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Thread: Chinese Gibson clone neck..... makes you wonder?

  1. #36
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    There is more than one way to skin a cat. That's why forums like this are so helpful ... lots of great ideas.

    John, I like your router idea. Clamping the boards to the neck to establish the offset for the blade is basically the same idea as my idea to build a jig to hold the neck, and then pass the wood to a tablesaw or a bandsaw for cutting. Both solutions use an add-on to provide control in submitting the wood to the cutting tool.

    I don't know why I thought of routing the mortise but not the tenon. For the tenon cut I was sort of hung up on making a single pass with the blade. A jointer would've been perfect for that, and a tablesaw and a bandsaw would have been good too. A router would require multiple passes but that's generally not a problem for anyone skilled with the tool.

    I think the best approach is for someone to find an approach using tools that he's familiar with and comfortable using to produce good results. I thought dawg's mitre saw idea was a good example of that -- use the tools that you're familiar with to get the job done.
    Steve A. likes this.
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  2. #37
    Old Timer olddawg's Avatar
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    Ok.. I have it set up and ready to glue. If you look you can see the fishing line I used to line everything up. It's going to look a lot like a real '61 SG. (Well the 61 didn't have "speed" knobs and Grovers......) I have to get a real Gibson truss rod cover and make that bit of black plastic that goes between the front pickup and the neck. I'm deciding whether to paint the headstock face black with a gold Gibson waterslide or leave it white with a gold Gibson waterslide? I'll wait another day before I glue it and think about any oddities I may have missed. Eventually I'll put some goofball serial number on it to freak people out.
    3a2be681-7e70-4411-8a3a-00cce320364a.jpeg
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  3. #38
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    in 61 they used these, right?

    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

  4. #39
    Old Timer olddawg's Avatar
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    Well.... it’s pretty much done and gigable. Turned out much better than I thought it would. I got everything set up right.. the neck angle, everything. But I got the intonation about “3/8” short. If I did another one I would have it down. If I would have put the 22 fret at the start of the body it would have been perfect and I could have used a Gibson tenon cover. As it is I cut a piece of black CD box plastic to fit the space. Looks fine. It’s not a big deal, I just had to flip the damn saddles and it’s at the extreme end of the adjustment. It plays and tunes fine but it bugs me nonetheless. From my reasearch this has a metric “Nashville post” style ABR1 bridge. I hear I can put a “Tone Pros” bridge on it and give me more adjustment, but I’m not sure I want to put a $70 bridge on a $100 guitar. Lol! Also I hear a “Gotoh” metric Nashville has the same throw as the Tone Pros for $25 and will drop right in. If anyone has a clue let me know. This thing is actually really pretty nice for a beater. It surprisingly sustains extremely well (probably because the tenon goes halfway up the neck pickup. No buzzes. I had to size the nut and do a truss rod adjustment of course. Plays as good as anything else I own. I’m deciding if I’m going to shape the heal of the neck a little closer to the body. I have a gold “Gibson” water slide decal ordered for the headstock for when I feel like messing with the finish some more. Even the stock G400 pickups aren’t THAT bad. I expected crap but it isn’t the case. Might swap something better into it eventually, but it’s way usable the way it is. 2e3fa2c7-db8f-4f1e-ac65-dfaf1494caf1.jpeg3fd019a9-d74b-4e6b-80ca-54b3b874e027.jpegfda0c908-bfab-465e-a679-5a3645f50ae7.jpeg I’ll gig with it for sure.... I see a few broken Epiphone G400s like this about for cheap or nothing if anyone else wants to do it. The Chinese neck dropped right in with just a little work. I’m going to stamp my birthday on the back of the headstock. I doubt anyone will know it isn’t some kind of Gibson reissue but me.
    Last edited by olddawg; 11-02-2017 at 06:42 AM.
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  5. #40
    Supporting Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    One of the first things I noticed about SG's when I first started playing (they were common used guitars when I was a teenager ) was how the 22nd fret meets right at the inner end if the horns. This was no doubt a smart attempt at creating a beautiful design with the most fret access for players that wanted it. But the damn things are top heavy and, for me, uncomfortable because of it. So your little mistake, to me, seems like a happy accident. As long as it can be intonated at the saddle then I think you may enjoy better weight balance for playing. And having the bridge pickup some 3/8" further ahead of the saddles could make for a good and unique tone.
    "The man is an incompetent waste of human flesh. He should donate his organs now to someone who might actually make good use of them." The Dude re: maybe I shouldn't say, but his name rhymes with Trump

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  6. #41
    Old Timer olddawg's Avatar
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    img_6656.jpgHonestly Chuck I don't know what happened. I measured from from the 12th fret a dozen times. I waited 3 days before I clamped and glued it to check everything out since I know it's a one time shot. I even looked at a bunch of pictures of various SG's neck joints. The pickup in relation to the bridge is the same as it always was unless I decide to move the posts. I guess the extreme adjustment might make a little difference in tone. However, I've seen many factory Gibsons with the bridge slightly misplaced. Also, since the body is an Epiphone with a "poly" finish it's a little heavier than the usual Gibson SG so the balance is fine even with Grover knock off tuners. My first "real" guitar was an SG too. A "Mary Ford" model with factory P90s I bought used in 1973. Wish I still had it.
    Last edited by olddawg; 11-03-2017 at 06:58 PM.

  7. #42
    g1
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    don't forget the joker g1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck H View Post
    But the damn things are top heavy and, for me, uncomfortable because of it.
    I have no qualms about mounting strap buttons on the horn. I can't stand them on the back of the neck. That's what I did with my BC Rich Eagle, no issues whatsoever.
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  8. #43
    Old Timer olddawg's Avatar
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    I tell people to use a longer screw of they do that and drill the correct size pilot hole. I've seen the horn bust right off.
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  9. #44
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Titebond Liquid Hide Glue

    Quote Originally Posted by ric View Post
    I'm with John H. Don't forget to adjust the saddle about half way up and put a straight edge down the neck and make sure your neck angle will be where you want it.
    I don't know if it would be useful here but I picked up a General Digital Precision Protractor (#1702) a few years back.



    DIGITAL PRECISION PROTRACTOR from Aircraft Spruce

    I got an SG at a yard sale with the neck popped out of it's pocket. Took the opportunity to do a fret dress with the neck off (rare w/ an SG), and glued it back in and it's a keeper. Gibson had left a lot of slop in the fit so I used epoxy for it's gap filling ability with yellow glue at the edges to glue the wood to wood. You've got a decent fit on yours, so no need for gap fill. Titebond used to make a premixed hide glue in a bottle. I've used that in the past for neck glue backs with success.
    They still do. It was originally called Franklin Hide Glue but It Titebond bought out that company. Antique Refinishers makes another liquid hide glue called Old Brown Glue which smells much worse. A local luthier whose opinions I value highly tested different glues for guitar refret jobs and found that only CA (superglue) and Franklin liquid hide glue had more resilience (or whatever)*** than most other glues. I tested the various Titebond PVAs and type I was more resilient than types II or III.

    I found a recipe for making your own liquid hide glue which will last up to a year in the refrigerator — the trick is to add salt which preserves it. I remember that the ratios were 1-2-3, I think for salt, hide flakes and water but I'll have to check my archive collection of webpages and news articles.

    BTW I had recently read that Epiphone used to use epoxy for the set necks on their Gibson copies but eventually switched to Titebond 50 which is what Gibson lists on their specs page for their guitars the past few years.

    BTW#2 I had read one account of a mandolin being assembled with liquid hide glue which eventually fell apart.

    *** This can be heard while tapping the fret with a bone nut blank.


    Steve Ahola
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails screenshot_2017-11-03-10-56-57_20171103105806793.jpg  

  10. #45
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob p View Post
    in 61 they used these, right?
    Bob, I had read that Gibson used real gold in those knobs which is why the older knobs were selling for high prices. If that is actually true I wonder when they stopped doing that. I have a 1948 Century lap steel with recessed knobs that are taller than the regular guitar knobs which might be worth a fortune... [spin]

    Steve A.

    P.S. So you use Duck Duck Go... Yes, I understand its advantages - I use it for one of my Android browsers whenever I get really pissed off at Google.***

    I am still waiting for someone to design a search engine which creates an actual database of the first, say, 5000 hits which can then be filtered until you find exactly what you were looking for. Yes, some of the webpages might change and URLs could disappear within minutes but that is not a big issue in view of the advantages of a search engine creating a searchable database of hits.

    I suspect that back in the days when Google was trying to overtake Yahoo they were focused on generating the most hits.


    *** My big concern is not Google's tracking of my searches (and monetizing them!) but its purported interest in our safety which can make it as slow as molasses. I remember being able to tell my Windows browser the degree if safety I desired. {sigh!} The options available for Google Chrome for Android under Settings is miniscule...


    Steve A.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails screenshot_2017-11-03-11-48-02.png   screenshot_2017-11-03-11-48-41.png   screenshot_2017-11-03-11-47-50.png  
    Last edited by Steve A.; 11-03-2017 at 09:03 PM.

  11. #46
    Old Timer olddawg's Avatar
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    Thanks Steve. I ended up using Titebond II. Seems to be fine. I had such a precise fit in the neck pocket I doubt it will creep. I also canít help but think that the strap button screw will also add some stability. Iím still deciding if Iím going to drop a Gotoh or a Tone Pros bridge into it.

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