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Thread: Klemt Echolette S...(cont.)

  1. #36
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    Hi Oc,

    thanks a lot for your usefull schematics and pics!, i will study this carefully those days,but i'm away from the unit this week.
    i think i've got this type of schem cause my rectifier is labeled "B300 C70":
    http://personal.inet.fi/musiikki/ind...tte%20NG51.JPG

    See ya Nick

  2. #37
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    Hi, playback heads 4 & 5 were from my perception meant to double the number of echos when both were switched on. It's easy to ascertain which head is being switched by connecting the tape as usual, then removing the tape and then slightly and very carefully just touching the head gap with a flat screwdriver. First with push-pull switch in and then pull it out. You will then know for sure which head is being switched out.
    Actually an interesting modification would be to add a switch to the other head so that either playback head could be switched on or off. This would require a bit of circuitry alteration to keep levels consistent, but would never the less add another dimension.
    Cheers, Mike

  3. #38
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    The problem was not to determine which head was in service.

    As you indicate it, with a screwdriver, it is very easy.

    But I wanted just to know the theoretical order of heads on the origin assembly

    of the NG-51-S, mine having been "a few" tinkered by his previous owner.


  4. #39
    Old Timer oc disorder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mecaso View Post
    OK Now, i am in accord with you.

    I think it is the good order.

    On my NG-51 S , heads 4 & 5 are permuted, and i don't know the reason why.

    So, i'll permute this heads to put them in the good order.

    Thanks again & regards....
    Yes .. I thought about it a bit more
    Rec. Head 1 makes the 1st (first) sound received by the playback heads.
    Rec. Head 2 " 2nd (second) "
    Rec. Head 3 third sound.

    That is why the "Germans" labeled the rec heads from the order of sound ..not the physical position on the top of the echo machine.
    It is unusual but clever to me , to have 3 record heads and 2 play heads instead of 1 record head and 4 play heads.

    I learn something new every day. Thanks,

  5. #40
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    Hello, it's Nick again back from my rest week,

    I was happy to find in my mail box yesterday the parts, brand new tapes and a ECC82.
    I putted the tape and the tube on but nothing happened, still no echo sound..
    With the Nachhall reverb switched on, i tried to trace back the signal and i came with no buzz on the output Din pin socket 3,
    i moved on to Valve 4, nothing on pin 2&7, then to valve 3 and still nothing on pin 2&7..
    the buzz is on the output din socket pins 4&5, but it's the dry signal according to Oc's pics.
    Excuse me for this secondary silly question, but i still wonder why i can hear the buzz on pin 4&5 as i soldered pin 3&2 of my output jack plug..
    are pins 3 and 5 joined together in the din plug? I missed something here..
    Cheers Nick
    img_output-01-01.jpg

  6. #41
    Old Timer oc disorder's Avatar
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    Hi Nick . Please find Output wiring attached. No they shouldn't be joined.
    Can you get your meter probes to measure the playback heads resistance as per my previous diagram?
    and can you check if the layout of components at Tube 4 is the same as the one I posted.
    The two sections in a 12whatever7 tube are identical so physically it was easy for this unit
    to have the pins not the same as the diagrams. In one of the diagrams I lightly
    labeled the pins in a gold colour.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails echolette_output-socket-.jpg   din-5-pin-socket-fnt.jpg  
    Last edited by oc disorder; 04-01-2015 at 03:52 AM. Reason: pic. of din plug rear

  7. #42
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    Hello

    My question will probably seem silly , but I guess

    Nick has installed a magnetic tape on its tape echo

    and it is well facing , ie with the surface covered

    with iron oxide ( Fe2O3) oriented to be in direct

    contact with the magnetic heads.

    Sorry for asking this question...

  8. #43
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    Nick, before you do anything, correct the issue with the signal output from the din plug. Why have you soldered pins 3 & 2 together, if you look at the schematic you'll see that pin 2 is ground and pin 3 is the combined dry & echo signal output. You have grounded the output! Do you understand the numbering on the pins as sometimes this is a bit confusing for non technical people. Cheers, Mike

  9. #44
    Old Timer oc disorder's Avatar
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    Hi Mecaso , not a silly question but we are not fitting a tape loop just yet.
    Nick said he has bought some tape loops ready made so when the time comes to put a tape loop on the machine as you suggest ,
    he must make sure the correct side of the tape faces the tape heads.
    For Nick it should be easy as the splice or join will be on the outside.
    In the old days the shiny side faced out and the dull side as you say with the Fe203 faced in.
    Some tape (Ampex?) has the oxide on the shiny side? !!!.
    A good point you brought to our attention !

  10. #45
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    Just like to say that being involved with the discussion on Klemt Echolette Tape Echos I have come to understand more about the intricacies of these great machines. Often when I repaired/serviced one of these items I would just measure voltages, check capacitors and resistors and generally apply my electronic knowledge to eventuate a repair. The adjustment of the bias voltage to each recording head was never of great significance as the units usually responded well to basic repairs and customers were delighted to have their Echolettes back in working condition albeit not at optimum performance. Maybe the bias voltages were in tolerance but when I did begin to make this adjustment as a standard repair/service procedure I felt that the performance had been enhanced.
    I guess the limited number of these machines coming in for repairs and the very limited service information available was a factor in the degree of competency when repairs were performed by me. Thankfully Bobby Staedel from Germany provided invaluable assistance when I approached him for same many years ago.
    Having repaired numerous Watkins Copicats which are very basic in design I guess the finer points of the Klemt Echolettes alluded me.

  11. #46
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    Hi is there still life in the Echolette threads ?
    I have some funny problems with these machines , the first opne is a Dynacord Super 65 , runs beautiful after replacing the playbackhead Nr 5 with a Philipstaperecorder head but the funny part : I do make my own tapeloops from Agfa prof tape , running very good on my other machines , but on this one after half an hour running starts to sqeal like a bird in the system .. when touching the inside running tape softly with a cotton swap the squeal goes away , but comes back later .. the funny part if I puit the tape on a differfent machine , no problem .. if I make myself a new loop from an ampex 8 track tape ( that is coated in the outside with some fine slippery stuff becuase it is an endless tape ( olde 8 tracks ) so with an Ampeg 8 track loop no problem at all only more noisy and greasy after a few hours I have to clean the pinch roller .. anybody making his own loops and from what tapes ?? and why is the Agfa prof studio tape running good on my other machines and strts to squel like a bird on this Dynacord ?
    funny number 2

    A klemt S 51 bought without heads .. now fitted with Woelke 2 track heads connected only on one track , halftrack tape ... running fine except with echo signal its very very noisy , bute ven woithout the gear running >I have already lots of noise .. hiss and the like .. the tape just ads some noise .. anybody has experience in fitting other heads on these machines ??

    Cheers .. looking forward to the reply of other experimenters

  12. #47
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    Hello

    I have replaced the heads on my two NG-51s by Grundig 500 Ohms heads,

    half 1/4" track, and no noise when working. If you have noise without echo

    working, the heads are not involved. Maybe a resistance or a condensator

    defect..

  13. #48
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    Impossible since yesterday, to post an image...

    Here is thus the link to reach directly the photo

    Of one of my NG-51s provided with GRUNDIG heads

    https://postimg.org/image/nmhci9w5n/
    Last edited by Mecaso; 05-29-2017 at 07:32 AM.

  14. #49
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    Hello, everybody!

    Ther is an ECHOLETTE NG-51s on ebay England.

    KLEMT NG51S ECHOLETTE Valve/Tube Tape Echo/Reverb - Fully Serviced - Great Sound | eBay

    111.jpg

    The two playback heads shields are missing...!!!

    The four ECC-83 shields are missing...!!!

    In spite of these lacks, 1194,19€.

    There are sellers who doubt nothing....

  15. #50
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    DREAMING OF EASY MONEY !!!!

    Some people have really dreams that there are fools who are going to pay such money for an old derelict junkbox .
    fact is fools are plenty on the world , fools with lots of money are less .. and if so , they remain fools after short time without money ... :-))

  16. #51
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    Hello every one.

    It seems that the 1194,19 NG51S has been sold....!!!!!!

    KLEMT NG51S ECHOLETTE Valve/Tube Tape Echo/Reverb - Fully Serviced - Great Sound | eBay

    There are people with money......

  17. #52
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    never believe fleabay ... in a few weeks you will find it back for sale ..

  18. #53
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    I'll give you some good advice about fleabay .. don't trust the Uk , the French , the italian , the spanish sites , lots of false info , lots of junk especially from the UK ? I buy regularly and In Belgium before paying money I go and collect myself , in 20 % it's a junk case .. leave it.. go back home ! , In Germany if it's bussiness trader with all data telephone adress etc .. you can mostly trust , the USA site only PAYpal so you can block the transaction if need for ! .. there is a lot of junk that's being sold or tried to sell it .
    I have about 5 % of the things I buy with bad problems ,wasting money , over 50 % of the second hand used gear is ready to repair .. forget all these gold fairy tales and wake up !
    greetz, Ben

  19. #54
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    I have more than 500 purchases on eBay , and I have never had

    any problem. If dishonest seller, refund by paypal.

    To have no troubles, you should not buy doubtful objects....

  20. #55
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    well I take the risk sometimes , and if am lucky I have a bargain , else I have a throw away .. but the problem is that not always possible to paypal ..and that's risky ! with paypal I have had possibilities to recover a full or a part refund in case of defective items , but without Paypal .. APITA ... dishonest people sometimes .. and always remember second hand is sold for some reason and some reasons are in the description , some are not and are sometimes hidden faults .

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