
Go figure, I bet these won't last long as when the word gets out the prices will go up or he will run out of these and knowing celestion will probably try to stop him from selling any more, you know how big campanies can get, just look at how Gibson sues every one with a single cutaway guitar.
Let us know how your speakers sound when you get them in your projects.
I hope some of the folks here can get in on these cheap costing speakers as I feel the folks here at Ampage are all really cool people, even though they probably think I'm a little out there on my political views
SLO
How old are the original V30s?
I have eight UK-made Marshall/Celestion G12Vs...the Marshall-labelled version of the V30. Two of them are from 1987, four from 1999, and two from 2003.
The six later ones all have pretty stiff suspensions and (other than the frame code marking method) are all identical, cosmetically.
The two early ones have much looser suspensions and a lot less doping. They've always been looser, it's not from use (the four from 1999 have the most hours, by far).
So, it appears that sometime between the late '80s and the late '90s, Celestion changed the recipe. The older ones have noticeably more low-end, FWIW.
Well, I figured I would post back as I have been beating up the new speaker by playing on it loud plus running a stereo thru it afterwards and I have to say its sounding really good with no problems and the bass has deepened slightly more and the hi's are smooth. Midrange good.
I just got some new ones in today to put in a 4x12 cab I had and right off they sound just like the V-30's but need broken in. I played on them for over an hour cranking till my ears rang and they sound good comparing to the real V-30's.
I am really suprised that these are good speakers, I was expecting some junk speakers for the cheap cost but a really good deal so far. Who knows, maybe next week I'll find that I hate them but so far so good.
SLO
it looks like this fellow is selling them at minimal markup to encourage enough turnover for him to get his feet planted as a manufacturer. if the truth be told, $35 is about what you'd pay for a V30 if you ordered them by the shipping container from Celestion. its no surprise to me that some guy in KY can make the same speakers here at a cost that's comparable to the wholesale cost of speakers that get marked up after being shipped halfway around the world.
one place that he's making some extra money is on his shipping. he's charging twice what it really costs him to ship the speakers, and because it looks like what you or I would pay at retail, we don't blink at it. bear in mind that Avatar ships them from OR to Maine for only $8.
Even at the low prices he has, by the time he ships your speaker there's enough profit in them to keep the business alive. Now all he needs to do is expand his customer base, and implement some moderate price hikes once his name is out there. Realistically speaking, he needs a better name. Warehouse Speakers is a cheap sounding name, and that will work against him.
Hey Bob,
I have to agree to the name (warehouse speakers) sounding not so good.
I don't know if the guy gave the name that much thought but I think it may work against him and that's a shame too since the quality of speaker is really good. He seems to be a nice guy as I have emailed him several times about the speakers I have ordered and he is always email polite.
Of course Warehouse Tires seem to do well biz wise so who knows
Regarding the shipping cost, I emailed him and told him that Dave at Avatar ships for around $8.00 and asked if I could get as good or better shipping price. After I asked he did give me a much better shipping price. I think it was around $40.00 for 6 speakers to be shipped to me, KY to TX. This was 4 speakers for me and two speakers for someone else. That was a good price as these speakers are heavy. (23 pounds for two in a box).
I am one of those kind of people that always ask about cheaper shipping, even though some people will give a reduced price and some don't, asking never hurts
Overall I hope for him he does do well as it's nice to see an American succeed in business other than some foreigner coming from India or Pakistan or wherever raking in American Dollars to send to other countries. Not trying to sound rude to folks or offend anyone from other countries but its time WE Americans start to get our own thing going here and stop the our Dollars going out of the country.
SLO
I also bought one of these V30 clones from Warehouse Speakers. I put it into a 1x12 closed-back cab and I _really_ like it. I used to have a G12M from Celestion in that cab and I loved everything from the mids on up, but it lacked bass to my ears. Right out of the box, this V30 clone seems just right. The bass is there now and the upper midrange just shines.
I'd like to see this guy succeed too. His communications were prompt and pleasant. Shipping was quick and the speaker came double boxed. Nice guy - nice speaker - and the price is so low!
As for the name, well, I wouldn't have picked Warehouse Speakers either, but I doubt he'll have a problem if he keeps making such a good product for these prices. I would still love this speaker if he called his business SuckTone Speaker Garage. :-)
If you're looking for a quality, V30-ish speaker on the cheap - this is probably hard to beat.
Ed
Hey Ed,
These seem to be good speakers. I'ver broken mine in and they sound darn good, so good that I sold off all my vintage 30's and now just use these.
I'll bet this guy will run out after a while and you won't get the same speaker when he does. he will have new ones made that may not be the same. These have actual real celestion frames as well as the paper. Magnet looks just a tad bit bigger than the celestion vintage 30 but these seem smoother to my ears than a real vintage 30.
Let us know what you think after you break it in.
SLO...
i bought a pair of the vintage ones. $61 and some change. i'll let you know how my marshall and mesa like 'em.
to a 2x12 with my jcm800 and these vintage 30 clones. these are not broken in yet.
http://www.anniemac.info/sounds/vint...0%20clones.mp3
That's what I call "CRUNCHY!"Originally Posted by gtrboy
Sounds good. I'm loving my single V30 clone. Nice punch in the upper mids. A great bargain!
Ed
I can't tell diddly squat what the actual speaker sounds like from that noise. ha ha ha
got two coming on Monday...maybe as good as Mojo's BV30-V?...I REALLY like that in my Lion VII.
specs look similar.
I like the BV30V a lot too.
However, I ordered some of these inexpensive speakers too, especially after talking with David in emails and he adjusted the shipping price to a much better level for me.
I have a funny feeling they might be made by the same company that was making the MOJO BV speakers.... or maybe the same parts....I don't know that of course but I have bought, used and sold close to 100 of the MOJO BV series speakers and you'd think I should be able to tell something when I get mine.
its ted nugent from the damn yankees days... dont tread. too buzzy/bright?
Thanks for the tip. I just ordered me a couple.
It looks like he has his company label on them now.
Hey Bruce,
Please keep us updated on these speakers when you get them. I keep wondering what the real story is on these. They sound great and I wonder what company made these for for what amp before the guy selling on Ebay got them.
The metal frames on mine had celestion on them and then some one grinded the celestion name off. So I'm guessing they are celestion for the most part but the magnets are a slight bit bigger than the real V30.
On a side note I've broken mine in and they sound good so I'm happy with them. I've had lots of celestions in the past and these sound really good to my ears.
SLO
Just got 'em in and have 'em in-parallel on a 9vac filament transformer...probably bump up to 12vac in a couple of hours.
They have a removeable rubber gasket on the backside of the frame...pretty nice. However, the main gasket is quite thick.....gonna have to get another bolt about 1/8 - 1/4 longer for one of the t-nuts....apparently one is a bit too short (Avatar cabinet).
Don't sound as close to the BV30V as I had thought..They seem rather bright..but breakin should help a bit.
Just messin' with ya.
I have to listen to speaker with a pretty clean amp to tell what the speaker sounds like... with too much distortion it's just WAY too easy to mask the sound of an amp, speaker, tubes or even a guitar and pickups.
Brush some acetone on the speaker paper around the surround and down about 2 inches but don't get it on the dust cover over the voice coil.
A couple wet coats over a 5 min period should help loosen it up a bit faster.
will using the acetone make the surround-doping gummy/sticky?
Gotta pickup another RatShack answering-machine power-supply (120vac - 9/11/12vac) as mine gave up the ghost..... ;-)
Hey TD,
How long you running the 9VAC transformer on these for breakin?
I never tried that method but if it works sure beats trying to break em in the old way by just cranking the amp for hours and making the wife and neighbors mad...
SLO
a couple years now.....and I've let 'em run overnight before.
I use the formula on Ted Weber's site to figure what volatge to set it at....think the latest was that with 2 of the 8ohm/60-watt speakers in parallel the setting should be just a bit more than 12.5vac.
Seems to work ok....until the transformer gives-up!
picked-up another "at&t answering machine" tranformer at RatShack....120vac to 9. 10, 12, and 13vac @ 800ma.
$17.
I spliced the wire to some zipcord with a 1/4" jack on the end. Back in business.
Hey TD,
what would two 16 ohm speakers in parallel would be what voltage?
Thanks
SLO
From Ted Weber's page (http://www.webervst.com/sptalk.html):
From: Jeff Brinson
I recently purchased a replacement 12" speaker for my amp. I like its tone, but it seems a little shy on the low end and a little tight overall. Is there anything I can do to loosen it up or improve its tone? I've heard of people beating on the magnet and other methods, but I'd like to know what you suggest.
Jeff, most speakers are a little tight when new due to the stiffness of the cone surround and spider. After several hours of playing at high levels, they begin to loosen up and have more overall body and sound projection. I've heard of beating on the magnet also, and quite frankly, I'm not sure what benefit it is supposed to yield. An AlNiCo magnet is a metal alloy, so it conducts electricity. This means that physical shock will cause the magnet to induce an electrical current into itself, which will in turn generate a magnetic field, and that field, if strong enough, can partially demagnetize the magnet. A ceramic magnet, on the other hand, is essentially non conductive and therefore has a very high resistance. That's the reason powdered ferrites are used in high frequency coils and transformers, so currents won't be induced in the core and adversely affect the transformer action at high frequencies. Ceramic speaker magnets are also made of powdered ferrites. If a person was purposely trying to decrease some of the magnetism of a speaker, the intent is probably to lower the self damping of the speaker itself thereby allowing the speaker resonance to add some low end. In my opinion, that's a poor method of increasing the low end.
OK, on to 'breaking in' a speaker. If you really want to speed up the breaking in period, the easist method is to connect the speaker to a filament transformer. Having said that, let's look at the precautions you need to take. Since you will be driving the speaker with a steady state signal, you don't want to drive it at its rated power or it will burn up the voice coil. 1/3 power rating is a safe figure to use. So, let's say you have a 50 watt speaker and it is 8 Ohm. 1/3 power is about 17 watts, and at 8 Ohm, that works out to be around 11.5 volts. Using a 12.6 volt transformer will put 20 watts into the speaker. I wouldn't have a problem with that in our products, but just to be safe, you might want to go with a 6.3 volt filament voltage, which will put about 5 watts into your speaker. Another option is to use a variac into the primary side of the 12.6 volt filament transformer and dial in the voltage you want on the secondary. That way, you can dial in the 11.5 volts we originally calculated at the 1/3 power level. I'd also suggest performing the operation in a garage or closet, because listening to the loud 60hz hum from the speaker will grate on your nerves very quickly. Also, if you leave the speaker out of the cabinet, the rear radiation of the speaker will cancel alot of the front radiation and reduce the noise. You need to lay the speaker face up though, so the cone can move as much as possible since the whole idea of this operation is to loosen up the cone and spider. Laying the speaker face down would trap air between the cone and the surface of the table and restrict cone movement. You're going to be surprised how much the cone moves and how loud the speaker is, even at 1/3 power.
Here's the math for determining the correct voltage to use in case you have a different wattage and impedance rating than our example above:
1. Take the power rating of the speaker and divide it by 3.
2. Take that number and multiply it by the speaker's Ohm rating (4, 8, or 16)
3. Use your calculator to find the square root of that number.
4. The result is the voltage you need to use to drive the speaker at 1/3 its rated power.
2 16-ohm/60-watt speakers in parallel at 1/3 power is 17.88854VAC
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