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Thread: Am I the only one who thinks the price for this silva mica cap is obscene??

  1. #1
    Senior Member SoulFetish's Avatar
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    Am I the only one who thinks the price for this silva mica cap is obscene??

    I happened across this link in a post about sourcing components.
    https://www.tubesandmore.com/product...ver-mica-1000v

    I would almost think it was funny, if there weren't some poor sot out there paying $9+ for a black logo on a 500pF cap.
    If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

  2. #2
    g1
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    don't forget the joker g1's Avatar
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    I noticed those the other day too. Most of that brand are very pricey. I see some builders are really going for them. Give the people what they want I guess, and they seem to want anything that implies Zep.
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    Supporting Member The Dude's Avatar
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    And, we all know came up with the idea to use silver mica caps.
    “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

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    "Sozo" is actually Greek for "complete healing," body, mind, and spirit... Either way, I'm sure I don't have to pay as much for the four silver mica caps I might use in an amp as I paid for all the parts on my first build to make my amps sound completely healed, body, mind, and spirit...

    Funk Dat. Gimme the cheap junk. And Dude, if you say the name three times fast, he'll appear before us. Better just leave it at that.

    Justin
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  5. #5
    Supporting Member The Dude's Avatar
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    I intentionally used no monikers of any sort!
    “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

  6. #6
    Old Timer Leo_Gnardo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    And, we all know came up with the idea to use silver mica caps.
    All I knows is, a couple months ago I had a veddy X-pensive boo-tiki copy of a tweed Vibrolux that was making the most awful noises. And what did I find inside? No modern Bozo cap, but a real live left over from WWII silver mica that was literally dying to be replaced. And so I did. With a normal everyday disc cap. Then that amp started sounding like it oughta. Case closed.

    The boo-tiki builder put it in there to provide some vestige of authenticity-of-tone. Sure . . . it sounded like a cat fight in a thunderstorm. We can do without that.

    Maybe it's time to review the Bozo animation one. more. time..... I'm not gonna clog up MEF's bitstream tho, you'll have to punch on the link:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_agbTOn1fnQ
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  7. #7
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    It's funny that someone is pimping a brand of exotic/overpriced caps using a logo that's supposed to remind people of Jimmy Page. They've rearranged the characters in the astrological symbol for Saturn (commonly referred to as "Zoso") to create a brand trademark "SoZo" that's attempting to profit from Page's fame without paying him any royalties.

    IMO SoZo caps are the equivalent of Mercury Magnetics transformers. Probably a decent component, but not anywhere near worth the price that the suckers pay for them. If I'm going to buy a silver mica cap, I'll take the CDE.
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    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

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  8. #8
    Senior Member SoulFetish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob p View Post
    If I'm going to buy a silver mica cap, I'll take the CDE.
    That works out, 'cause I'm not sure you have much of a choice at this point. In fact, CDE is probably the one who makes them for Sozo.
    I don't know how they've been able to dodge anti-trust litigation to this point, but Cornell Dublier has become the Comcast of capacitor manufacturers. #capneutrality
    If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

  9. #9
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    Or an alternative theory:

    What is SoZo?
    SoZo is the Greek word for Salvation. It was used in the new testament to describe the salvation of God. It is the salvation that only comes through the name and person of Jesus. It means complete deliverance from your current disposition, psychologically, physically, and eternally. Body, mind and spirit. It means deliverance from bad health, poverty, broken emotions. He offers his hand, please take it.

    Strong’s Number: 4982

    Original Word: swñ

    Transliterated Word: Sozo
    (from the SoZo web site)
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  10. #10
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    Of course their web site doesn't say beans about them intentionally modifying Led Zeppelin's copyrighted album art to produce a derivative work as their corporate trademark. (Page's abbreviated "Saturn" symbol.)

    That symbol has always been enigmatic. Here's a web page that explains what the symbol means, as well as why finding it in reference texts proved to be so difficult that the meaning remained enigmatic for so many years:

    https://zososymbol.com/



    Irrespective of their claims about the translation of the word from Greek, I don't think it's a coincidence that the Sozo trademark symbol appears to have been derived from the artwork on Zeppelin IV. I think it's clear that they're playing a game of borrowing someone else's mojo and profiting off of that person's reputation to hawk their wares:


    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails oo-iii-p-313a.jpg   foursymbolsalbum.jpg   sozo-logo.png  
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

  11. #11
    Senior Member SoulFetish's Avatar
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    Sure. But what?, Zeppelin’s gonna bitch about someone ripping them off and not giving them credit?? Ha! That would take some All-World balls
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    If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

  12. #12
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    Suffice it to say that I recognize what they're doing and their trick isn't going to get me to overpay for their mojo caps. But they're doing it because there are people who will spend too much money just because that symbol is intended to evoke an associated emotion in the customers' minds. Some people do fall for it.
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

  13. #13
    Old Timer Leo_Gnardo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoulFetish View Post
    Sure. But what?, Zeppelin’s gonna bitch about someone ripping them off and not giving them credit?? Ha! That would take some All-World balls
    In the good ol' days Zep's manager Peter Grant would have "sent his boys 'round to see ya..." Not nice boys at all, these. After a little "conference" Bozo wouldn't have the balls to continue use of that logo. Maybe literally.
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    Does CE just own SOZO the same way Guitar Center owns Acoustic, so they try to push their junky product on us?

  15. #15
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    The Sozo guy has posted here in the past, and has sent me a couple emails over the years. Those at least did not come from CE.

    I think it is a matter of how much bitterness one peers through to see the world. The company name didn't come from there, but sure the Logo is a tip of the hat to Zep. Led Zep 4 came out over 45 years ago. probably before most of our members were born. So I tend to think it is no more a rip off than a band calling themselves REO Speedwagon. Or the Rolling Stones "ripping off" Muddy Waters.

    I mean really, do we honestly think the cap company was thinking "Boy, I bet a lot of kids will pay for these caps because the name resembles an album my dad liked"?
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  16. #16
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    So going back to the OP, I looked for comparables. Mouser has 1500v silver micas in three much smaller values, in stock for $10 each.

    Then they also have mica caps 500pf 1kv for $3.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

  17. #17
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    I don't know the details, but I have been told that sozo and CE are in bed together and that's why CE and CE owned brands push the Sozo brand pretty hard. If you sign up for CE as a repair shop I believe you are categorized as service or retail or something. If you can upgrade your status to manufacturer you get better price breaks, but mostly just on sozo products.

    I think they want a bunch of small time boutique builders to drink the koolaid and then tell their customers the koolaid is exceptional. Then if the customers find the mojo they will keep buying from the boutique builder and their orders will get bigger and bigget to CE.

  18. #18
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    CE is the wholesale side of AES. You have to be a commercial enterprise to get an account with CE, otherwise you shop from the AES catalog. The price discounts affect most of the stuff in the catalog, not just Sozo caps.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    yes but the difference is between being considered service or retail member of CE, vs having a manufacturer account. If you make something and sell it and can prove it and are not just service or retail you can get your account upgraded to manufacturer and get better price break on the site, but especially on Sozo caps. no joke.

    I am just saying these because these are things CE has told me

  20. #20
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    Sure, if you buy five caps versus 5000 caps, you don;t get the price break. Same thing happens at Mouser, et al.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

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    But you do get the price break. If you're manufacturer and you buy 10 caps you get a better deal than a service account that buys 10 caps. No joke.

    They LOVE to work with small time builders, hoping they will one day be huge and place massive orders. They want to rope them in as serious customers right when their brand begins.

    I am literally just saying this because that's the way they're nudging me

  22. #22
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    you're right. end column pricing differs depending on the type of account you have. i signed up as a manufacturer decades ago when i was building a lot more than i am now. i pay less with the manufacturer's account. so they're nudging you in that direction? do you have a reason for not doing it?

    as to that bit about denying that there's any intended inception about Led Zeppelin mojo when selling caps -- this isn't about being bitter, it's about not being naive. logos push incremental sales. if there's no putative benefit for copying the logo, then why copy the logo? they did it for a reason. they certainly didn't go to the trouble of doing it for no reason.

    people make excuses to not believe all sorts of things.
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

  23. #23
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    I have accepted their nudges. They also nudged me to call in or email in an order if it's big (assuming they mean over $500) to ask for a price quote from a sales rep. they will price you better than what the site prices in that regard as well. Updating status to OEM plus calling in your orders "can have things looking pretty nice for you" as far as what I've been told.

    Edit: things still won't look nice for tube prices. That is probably your worst price break

  24. #24
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    I don't know if anybody here remembers Bill Godbout Electronics from the 70s and 80s who sold parts and kits for the projects in the Craig Anderton books@@@ but one of their employees went on to start Mike Quinn Electronics which dealt mainly in surplus from all of the Silicon Valley companies back when HP sold more test equipment than computers.

    Well, I went there around 2000 and got 100+ silver mica caps, a whole bunch of carbon comp and Dale resistors, some trim pots and multi-section rotary switches... all for a whopping $14.00! Woohoo!

    In any case I thought that silver mica caps worked great as treble caps and reverb splitters in BF/SF amps but sounded like crap in certain locations in some Marshalls which really needed the graininess of ceramic caps to smooth out the grittiness (specific details are long gone from my memory banks.)

    Steve A.

    P.S. So who was it who first told us of the wonders of silver mica caps... Dan Torres?!?


    @@@ They also sold computer kits back when computers used individual LEDs for their display of numbers rather than monitors!

  25. #25
    Old Timer Leo_Gnardo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nsubulysses View Post
    I have accepted their nudges. They also nudged me to call in or email in an order if it's big (assuming they mean over $500) to ask for a price quote from a sales rep. they will price you better than what the site prices in that regard as well.
    Hmmm, almost all my CE orders are $500+, for a list of parts. Never a nudge. Once I asked for a discount quote on 1W carbon comp resistors, 100 lot. They're NOT cheap. Oh that had to be sent up to the brass for an OK . . . back & forth with the email, they knocked off about 5%. Then I got the pile of resistors, NONE were near the expected value. $120 spent for junk. Lesson learned, DON'T try that again, you just annoy the brass. I guess you get treated differently depending who you are. Salesmen are always nice in person though. Maybe the deep discounts go to those who order $20-50 grand a year or more? I'm at about 5 grand. Do you mean $500+ worth of a single part? Maybe I misunderstood.

  26. #26
    Supporting Member Steve A.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    And, we all know came up with the idea to use silver mica caps.
    Dan the Man Torres?!?

  27. #27
    Old Timer Leo_Gnardo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve A. View Post
    P.S. So who was it who first told us of the wonders of silver mica caps... Dan Torres?!?
    No, it was SGM. Now I forget what that stood for. Sound Guru Meshuginah?

    Hey, I remember Godbout! Also when Mouser started out, they seemed to concentrate on parts for the home synthesizer builder, had a 6 page catalog printed on comic book size newspaper stock. A cover page, an order page & 6 pages of parts. Cheap but effective. My how they have grown!

  28. #28
    Bent Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enzo View Post
    Sure, if you buy five caps versus 5000 caps, you don;t get the price break. Same thing happens at Mouser, et al.
    I just stocked up on MF 12W Xicon resistors there. I don't need much stock so I was looking at quantities under 10pc. for many values. But the unit price for 1-10 was .16 and the unit price for 10-100 was .024 so I bought ten each of those values for 24 cents.?. Not sure if there's a typo there but it priced out on the invoice.
    "I'm just going to perform a bit more scientific investigation, turn it up to 11 and rip of the knob." überfuzz

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  29. #29
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    SGM. There, I said it. Now all we need is for someone else to say his name one more time ...
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

  30. #30
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    I get incoming calls from the sales guys at CED. They always seem to call at the worst possible time, always when I'm in the middle of something and can't talk. They do have some pretty good offers when they call though.
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

  31. #31
    Old Timer Leo_Gnardo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck H View Post
    I just stocked up on MF 12W Xicon resistors there. I don't need much stock so I was looking at quantities under 10pc. for many values. But the unit price for 1-10 was .16 and the unit price for 10-100 was .024 so I bought ten each of those values for 24 cents.?. Not sure if there's a typo there but it priced out on the invoice.
    When the price goes like that from singles to multiples, understand you're not paying for the part, you're paying for the time they take to pick that single part off the shelf, pack it in a plastic bag, and label it. And at ten, they're still losing money filling your order.

  32. #32
    Bent Member Chuck H's Avatar
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    Yeah, I never feel good about my $30 to $150 orders with them. I know they can't make money ten of this and ten of that for items costing 2.4 cents each! But I'll tell you what. I was with them before the internet when their catalog was about the size of a magazine. And I'd be happy to go into an electronics store and pull my own parts from a bin or buy them in bags of ten off a sale rack. Cept daint no lectronic stores no mo. This is the only way to get what I want.
    "I'm just going to perform a bit more scientific investigation, turn it up to 11 and rip of the knob." überfuzz

    "...less ear-friendly but handy for jazz." Leo_Gnardo

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  33. #33
    Lifetime Member Enzo's Avatar
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    I designed a logo for my stuff. It resembles the Fender logo, but it is actually a conscious and intended tip of the hat to the old Washington Senators uniform logo.

    ted-williams1.jpg

    That it is Ted Williams wearing it is a bonus.

    it's about not being naive... if there's no putative benefit...then why copy? they did it for a reason. they certainly didn't go to the trouble of doing it for no reason.
    I guess I am naive. I did it because I was a fan of my then local team and always found that uniform attractive.
    Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

  34. #34
    Better Tone thru Mathematics bob p's Avatar
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    I guess so.
    "Stand back, I'm holding a calculator." - chinrest

    "I happen to have an original 1955 Stratocaster! The neck and body have been replaced with top quality Warmoth parts, I upgraded the hardware and put in custom, hand wound pickups. It's fabulous. There's nothing like that vintage tone or owning an original." - Chuck H

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