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Thread: Please check my wiring diagram: DiMarzio Super Switch

  1. #36
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    Those Super Switches can be pretty intense. The last one I did gave me a headache for 2 days. For some reason I can't stand the idea that an inaccessible pickup combination is in there somewhere. There are some truly stunning sounds available if you are willing to do the work.

    The Seymour Duncan P-Rails schematics get the selections you are after but they are not designed for a 5-way. I did something similar with my Les Paul but with 4 push pulls so I can select any combination. It gave me a nightmare. I found the appropriate schematic after I figured it out on my own.

  2. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_teee View Post
    Yes your diagram is in parallel, more or less.
    Your humbuckers operate in series, in pos. 1 & 5.
    In position 2, 3 & 4 they are in parallel, but do hum cancel.
    Personally I prefer parallel.
    Richards diagram actually has 3 poles tied to the output, and only one pole, the top right, switches the ground.
    It is a very unique wiring diagram, and it also makes me dizzy!
    T
    **Edit
    Here is the link to the full fender blacktop HH document.
    http://support.fender.com/service_di...8100B_SISD.pdf
    http://support.fender.com/service_di...Cupg1_SISD.pdf
    WTF! So is this common? I mean, I guess it is, as this and others are in parallel. Is there a way to modify the schematic to put everything in series, or is that even important?

  3. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Those Super Switches can be pretty intense. The last one I did gave me a headache for 2 days. For some reason I can't stand the idea that an inaccessible pickup combination is in there somewhere. There are some truly stunning sounds available if you are willing to do the work.
    After staring at that Blacktop diagram a bit more, I decided I like it and re-drew it for the switching I want. But does it have the mixed series/parallel issue the others have? Again, is it even an issue, or is everyone just used to (or ignorant of) this sound as a reality when you start chasing after more pickup combos?

    EDIT: Woa, hang on... even the middle position of a three way toggle is in parallel! Ok, so I just made a discovery along the lines of "Wow, water is wet," didn't I... yeah, so this parallel thing pops up in most switching scenarios, right? Huh...

  4. #39
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    I believe each pickup has its coils in series (standard humbucker) and the pickups are in parallel with each other, the normal way to do it like a Les Paul. Earlier I thought I saw 2 diagrams this is the one that is equivalent to yours.
    http://support.fender.com/service_di...8100B_SISD.pdf

    I like all coils in parallel. It gives good jangle and seems to soften up the attack a bit. Not punchy but in a good way, at least for my guitar and what I do, kind of a clean tone thing. I haven't got much with the two pickups out of out of phase or in series but it may be what you want. I'm interested to find out how your project comes out.

  5. #40
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    So all this parallelism is normal, huh? I hadn't considered that, but then again, I've not dug so deeply into wiring diagrams before.

    Yeah, this one guitar will have the Super Switch and the works, but I'm building another alongside it - same design, same pickup batch - that I'm going to wire simply as a rocker: volume, push/pull bypass/tone (standard tone in pull position, bypass to volume in push), and a three-way toggle!

  6. #41
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    I don't think running all 4 coils in parallel is common. The 3rd position on your schematic and the Fender schematic has the individual pickups in series within themselves but parallel to the other. No matter how I try to phrase it It doesn't sound clear. On most humbucker guitars this is the standard arrangement with both pickups on.

    With that Super Switch you can get nearly any arrangement of your 2 humbuckers imaginable. You are just limited to 5 choices. I think there are 72 possibilities if you count series and out of phase combinations. The 5-way is probably the easiest way to get around though.

  7. #42
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    +1

    No matter what you want, you are limited to 1-of-5 selections. If you want two humbuckers in series (for example), then first you must give up a different combination or add more switches. Having said that:

    The standard LP 3-way switch allows 2 HBs to parallel in the mid position. Some like it, some don't bother to use it. On the other hand, AFAIK there is no 'standard' switching arrangement out there that puts single coils in series or HBs (already in series) in series more. You can do it with the super switch, but it will take more figuring. I stand by my advice to leave all pickup leads long until you've heard and approved all the combinations that you want.
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Conner View Post
    If it still won't get loud enough, it's probably broken.

  8. #43
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    Right, so if that middle position on the 3-way toggle is the simplest (and perhaps oldest) switching arrangement for two humbuckers, and it results in a parallel pair, does anyone even want two humbuckers in series? Does anyone know what that sounds like? Is it worth the wiring acrobatics to make it happen?

    I'll say again: this thread is unearthing some interesting rabbit holes.

  9. #44
    Supporting Member eschertron's Avatar
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    I may be over-simplifying the theory too much, but this is my take:

    Series arrangements enhance midrange because the entire signal path is a series of filters, and the sharpness of the filter increases in each coil that it passes through. Humbuckers = narrow band, punchy.

    Parallel arrangements allow for the full bandwidth of each coil to pass, and the spectral interest is in how different frequencies are summed or subtracted based on the physical location of the coil under the string. SC = broad band, sparkly/chimey.

    One of today's over-wound humbuckers may sound a lot like to PAFs in series, who knows? Well, the person who plays with some unusual pickup combinations, that's who
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Conner View Post
    If it still won't get loud enough, it's probably broken.

  10. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by eschertron View Post
    AFAIK there is no 'standard' switching arrangement out there that puts single coils in series
    Does Dano count?
    Danolectric PU switch

  11. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjb View Post
    Does Dano count?
    Danolectric PU switch
    Good catch!
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Conner View Post
    If it still won't get loud enough, it's probably broken.

  12. #47
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    Hey, there's an exception! Hmm, but there are a lot of dead attachments and links and circular references in there. Is this the schematic we need to be looking at?
    danolectro-duo-sonic.jpg
    In the discussions, there was disagreement about the switch being used. On/Off/On, On/None/On, On/On/On? Whatever is going on, I can see how that middle tab has the + from one pickup and - from the other, with a ground out the top tab and a hot out the bottom to volume. Is that right?

  13. #48
    Supporting Member eschertron's Avatar
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    I think the take-away from that discussion is that there has been at least one guitar made that used a method of making a 'kind-of' PAF pickup out of two widely spaced single coils. What you and others have done is to take humbuckers and make paralleled single coils. Each wiring scheme results in one or more of each kind of coil arrangement: 2 coils in series (PAF or 'humbucker' style) and 2 coils in parallel (strat-style). How many you need of each kind depends on what you want the instrument to sound like. If you haven't seen this current thread yet, there's some opining here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Conner View Post
    If it still won't get loud enough, it's probably broken.

  14. #49
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    Good points in that discussion about having so many options, but with such subtle differences that you might as well just have a few. And the mention of jumps in volume from one combination to another as a potential annoyance or distraction is appropriate to this discussion: series all the way may not be the way to go.

    Ooo, but I'm going to have to take a look at that Free-way Switch... 6 positions!

  15. #50
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    One thing you may want to consider is that in position 2 the unused coil of the bridge pickup is still connected to the output. The other end is not cot connected and this may pick up interference. I would run the jumper to terminal 2 on the lower right pole of the switch tying all 1-4 together so the two ends of the coil are connected in position 4. This effectively removes the coil, I believe this helps reject RF interference.
    I thought that this* might be an issue in custom wiring harnesses and would try to get around it one way or another** but in practice with a well-shielded guitar it never seemed particularly noisier.

    * having the unused coil connected to (+)
    ** as I recall I sometimes had to reverse the 4 leads and flip the magnet to avoid (*)

    Steve Ahola

  16. #51
    rjb
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Rodgers View Post
    Hey, there's an exception! Hmm, but there are a lot of dead attachments and links and circular references in there. Is this the schematic we need to be looking at?
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Danolectro Duo-Sonic.jpg 
Views:	2785 
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ID:	35046
    In the discussions, there was disagreement about the switch being used. On/Off/On, On/None/On, On/On/On? Whatever is going on, I can see how that middle tab has the + from one pickup and - from the other, with a ground out the top tab and a hot out the bottom to volume. Is that right?
    I don't know if this is exactly the Dano circuit, but it would work for a neck/both-in-series/bridge harness.
    AFAIK, On/Off/On and On/None/On mean the same thing- that's the kind of switch you'd need.
    One "On" position shunts the neck pickup (leaving the bridge pickup ON) and vicey versey.

  17. #52
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    The on/none/on will have no center position.

    I like having lots of pickup options. Some options will sound similar on the bass strings and different on the treble strings, some the other way around. Also I have different shades so even though two sounds sound may be similar and and useful in the same way I can get a slight deviation for a little variety. That and sometimes there's that one note that jumps out a little too much or not enough, sometimes this can be corrected. The downside is it can be difficult to get around all the options.

  18. #53
    rjb
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    The on/none/on will have no center position.
    In other words, an on/none/on switch is a 2-position switch- not a 3-position switch.
    Hey, I learned something. (Obviously, for the Dano circuit, you want a 3-position on/off/on.)
    https://www.carlingtech.com/basic-circuit-function

  19. #54
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Rodgers View Post
    Right, so if that middle position on the 3-way toggle is the simplest (and perhaps oldest) switching arrangement for two humbuckers, and it results in a parallel pair, does anyone even want two humbuckers in series? Does anyone know what that sounds like? Is it worth the wiring acrobatics to make it happen
    I'll say again: this thread is unearthing some interesting rabbit holes.
    I replaced the toggle switch in my first LP with a 6 position rotary switch in the late 70's which added the serial linkage of the two humbuckers. It was very loud and muddy, and not that usable for me. But there are many applications with serial linkages that can be very usable like two out-of-phase hb's, two single coil pickups (in or out of phase) or split coils from two hb's.

    The way to find linkages that work for you is to leave the pickup leads long and run them out of the control compartment one way or another (pull a tone pot on a strat if you have to.) Get some small gauge jumper clips and go to town trying out different combinations. Once you find new linkages that you like then you can look into how to wire them up with a super switch and optionally one or two DPDT push-pull pots. The sky's the limit!

    And yes, nothing is worse than going to the trouble of wiring up a custom harness only to find that most of the linkages are not usable...

    Steve Ahola

  20. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve A. View Post
    I replaced the toggle switch in my first LP with a 6 position rotary switch in the late 70's which added the serial linkage of the two humbuckers. It was very loud and muddy, and not that usable for me. But there are many applications with serial linkages that can be very usable like two out-of-phase hb's, two single coil pickups (in or out of phase) or split coils from two hb's.

    The way to find linkages that work for you is to leave the pickup leads long and run them out of the control compartment one way or another (pull a tone pot on a strat if you have to.) Get some small gauge jumper clips and go to town trying out different combinations. Once you find new linkages that you like then you can look into how to wire them up with a super switch and optionally one or two DPDT push-pull pots. The sky's the limit!

    And yes, nothing is worse than going to the trouble of wiring up a custom harness only to find that most of the linkages are not usable...

    Steve Ahola
    Steve,

    One interesting pickup switching method is to use the 4 position Telecaster switch that adds bridge and neck in series to the traditional choices. This way you can put a push-pull switch tone pot to reverse the phase when two pickups are in either series or parallel. Then use a stacked concentric volume control (500K) wired for independent volume (with the pickup leads going to pot center and outer and the output comes from the other pot outer lug). Varying either pot by about one tenth of a turn creates a tuneable out of phase notch sound. This all fits into a stock Telecaster or G&L Telecaster very nicely with very minimal modifications of the external appearance.

    Joseph J. Rogowski

  21. #56
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    Ok, guys, this wiring diagram is soldered up, and today I put strings on the guitar and gave it a spin.

    First, here is a shot of the pickups being assembled (Mojo parts):
    Blade coils have 5000 (neck) or 6000 (bridge) turns of 42awg wire, with ceramic magnets. Slug coils have 5000 or 6000 turns of 43awg, with neos.
    blade-slug-hybrid.jpg
    The guts, with 500k Bourns volume and tone pots, and the DiMarzio Super Switch (4 pole, 5 position). Notice that the switch is tipped on its side! It was too tall for the slim body, so I bent the switch toggle 90deg and cut a "smiley face" slot for it. It works! To recap, the switch selects 1- Bridge full, 2- Bridge/Neck blades, 3- Bridge/Neck full, 4- Bridge/Neck slugs, and 5- Neck full.
    guts.jpg
    The guitar. Bookmatched black walnut cap over a one-piece spalted maple body core. Multi-scale 25" to 26" neck.
    string-up.jpg

  22. #57
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    Oh, and I suppose you want to know my impressions of their sound!

    First, I just gave it about a 5 minute test of operation, and the pickups are adjusted all the way down, so further tweaking is necessary. The full humbuckers positions sound good. I don't have a great depth of knowledge when it comes to comparisons with other known products, but I can say that the bridge has a bit of a dryness and sparkle that I like. The neck is warm and full, of course, but retains some of the character of its construction, as heard from the bridge.

    The reason I went to the lengths I did with this wiring diagram, though, was to isolate the coil types in the 2 and 4 positions. Again, the pickups are not at their optimal heights, but there is a difference in tone. Position 2, bridge and neck blades with ceramic and 42, has a bit of a brittle, mid-y tone. Position 4, bridge and neck slugs with neos and 43, is delightfully articulate, with a roundness and warmth that contrasts with the blades.

    In the end, though, I'm not sure if the blade vs slug tone is different enough to call this a "standard" diagram that I would return to, but it works and it satisfies my curiosity.

    Big thanks to all who have contributed here! This process has been fun and something of an education in itself.

  23. #58
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjb View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by eschertron View Post
    AFAIK there is no 'standard' switching arrangement out there that puts single coils in series
    Does Dano count?
    Not as old as the Dano but my Sup'rStrat wiring harness from 1997 used a regular strat switch and a push-pull pot to get 10 different linkages including bridge and neck pickups in series and the middle pickup in parallel with the bridge and neck in series. BTW the easiest way to get humcancelling for the bridge/neck linkages was to swap the RWRP middle pickup and the neck pickup.





    Here is the link to the article explaining it all...

    http://www.blueguitar.org/new/articl...supr_strat.pdf

    Steve Ahola

    P.S. I always gave Paul Reed Smith credit for bringing the concept of humcancelling linkages of split humbucker coils in series and parallel to the general public. What PRS brought to the table was NOT in my "bible"- the 1980 edition of Donald Brosnac's "Guitar Electronics."
    When Gibson added coil cut switches to some of their LP's the idea of having the middle position humcancelling had evidently never occurred to them.

    Here is something I drew up in 1997. The top drawing shows a typical Gibson coil cut switch which is not humcancelling in the middle position. The bottom drawing shows one way to make it humcancelling. The middle drawing shows an on-off-on switch wired so that in the up position we have Bill Lawrence's trick of inserting a 0.022uF cap in series with the path to ground which will cancel some of the hum.



    Attachment 35359
    Attachment 35355
    screenshot_2015-08-21-10-28-11.jpg
    Last edited by Steve A.; 08-21-2015 at 07:52 PM.

  24. #59
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    The guitar looks great! Mounting the switch at an angle is cool and gives it a nice custom look.

    I wired up an HSS guitar so that I can get the middle pickup in series with either the neck or bridge pickup. Middle and bridge isn't that special but middle and neck in series is awesome. Halfway in between a humbucker and position 2 on a Strat.

    The volume differences between the different combinations doesn't really bother me. I usually only use single coils for clean and distortion masks the differences well enough for me.

  25. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    The guitar looks great! Mounting the switch at an angle is cool and gives it a nice custom look.

    I wired up an HSS guitar so that I can get the middle pickup in series with either the neck or bridge pickup. Middle and bridge isn't that special but middle and neck in series is awesome. Halfway in between a humbucker and position 2 on a Strat.

    The volume differences between the different combinations doesn't really bother me. I usually only use single coils for clean and distortion masks the differences well enough for me.
    Thanks! And it's cool to hear that series scenario worked for you. I got a First Act strat neck and body from a friend (no hardware- he stripped it to make a 2x4 lap steel) that I'm going to make into a pickup test mule. Putting stuff in various series arrangements is the first thing I'm going to experiment with.

  26. #61
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    A pickup test rig would be awesome. It's kind of hard to be sure what it's going to sound like when playing with wires and alligator clips hanging out the back of your axe.

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    Super 5 way - slugs n blades, 1 volume with 2 tones (strat config)

    I love this configuration! I was wondering, any way you could draw up a diagram with this configuration with 1 volume and 2 tones? I have a HH strat configuration and would love to include 1 volume and 2 tones (neck and bridge, of course). I REALLY appreciate any advice. Thank you SOOOO much for any help.
    ~Chris

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Rodgers View Post
    Hi, folks! I can follow a diagram, but making modifications strays outside my knowledge base a wee bit. I want to wire up a couple humbuckers I made with a DiMarzio Super Switch, using this diagram as a starting point http://www.dimarzio.com/sites/defaul..._ep1112web.pdf, with some changes to positions 2 and 4. If I drew it right, it should work like this...

    Attachment 34909

    The change I made to the 2 and 4 positions is instead of selecting inside/outside coils, it selects the top/bottom coils. The reason for this is the content of the pickups. The neck north and bridge south are slug coils wound with 43awg and carrying neodymium magnets; the neck south and bridge north are blade coils wound with 42awg and carrying ceramic8 magnets. This is an experiment, clearly, and I want to isolate the different types of coils to hear what they sound like. If they don't end up sounding particularly different, there are some other cool switching diagrams on the DiMarzio website.

    Thanks for looking!

  28. #63
    ToneOholic! big_teee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher Otto View Post
    I love this configuration! I was wondering, any way you could draw up a diagram with this configuration with 1 volume and 2 tones? I have a HH strat configuration and would love to include 1 volume and 2 tones (neck and bridge, of course). I REALLY appreciate any advice. Thank you SOOOO much for any help.
    ~Chris
    Going from a 1 volume, 1 tone, to a 1 volume, 2 tone (1 for neck, 1 for bridge)?
    With all the options of the super switch, to then also split tone off for neck, and bridge, is a very tall order.
    I think you would need some additional switches to do so.
    The question is, would the additional work and switches be worth the effort?
    T
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  29. #64
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    You could put the tones in between the common terminals and the volume. If I was going with two tones I would consider 2 volumes.

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