Possible purchase of fender Bassman, advice needed

[tonequester]

tonequester here.


I just got a tip from "a friend of a friend". I can buy a Fender Bassman. It's a "blonde" and is said to be "circa '58-'60". It's in fine working order. My brother has heard it played, and played hard, and says it sounds great. He also knows the owner, and says he's an honest guy. The owner wants $600.00 for it. It needs cosmetic work only. I don't have a model number yet, or an exact date of manufacture, so I realize that I may not have squat, as far as truly setting a value on it. However I thought I'd ask here. It's been so long since I had an amp like this that they weren't called "vintage" back then. I once let a Prrinceton w/o reverb, with tremelo, get away from me to my eternal regret. It was a fairly rare model, black -faced with white knobs. Any advice besides get more info ? Any replies very welcome ! tonequester.

[Tom Phillips]

Your request brings many questions to mind.

The Fender blonde era was ~1962 to 1964. $600 could be a really fair price or no deal at all.
“Needs cosmetic work” is not very specific. In addition it’s not often that a 50 year old amp does not need electronic work (or will soon) even if it’s reported to sound great at the moment. That doesn’t usually bother people who hang around here as long as the major parts are original and no destructive mods have been installed. Is this a whole piggy back amp & speaker cab or just a Fender head used with some other speaker cab?

The more important question is “What are your needs and desires for an amp.”
Are you planning on gigging where you need a 40-50 W amp or do you want something smaller that you can enjoy inside your room. Do you want an amp with cool tremolo? Maybe with reverb.

What are your additional thoughts?

Tom

[Chuck H]

What he said.

[tonequester]

tonequester here.


Thanks for the quick reply Tom. I now know this much more than before. The cosmetic work needed is "only" the blonde Tolex. there is no structural damage beyond that. It is all original down to the speakers. It has not been serviced during the dozen or so years that the owner has had it, so it needs a cap job for sure. It is the full, original piggy back.
As for my needs, I was actually thinking of it being a possible fixer-upper and re-sale. However, I know that the Bassman is not only sought after and collectible, and they are not getting any easier to find. It could be just what i'm looking for, although I don't really think so. It's just too powerful for my needs. I owned a 40W. Fender at one time and I was never able to turn it up past35-40% of max.,without drowning out my compatriots. The owner is not available at the moment. When I'll be able to check it out sans hear-say. Any replies are appreciated.
Have a great day Tom.

[tonequester]

tonequester here

Thanks for the Ditto Chuck. If you get time, check out my previous reply to Tom. A little more info. I'd have to dip heavily into savings to get it, but if it's worth $600.00 as is,
maybe it would be worth it to do a cap job and new tolex, take my time and try to make a few bucks on it. Time I have. Don't want to get burnt though ! tonequester.

[Chuck H]

If it's a mostly original blonde piggyback Bassman, head and cabinet, original speakers, then $600 + tolex + cap job, possibly some tubes and maybe a couple of other smaller and easier things, is a great price. Should be easy to make a profit on it. Or, if you decide you love it, just fix and play it ugly

The thing is... We trust that the owner is an honest guy. So you should be able to believe what he tells you about the amps condition. But the owner didn't know the correct year for that model or even how to find out appearently. So you can only trust whatever he says to be what he believes to be accurate information. You can't trust the actual information. As in, Does it actually have original transformers and speakers? We only know that the current owner believes it does. We also know the current owner has probably never checked this out for themselves and may not know the entire history of the amp. In light of this, I wouldn't buy sight unseen.

JM2C

[tonequester]

tonequester here.

Hey Chuck ! Yea, I know that my little brother is pretty tight with him, and says that he's not the technical type. They played together(brother on bass) for a number of years, so I'm pretty sure of his character, but I wouldn't give a hundred for it without opening it up for inspection. Like you said, a leaky transformer, signs of arcing, heavy rust in the wrong places. There's a lot of unknowns until I can check it out. At least he seems not to be in a big hurry to sell, and that itself may be a good sign that he's not trying to dump a piece of you know what on someone. My brother is going to give me a holler when he's off holiday. Then I'll find out the scoop/poop. Your right about one thing for sure. IF, I get it and decide to keep it,
I'll play it a long time "ugly" before tackling a Tolex re-cover. I've never done one of those, but I've read some about it and it don't look easy. Tolex ain't cheap either. Thanks for the opinion
as I'm just not up on the vintage price thing. I realize there are a lot of variables. I was just curious if $600.00 was anywhere near the ball-park, for what I knew about it. I'll keep you "in the loop" when I get to see/hear it. Have a good one up there in the" Great Pacific Nor' West" ! tonequester.

[Chuck H]

Right now, on Ebay, there is one with "possibly" non original tolex and absolutely non original speakers going for $1800. And there is a mint original with restored electronics going for $6000. The one your looking at would be somewhere in between with a little work and expense. A search revealed a few originals in good condition and all stock except for standard upgrades (filter caps, tubes, three prong power cord). The cheapest was $2200. Which is silly low. I expect that the amp should be worth about $2500 in semi restored condition. That is, not perfect, but the bad stuff is restored and the amp plays like new.

[big_teee]

You guys are out of my price range, might could scrap up the $600.
If I put the wife working the street.
I know what I would do, and most of us would just build one from Mojo Parts.
T

[Chuck H]

Well... JMHO but the collectible market stinks right now. Otherwise you couldn't get ANY blonde Bassman in ANY condition for under a grand. Even though it could be fixed up and sold for about $2500, it could take a while and some additional ad expense to do it. Add the labor effort, the trouble to unload it, the parts expense and original purchase and it becomes a hobby rather than an income. The most enticing thing about isn't the $$$, but rather that it's a cool amp. Just need to decide if there's time to fuss around with it on that basis alone.?.

[tonequester]

tonequester here.

Greetings Chuck ! Thanks for the update on price/valeu of the amp. Well, it looks like there is room for one to make a little cash on the thing. Looks like the only way to be certain is to open it up and really check it out. however, I am thinking nthat I better do some Googling to see if I can find out a lot more details than Wiki gave me. I better be able to verify
model #, not to mention original speakers, transformers, etc. I don't have to worry whether the Tolex is original, just how much is left of it. I'm sure that I can find a vintage amp/Fender amp site to give me more than I have right now. One things pretty sure. Unless something is not as I've been told, $600.00 doesn't seem out of line. My only "wonderment" is that the owner has surely checked e-bay as you did. Something tells me that I should procede with all due caution. I,ve already got 3 major projects in the works, not to mention that I'm not in
the financial shape to just shell out $600.00 "willy-nilly". I appreciate you taking the time to check around as you did ! I've got a doctor's app. today, so the day is pretty well shot anyway.
I'll do some research on the "particulars" to be on the lookout for. It won;'t hurt for me to inquire as to value at my favorite pawn shop(I know I'll get a low bid there !) and talk to my man Jeff at Spencer's Music Room. He runs my local dealer/music store. He,s probably up on the subject, and he's honest as the day is long. I need to check and see WHEN I'm going to get my
new HT-1R. I'm getting of practicing with the p.o.s. practice amp that I've been forced to use since the last Blackstar turhed out to have a non-functional reverb. Hey, you have a great one buddy ! tonequester.

[Tom Phillips]

Consider the following in addition to all that has already been discussed.
Many buyers of vintage amps would rather acquire an amp that is all original than one that has been "restored." This is because they would rather make their own decisions about the work that will be done and have it done by someone they trust and who will be available for follow-up work. The exceptions, IMO, are repairs that need to be done to prove that the amp basically functions. Original beat up tolex is preferred over a re-cover by an inexperienced person. A good re-cover job is a lot more work than covering a new build. I would recommend lots of practice on less valuable amps before attempting a re-tolex of something like a blonde bassman. It's not as difficult as a tweed job but little mistakes or just tiny variations in technique really stand out to an experienced buyer. You don't want to put in hard work that lowers the resale value of the amp if resale for profit is your goal.

You are wise to wonder why the asking price seems to be so far below market value. It will be interesting to see what you find out.

Good luck,
Tom

[tonequester]

tonequester here.

Greetings, and thanks Tom for the inpout on the Bassman. your advice is well taken, because I don't want to be well taken. When I find out the true scoop on it I'll be sure to let everybody know. I'm trying to NOT think about it for now,because the more I do, the more I get a bad feeling about it. I'm not the type who runs across great deals. I usually find a "pig in a poke". Have a great day ! tonequester.

[J M Fahey]

Well, don't get "a bad feeling" either, just that it may not be the gold mine you originally imagined.

[tonequester]

tonequester here.


Jm. I wouldn't know a gold mine if one fell from the sky with gold mine stamped all over it. I did know enough about vintage amps to realize there might be a chance to
make 1or2 hundred of it, all conditions being right, and me being able to do some work on it. I also have kept in mind that it could turn out to be a keeper. I really had no idea that prices could be so high, or fluctuate so greatly. I don't have a bad feeling because at least on something which at first seems to be a good deal, I have usually found it to be no-where the "deal' that I first imagined. I hate to admit it but I expect the won't on such "deals" so I won't be sick when the truth finally kicks my A--. If it turns out to be worth the $600.00, all things considered, it will still be a coin toss for me. I'm the guy who walks into the pawn shop to b not the guy who gets fleeced on my vintage "thingamabob", not the guy who carries his newly puechased "thingamajig" to double his money with a phone call. The biggest deals that I find are usually a Walmart price roll-back(and you can't trust them). However, for you. I'll take
$800.00 for tha amp, sight unseen. Seriously.....I meant this in all humor. When you said "the gold mine you originally imagined", I got the first good laugh of the day. I live on
S.S.D.I which is $600.00 a year above the" poverty lineIf ". I quit imagining gold-mines years ago, and i can tell you that i haven't stumbled on to one yet. If you happen to find one,
give me a holler. Argentina isn't that far a walk, and i've got a good shovel. Good luck in finding YOUR personal gold-mine ! tonequester.
,

[J M Fahey]

Glad I could drive away from that gloomy feeling you were getting into
As of gold mines and Argentina, believe it or not there is a *huge* new one just discovered, but it's being heavily resisted because it will pay almost no royalties (they already bribed our Lady President) but much worse they will contaminate with Cyanide, Mercury and Arsenic our drinking water reserves.
Cancer has just increased 800% near the mine.

[Chuck H]

As of gold mines and Argentina, believe it or not there is a *huge* new one just discovered, but it's being heavily resisted because it will pay almost no royalties (they already bribed our Lady President) but much worse they will contaminate with Cyanide, Mercury and Arsenic our drinking water reserves.
Cancer has just increased 800% near the mine.

I'm embarrassed sometimes to fit the stereotype of the "ugly American". In my case it's in the form of not concearning myself with international events. In keeping with said stereotype, my head is always in whatever is right in front of me. Which usually seems to be obstacle enough to extract a life from. But when I hear about things like this it always makes me think that the proverbial "someone" shouldn't have let it happen or should be doing something about it. Then I start to feel shame for not having the insight to empower myself to change at least some of the things I don't like. That's a true shame and tragedy.

EDIT: How many people have to pay for that gold just so other privileged and safe people may profit from it or have something shiney and pretty. I feel a little sick.

[tonequester]

tonequester here.

Grettings JM. I didn't mean to bring you down. It seems that you have enough to do contend with in Argentina. My problem is that I contiue to tune into the news, and they
don't have such a good reputation either. Years ago miners withstood the fear of cave-ins and exposions in order to make what they needed to pay the "company store". Now it seems they can add cancer and probably many more detrimental health effects as well. Some things don';t change at the borders. The "haves" get more and the "have nots", if lucky, stay right where they were. I try to help out where I can, but I admit that whatever I do seems a spit in the bucket. Things like what you reported about the gold mine do have a possitive effect on me in that
they force me to count my blessings, which are more than I deserve. I hope that this situation somehow improves in your homeland, adopted or not. In any case, and for what it's worth,
I wish you all the best ! tonequester.

[J M Fahey]

Thanks a lot.
As of the "ugly American" stereotype, feel free to relax.
The general perception (outside USA) is that 98% of USA population is made out of congenial, cool, open hearted, even "country people" minded guys , which are not only not responsible for what the Government (and Banks/Corporations) do, but even aren't aware of it, being fed tons of cr*p from the Media.
And yes, that ruling 2% is not only perceived as responsible for a lot of bad things, but also of holding you hostage, through devious means.
Oh well, let's at least try to survive reasonably well within our small niches.

[tonequester]

tonequester here.


Hey JM. I bitch a lot, but that's about all I can do outside of a little charity work. When you are on disability, you get especially jaded because you begin to
feel the empathy that you should have when you made good money and have good benefits(just talking about me here). I still vote because my Grand Pa told me that if you don't vote you don't have the right to bitch. He's been gone since '77. I wonder how he'd feel nowadays, when so many admit to voting for the lesser of two evils, or voting
AGAINST somebody instead of voting for somebody. I'm just happy to have what I have, although I always live with the apprehension that "they" will take it away. Believe me when I say that there are many in Washington that would love to cut out my income while giving the upper 2% another tax break. I was born here and here I'll die.
I won't go easily though. I may be the first person to crawl from Kansas to Washington D.C. with a sign on my a-- saying"all tapped out". Aaaaa ! I'm not fooling anybody.
I wouldn't make a good martyr, and I couldn't get close enough to anybody that mattered without looking like I'd been with Bonny and Clyde in that '32 Ford V-8.
I kind of admire km6xz for his leaving for St. Petersburg. However, it's still hard to believe that anywhere in Russia could be so much better. As for the "Ugly American" part,
I'll have you know that i haven't cracked a mirror...........yet. Have a good one, and if you ever need a "shoulder to bitch on"......tonequester.

[J M Fahey]

Thanks, you're welcome.