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Thread: Having some trouble finding components.

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    Smile Having some trouble finding components.

    tonequester here.

    I have been trying to find a source for a 50W. X 30 Ohm power resistor. Does anybody know of a good source. I felt sure that either Digi-Key, or Mouser would be a sure thing, but they have a funky search engine you must use. All "fields" apparently have to be filled in for it to get results. You have to provide manufacturer,
    temperature co-efficient, etc., and I played with it for quite sometime with no luck. I Googled the item, and didn't fair much better. The closest I came was a 100W. with adjustable tap, which would work but it's over-kill for my purpose. I guess I'm going to have to buy the Mouser paper catalogue. I even tried Radio Shack, but no results there either. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks for any replies. tonequester.

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    "In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is."
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    Juan Manuel Fahey

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    tonequester here.


    Greetings JoeM, and thanks so much. What service ! You evidently have that Mouser search engine down pat. I just knew that they would carry the needed resistor,
    but my search abilities are greatly lacking. I'm not only new here, but new to computing in general. My kids say I need to refine my searches. I guess I'm just not refined enough.
    I really appreciate your guidance here. I'm spending more time looking up parts than building projects. Thanks again, and have a great day ! tonequester.

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    tonequester rere.


    Thanks once again JM. I'll certainly check your lead out. Looks like there is a better way to find what one wants at Mouser than the method I tried. I used to get their catalogue by mail for free. I believe I'll go ahead and pay for one. It will be worth the time spent Googling, as Goggling is obviously NOT my forte. Thanks much for the help !
    tonequester.

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    Most of the time, Mouser's online search will get you what you want, but sometimes there's just no substitute for a paper catalog.

    I was searching for a plastic enclosure the other day, online, for a project I'm building, and wasn't able to find something suitable, so I picked up the catalog and found what I wanted in less than 2 minutes. The biggest problem, online, is that different manufacturers have different ideas of what the specs should be called. For example, one manufacturer uses Length, Width and Height, while another uses Height, Width and Depth. Some use only metric units, some use only English, and there are separate columns for all of these in the search feature. It can get very frustrating. Then there are the times you search, and find the perfect part in 10 seconds!

    I say start online, and back it up with a catalog, if necessary.

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    Tonequester here.


    Greetings bkahuna ! It's good to "make your aquaintance" on the forum. I'm glad(not at your expense) that somebody else, at times has trouble with those specialized
    "search engines" besides me. I know that in the old days, with the hugh Mouser catalogue I was always able to find what I needed in just a couple of minutes, plus I just liked browsing it.
    I got many a good idea from the old caalogue. now I've come to dread the on-line version. It seems that I am typically looking for some odd-ball item that none of the smaller electronics
    dealers stock. I'm going to order the catalogue. Another person replied to a similar post that I made a while back, and he claims that if you make "regular" orders, Mouser continues to send you catalogues for free. Thanks for the opportunity to "meet" you, and for your take on this issue. This is what being "old school" gets one now-a-days. I have to admit I long for the days of free catalogues. I used to send off for them constantly : Mouser, Digi-Key, Edmund Scientific, Even the old Johnson catalogue with the "x-ray glasses" and such. Kids today don't realize what they are missing. I never in my youth would have had 3-4 hours in any given day to play video games. If I wasn't trying to build something, I was tearing something up to figure it out. You have a great day my friend ! tonequester.

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    Hi tonequester,

    Well, I do have some experience with Mouser, back when their paper catalogs were only about a 1/2 inch thick. The online search gives so many options that it can be somewhat intimidating, and they carry such huge parts inventory.
    "In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is."
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    tonequester here.


    Greetings JoeM. I have what I think is good news concerning the Mouser paper catalogue. It appears that they are again offering it free of charge. I just registered with them
    in order to get one(they even give you the choice of "one time only" and continuing subscription) You just go to their website and click on "catalogue" at the top, it gives you the option for a printed catalogue. If you"re like me, it's a good "read" even if you don't order all that much from them. Thanks for your help, tonequester.

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    Supporting Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    When I first started ordering with Mouser thier catalog was about as thick as a magazine. Now it's the size of a metro area phonebook! The sent me a new catalog every three mo's for a couple of years before I put the kabosh on it. For all the catalogs they sent I could have bricked a walkway or possibly made a tidy living recycling paper! Anyhoo... You don't really need a new catalog as often as they send them. I order maybe US $200 a year from them. Four three and a half inch thick brochures seems excessive. And I just couldn't ignore it in good concience.

    I do use the paper catalog. But now I order a new one when the old one I have seems sadly out of date. Otherwise I use the online search engine. It does take some getting use to. But it's a small price for the life of half a dozen trees! The online search engine is (obviously) harder to negotiate than the paper catalog. But, even at it's extreme size, the paper catalog doesn't list all of their 'in stock' inventory. It's definitely worth getting to know the search engine at Mouser.

    The aluminum housed (built into an aluminum heat sink) resistors are a really good value. They are "wire wound". If you go to any search engine and plug in "mouser" the link will offer a "passive components" option for site access. Then select "resistors". Then select "wirewound resistors". Then choose "50 watts" and "stocked" on the filters. A few different options for the chassis mount type, aluminum housed resistors will be in the first ten selections.

    Just take a little time and get to know Mouser's search and filter engine. And get "a" paper catalog. You can find almost anything, component wise, at Mouser. Oh... And they have a new flat shipping rate. It was something like $10.50. But it just reduced to seven dollars and change. Nice. I always find myself placing a small order with them at the end of a project. Saving three bucks may seem like small taters. But when the order is less than the shipping it gets right under my skin. So their effors to curb this are appreciated.
    Last edited by Chuck H; 07-29-2012 at 08:57 AM.
    "The man is an incompetent waste of human flesh. He should donate his organs now to someone who might actually make good use of them." The Dude re: maybe I shouldn't say, but his name rhymes with Trump

    "...less ear-friendly but handy for jazz." Leo_Gnardo

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    gottonequester here.

    G'day Chuck ! Thanks for the advice on the Mouser search engine. I do not intend to give up on it. It's the wave of the present, and future. I did order the paper catalogue
    when I found out that they weren't $8.00, as I had been told. you've got a good point on the trees as well. It's not that I don't think that the paper catalogue is worth the money, I do.
    I just haven't done much in the last couple of years. I had been itching to do a project before joining the forum. Now, the itch is terminal. I had forgotten how much I enjoy the whole thing.
    I've never had the opportunity to even "talk" electronics but rarely. Now, the info and opinions are bombarding me so fast that I have to print what seems to be the really applicable stuff.
    It allows me to get comfortable and try to thoroughly understand what I can, and take notes so I can question that which Google or my books fail to explain adequately. Once again, thanks for your timely reply. The advice is always welcome. Sincerely, tonequester. Quote : "If thou wilt incline thy ear, thou shalt receive instruction : and if thou love to hear, thou shalt be wise". Ecclesiasticus 6 : 34 (I'm a Hopeing.)

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    Senior Member Enzo's Avatar
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    TQ, the search parameters don't have to be all selected, they are just there to help filter the results. You can select just 50 watts, and instead of thousands of entries you might now see only hundreds. Click apply filters than you can research with some other thing, like the resistance or mounting style. You need not use all of them.

    The online search is great for finding something you know, like a 50 watt 30 ohm resistor in aluminum. But the paper calatlog is best for learnig the sorts of things they even have. Many times I spot something I never knew was even manufactured. And the other advantage of the paper thing is the pictures. If I need a 24v SPDT relay, I can find many, but if I am replacing one on a circuit board, I need to shuffle through the pages to find one that looks the same, at least enough to make it fit the same hole pattern.

    Here is a sample search at Mouser. NUmber in parens is the amount of entries that result.

    Search "30 ohm 50w" And a list of categories appears. CLick on resistors (375)

    ANother list of categories. Click on the physical form you want, Either wirewould or chassis mount. I'll chose chassis mount, those are the ones with mounting holes as opped to just wire leads. Note that probably most of the wirewound 50 watt resistors are also chassis mount, thus the similarity in numbers. So click chassis mount (238)

    Woops, another short list. Don;t know what planar ones are so click on wirewound (see we got to wirewound anyway)
    And now finally a bunch of sorting parameters. and 232 matches or entries.

    At this point I start checking the STOCKED box for each step. No point cluttering the results with things they don;t have. Check the box. Note the 232 matches changes to 118. I always click on the eneable smart filtering box, but you don;t have to.

    Now I can select several things or one at a time. I don;t care what brand, so I ignore that. So next item is resistance. Scroll that down to 30 ohms. Click 30 ohms. Now the thing goes from 118 matches to only 10. I click APPLY FILTERS, and that 10 entry list is what is left.

    Those 10 are easy enough to look through, but let us continue. From the power column, click 50 watts. (we could have clicked 50 watts at the same time we did 30 ohms) and apply filter. That leaves 7 choices.

    At this point you can probably just select one. The remaining parameteres may or may not be useful, so ignore them if not. SO consider what the use will be. I suspect the 5% is fine, but if 1% really matters, then select that. I leave it out becaue 5% is good enough in my view. I can't imagine temperature coefficient matters to you so ignore it, same with "series", and even the temperature range is pointless. -55 degree to 200 degrees is way beyond anything our equipment faces. Dimensions? If you have a space issue and need to fit within an area, then pick one, otherwise ignore dimensions.

    SO at this point I'll just stop selecting and look at the 7 entries they show. They range from $2.80 to $17. I'd pick by price, $2.80 or $3.26 for the Welwyn or Arcol. A couple are $9, but looking closely we see those are non-inductively wound. UNless you need that specifically, why pay extra for it? Eliminate those in your mind, and the $17 one too. That leaves a couple or Dale choices at $5.

    That took longer to write than to do.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    tonequester here.


    Thanks for your time Enzo. You gave me an excellent explanation of that search engine. It never occured to me that I should try just one parameter at a time. once again
    me-thinks common sense alluded me. I've printed this off so I can refer to it until the search comes naturally. I have ordered a paper catalogue, and mainly for the reasons that you mentioned. I always found it a "good read' , and several of my past projects began with some time spent looking through the catalogue without a project in mind. I don't know how Mouser stacks up on price these days, but I have found that if you can't find what you need there, you are going to probably be in for quite a search. Sorry foryou having to write so prodigiously, but I am very appreciative that you did. I hope you have a a peaceful, and happy day from here on out. tonequester.

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    Senior Member Enzo's Avatar
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    Mouser prices are competitive. You may find a lower price on a specific item somewhere else, but as a general shopping place it is fine, it is my primary go-to.

    I make up a shopping list on a legal pad. I then make columns of prices across each line. I usually list Mouser first. If it is a large order I also check at Digikey and Allied. If I split an order between two suppliers, I keep in mind I will then pay two shipping bills, so any price savings on something have to cover the second shipping or there is no point. Also, not all vendors have all the parts, or one may be out of something I need.


    Some things are industry specific, like 500v caps, tube sockets, reverb pans, so I use different suppliers for those.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    tonequester hear.


    Hey Enzo ! Thanks for the tips. I haven't yet found everything I needed, but I'm going with Mouser on everything I can. I like your shopping list idea. I think that I'll be able to get everything except the big heat-sink there. It's almost the cost of the kit, but I don't have much choice on that item. I think when all is said and done, I'll have no more than $150.00 in it, and that isn't bad for anything 50-100W. Everone seems to regard Velleman pretty highly . I should have replaced all circuitry on my guitar by next week, so I'll be ready to start ordering then. Thanks again for your advice, on ordering parts, and using the Mouser search engine. Hhave a great day. tonequester.

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    Senior Member Enzo's Avatar
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    Without me looking back, I can;t recall what heat sink you needed. But "large" reminds me, I often strip out old stereo receivers for fun and save some parts. I usually save the heat sinks. So one source of "large" heat sinks is old dead stereo receivers you can find for free. Other fun parts on them are the powr cord, sometimes the power transformer is useful. Knobs, feet, screws...
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    heat-sink

    tonequester here.



    Greetings Enzo. Your suggestion to check for salvage concerning the heat-sink that I need is one that I'll give a try. I have a large family and might find something useful among them, even if a power cord is all I find, that is something that I need as well. The heat -sink is the largest that I've seen, other than on the
    440V. three phase, printing presses that I used to watch being serviced. It runs a little over $30.00, pre-drilled. I have a brother who was a welder/machinist
    before he became a postman. He still maintains some work on the side, and I might have an out there. I just don't know how important/critical design is. The correct heat-sink just looks like a large rectangular block, with fins. If I remember correctly, the shipping weight was around .7 lbs. It really took me by surprise because I had a Sansui
    amplifier years ago that was a 100 Watter, and I had to replace a power transistor in it. I remember the heat-sinking on it, and it was a small, black, finned piece no larger than an inch square and weighing not an ounce in weight. However, I also remember that the tech who advised me on troubleshooting it and fixing the problem, told me that
    Sansui's were notorious for bad heat-sinking, leading to power transistor failure(circa 1980). After I replaced the blown power transistor, I put larger heat-sinks on both anyway. They weren't anywhere close to the size of the one I need for the kit. Anyway, I'm going to check everywhere I can think of for salvage, before I buy
    that hunk of aluminum. If I can locate the right size of aluminum block, I'm pretty sure that my brother could approximate it, if approximation is acceptable in this case.
    I guess that this is actually "engineering" territory if one needs to be precise. In all honesty, I don't know if forced ventilation could equal what that sink must do.
    Thanks for reminding me of the value of salvaging. With the size of my family alone, I should always check with them. It wasn't that long ago that my brother the "metalworker", gave me an old VCR, Which yielded easily over $50.00 worth of odd parts(including knobs and power cord). Unless I get really lucky here, I'll probably be forced to buy the correct sink. Thanks for your time and advice Enzo. I really appreciate it. I seem to have the right kit now, and an idea about how I can make it work as intended. I sure don't want to cause a disaster by going "cheap" on the wrong thing. Have a great day my friend ! tonequester.

  18. #18
    Supporting Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enzo View Post
    Other fun parts on them are the powr cord, sometimes the power transformer is useful. Knobs, feet, screws...
    +++
    Sometimes odd value pots. sometimes the cabinet can be retrofitted with another front panel and used for a project (if you tinker). If you make your own inductors, many have a big ferrite rod in them. Old ball end toggle switches look especially cool on projects. VU meters are expensive and worth saving. Even if you just sell them on Ebay. Sometimes there are really cool things inside like a 12" terminal strip or a headphone amp on it's own little board. Always worth breaking them open.
    "The man is an incompetent waste of human flesh. He should donate his organs now to someone who might actually make good use of them." The Dude re: maybe I shouldn't say, but his name rhymes with Trump

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    tonequester here.

    Greetings Chuck ! I'm definitely in "salvage mode" Chuck. I'm getting the word out to all family and friends for starters. I could kick my own butt for all of the things I've
    let get away during my last move. Most of my family are "rat-packs" who never throw away anything. A month ago one of my brothers brought me an old VCR because he knows my "scrapping ways". I got a good power cord, a working motor, and I de-soldered two circuit boards mainly for the large electrolytics(haven't checked them out yet), and even some belts.
    I also found an old auto stereo cassette which I haven't dug into yet. My "junk" pile is only 1/10th the size it used to be, but that's exactly how I got it all. I had a garage sale when I moved, in 2005, and actually made some serious cash from some of the things that I had. It came in handy with the move, but I sure wish I had it back now. Anyway, I'm on the "make"
    now ! Hey, since I'm making this reply, I hope that you won't mind a "dumb' question. Today, I had the first opportunity to take my HT-1R outside and give it a thorough "blasting'. I have had several 2 channel amps in my time, including a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe(which I still have access to) and they all seemed to have close to the same max., volume on the clean channel
    as on the high gain channel. My first amp(Princeton,circa 1960) did not, but I know that was a different type of two channel set up. I found out today that the Ht-1R only has about half of the max.,volume on the clean channel as the high gain channel. What are your thoughts on this. The "Hot Rod" is a 40W, if I remember correctly, and it screams on both channels, but I have never noticed that it is any louder, maxed out, on the high gain channel. Am I "hearing things", or is this common to some amps. The head engineer at Blackstar, by e-mail(I asked a few questions), told me that the amp should be able to "overdrive" the "power tube"(12au7) at full volume, on the clean channel. My attempt was a "no go". My dealer is a good guy,
    but would probably S--- if I were to call him again about this amp. I've always refrained from "cranking one up" in the store as it's a very small store. Perhaps I should re-think that.
    Any of your thoughts would be of great interest to me, and thanks for the reminder about "hidden treasure". I finally have the room for another BIG pile ! tonequester.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Enzo's Avatar
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    A lot of those row of LED VU meters are on one board, including the chips. Four wires: power ground left right.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    tonequester here.

    Hey Enzo, thanks for the tip on the LED VU meters, and the wiring. One thing that I have never give much thought to salvaging are VU meters. I don't know why because
    I knew they weren't cheap. I will be sure to keep any of these I run onto at high priority for future use, as well as the dollar value. Thanks for another good tip. I'm collecting enough of these that I've had to start a bigger notebook ! I knew that new out-building would be good for something besides the lawn-mower ! Have a great day ! tonequester.

  22. #22
    Supporting Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    Tube amps have the virtue of actually sounding good when overdriven without much design consideration. This is for many reasons that have been discussed here ad infinitem. But what it amounts to is that you can design a simple tube circuit that gives good overdrive clipping character when the power tube is the first thing to clip. What that means is that when the smooth, rounded waveform reaches it's max volume and begins to clip, the actual voltage swing doesn't increase as the tops of the waveform flatten out. Even if you design such that earlier stages in the amp start to clip as the gain is increased, the max voltage swing has already been reached. Ergo, same voltage swing clean as clipped. A clipped signal will still SOUND louder. At least a little. This is because of the compression affect over the frequency band. But the difference is usually very acceptible. Especially since clean guitar parts are typically less agressive musical passages anyway. So, switching from clean to dirty, or, as with my amps, controlling the clipping level with input signal, the music happens just as it should. It's not a magic trick. But it sounds like one.
    "The man is an incompetent waste of human flesh. He should donate his organs now to someone who might actually make good use of them." The Dude re: maybe I shouldn't say, but his name rhymes with Trump

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    Greetings Chuck.

    To quote a WWF wrestler my kids used to watch(the"Rock") "I smell what you"re cookin'. However, does this apply as explained with a hybrid amp like my HT-1R ?
    I feel confident that no matter how you adjusted the gain control(which works in clean mode and "dirty", but differently on each). This is from an e-mail sent to me by Bruce Kier, Technical Director of Blackstar : FW: Getting to Know the Blackstar HT-1R Better! "The gain control on your HT-1(the no reverb model) controls the gain of an operational amplifier symmetrical clipping stage that precedes the ECC83/12ax7 valve stages." We use this configuration to limit the amount of drive into the two valve stages." " The actual distortion is always produced initially at the anode output of the second valve stage(12au7), but we use clippers to limit the amount of peak to peak voltage that is applied to both valve stages, as contrary to popular belief, driving a cascaded ECC/83/12ax7 gain circuit with too high an input voltage has a detrimental effect on the tonality of the distortion thus produced." "The actual gain of the valve stages in OD mode remains constant regardless of the setting of the front panel gain control, and does not change with the setting of the front panel gain control." I don't understand how
    this is so when in OD mode, turning up the gain control increases distortion AND volume, through it,s full range. It functions in much the same way on the clean channel, except the volume is increased cleanly, until about half way up before you begin to notice an overdriven tone which at maximum, is what I would call mild distortion. Just changing to the "dirty" channel results in noticeable increase in distortion and volume. On this channel I would say that distortion is maximum, again at about half way up, but the volume continues to rise until the gain control is at maximum. All of this happens with the volume cranked. To get maximum volume, both controls have to be maxxed. This means max volume, by far, only with max distortion. There's a lot going on under the hood. Besides two tubes that I know fairly well, there is a 28pin mystery chip, 7 X 8pin,unmarked I.C.'s. 3 small transistors, and two large STK 830 (power transistors ?)
    which I have not been able to reference. The thing that bothers me most is that the first amp did not seem to have that much more volume in OD mode, or perhaps that much less in clean mode. As I said before, it may well be my bad ears and poor memory. Also, with this being my third HT-1R I might just be "gun shy". I figured you would understand much better than I do
    what Mr. Kier is talking about, and that you might be able to down-talk it to me as you have so well many times before, when my understanding failed me. This, if and when you get the time. I do know that a distorted signal will sound louder, but this is looouuuddd, or like I said before, the clean channel is weeeaaakkk. Mostly, I'm cooonnnfffuuussseeddd !(humor intended). As for the "attack" of my trial playing, I played the same standard blues licks the same way on both channels. I also noticed that turning the reverb up to full further increases the volume.????

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