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Thread: SensMag Prices

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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    SensMag Prices

    Hello there,

    Nice to meet you guys.
    Does anyone have ordered the last months from SensMag?
    I noticed that they are increased the prices of rods and bars, 50% up.
    $3.00 for each bar (100pcs) and $0.30 for each rod (700pcs).

    Moths ago I ordered from them for $2.00 the bars and $0.20 the rods.
    Does anyone have the same experience with me?

    If you also have another supplier from China with good magnets please post it to compare the prices.

    Thank you guys!
    Tim

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timdaalman View Post
    Hello there,

    Nice to meet you guys.
    Does anyone have ordered the last months from SensMag?
    I noticed that they are increased the prices of rods and bars, 50% up.
    $3.00 for each bar (100pcs) and $0.30 for each rod (700pcs).

    Moths ago I ordered from them for $2.00 the bars and $0.20 the rods.
    Does anyone have the same experience with me?

    If you also have another supplier from China with good magnets please post it to compare the prices.

    Thank you guys!
    Tim
    I think that's the result of the newly imposed tariffs by Trump.

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    Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    I think that's the result of the newly imposed tariffs by Trump.
    Maybe yes or maybe no but, I didn't notice any change on US stores that sell pickup parts.
    To be honest, I don't want to believe that because to sell in Europe has nothing to do with the Trump tariffs.

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    Trump tariffs should lower prices on Chinese products in Europe not raise them. I'm betting that the cobalt or nickel prices are what have caused the price to go up. Cobalt especially is used in steel alloys for jet turbines. Aluminum is by far the cheapest of the three metals.

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    Old Timer J M Fahey's Avatar
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    Cobalt is skyrocketing, about doubling its price per year since 2016:


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    Juan Manuel Fahey

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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J M Fahey View Post
    Cobalt is skyrocketing, about doubling its price per year since 2016:

    That's make sense.
    Another one reason may be that China has the biggest field in the Magnets market. As I know in the US you will find only 2 or 3 companies that manufacture Alnico.

    Does anyone know other factory in China with resonable prices?

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    Google search "China alnico foundry" and "China alnico supplier" and see what you can dig up.
    Alibaba.com is another obvious place to search.
    https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search...+guitar+magnet
    These guys email me from time to time: Neodymium Magnets|jaw crusher|Custom Magnets|super magnets |pandora silver charms|stone crusher|rare earth magnets

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    Woodgrinder/Pickupwinder copperheadroads's Avatar
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    This is what i was told when I asked about the price increase
    "The material cost, labor, the environmental protecting cost in China, everything going up.
    Might will be higher in next year. "

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    "UP here in the Canada we shoot things we don't understand"

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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    Thank you David, I will send them an email.

    Quote Originally Posted by copperheadroads View Post
    This is what i was told when I asked about the price increase
    "The material cost, labor, the environmental protecting cost in China, everything going up.
    Might will be higher in next year. "
    Copperheadrods, yes these reasons are maybe will increase the final cost but something is strange now.
    Please look what I mean.

    In 2012 I contacted with a company in China and they gave me these prices:

    AL5 LNG44 200 pcs - 0.187" x 0.630" = $0.050 each
    AL5 LNG44 10 pcs - 2.444" x 0.492" x 0.125" =$0.80 each

    Please look how the prices changed in the same company

    AL5 LNG44 200 pcs - 0.187" x 0.630" = $0.432 each
    AL5 LNG44 10 pcs - 2.444" x 0.492" x 0.125" =$3.24 each

    It's not very logical.

    I have contacted with many companies now in China and the biggest different between them are in the Alnico bars prices (same grade, same qty, same dimensions).
    They start from $1.70 each until $5.00 each.

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    I have some sense that a lot of these Chinese companies were losing money on those alnico orders at 6Ē and 7Ē per magnet. Either they hadn't analyzed their actual expenses or they were doing their best to knock out the competition. After all we aren't building pickups to sell for $4 a pop so even if we were to source American magnets we could still have substantial margins for a top shelf product at a competitive price-point.
    I don't see a lot of locals installing the $10 strat pickups in their custom built axes.

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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    You are right David, I agree with you but we are living outside of the USA and we have a lot of duties, taxes, shipping costs to get the first raw materials from China and USA.
    We don't have the same margins than an American semi pro pickup maker.

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    Old Timer J M Fahey's Avatar
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    With due respect: ... so?
    Different Countries different realities .... and if I were in the Netherlands I would not complain, quite the contrary.

    You are outside USA which has a very special Economy: "expensive money" (so a small amount of US Dollars will buy a lot of stuff in China) - low to zero tariff - exceptionally low freight cost which makes Chinese products extremely cheap and inexpensive ... if bought in the USA and paid for in Dollars .
    Problem is *everything* Chinese (or from Korea - Taiwan - Malaysia - Singapore -Vietnam - India) is inexpensive, including fully assembled stuff, so they become unfair competition.

    From what you say pickup components pay too much
    duties, taxes, shipping costs
    Ok, fully assembled ready to install Asian pickups also do .... I hope.

    If so, they leave you a window or niche where you can work.
    If no tax no duty cheap freight were available in the Netherlands, you would not be able to sell *anything* you make.

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    Juan Manuel Fahey

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    Junior Member timdaalman's Avatar
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    Hello Juan,
    I think that you have misunderstood what I said.


    *
    The reason that I strarted this thread was because I noticed the big differences on prices that SensMag sells now, 50% up.
    I started to use Sens almost a year ago and I really like their magnets. Their quality is perfect.
    You mentioned me that the Cobalt price, labor costs etc increases the prices of the Alnico's. I believe you, I don't disagree.

    I'm not a professional pickup maker and I don't know if I will be someday but when I told you "we have a lot of duties, taxes, shipping costs" it was because I must pay almost 2 times up the price for everything to get them.
    If I were in the USA I will pay the price + cheaper shipping costs.
    Anyway, maybe it was my fault to start the thread, SensMag has great quality magnets, I suggest them to anyone who wants to try them.
    I wanted only to share my experience.

    If the admins believe that this thread is offensive for SensMag you can delete it.

    Thank you guys for your opinions!
    Tim

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    Last edited by timdaalman; 04-26-2018 at 02:23 PM.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timdaalman View Post
    I noticed the big differences on prices that SensMag sells now, 50% up
    SensMag today is NOT the same company it was in 2012. They've upgraded everything, got ISO9000 compliant and now they're one of the best foundries in the world for consistency of their grades, even on custom ones. They can perfectly repro vintage mags without even destructive analisys of the sample!

    For the record, you can still have 2012 prices if you're willing to buy bigger quantities. (500 pieces and up of each type/grade)

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    Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
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    Old Timer J M Fahey's Avatar
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    Thanks Pepe.
    As they say here: "tú no tienes ni un pelo de tonto" which can be translated literally as "you donīt have any "foolīs hair" (in your head) meaning "you donīt have the tiniest bit of foolishness"

    Although the literal translation also applies

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    Juan Manuel Fahey

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    I failed to notice the 200 piece orders in the OP's quotes above. Yes 500 or 1000 piece per size orders are more or less the minimums for reasonable pricing.

    Back in the day there were excellent Alnico foundries in the UK centered around Sheffield. I'd be interested to hear if any are still extant and if anyone is still using their magnets.

    Tim, no worries about offending anyone around here, especially not a distant giant factory.

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    Member Alberto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David King View Post
    I failed to notice the 200 piece orders in the OP's quotes above. Yes 500 or 1000 piece per size orders are more or less the minimums for reasonable pricing.

    Back in the day there were excellent Alnico foundries in the UK centered around Sheffield. I'd be interested to hear if any are still extant and if anyone is still using their magnets.

    Tim, no worries about offending anyone around here, especially not a distant giant factory.
    I buy from Cermag, in Sheffield, from time to time, I really like their bar magnets. I never tried their rod magnets, too expensive. Anyway, prices have gone up by 30%-40% during the last year.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alberto View Post
    I buy from Cermag, in Sheffield, from time to time, I really like their bar magnets. I never tried their rod magnets, too expensive. Anyway, prices have gone up by 30%-40% during the last year.
    Really? I've tried'em too, and comparing'em with Sensmag's, to me they're tone-wise not even close, speaking about the same alnico grades of both foundries, not to mention that Cermag's roughcasts don't look "vintage" at all. With the exception of A3, all the other grades charge too high for my taste, making'em sound darker by default, unless when you make "hot" p'ups for Metal and such, which it might even be a good thing.

    The positive side is that they're pretty affordable, even buying few at the time, and as they're in the EU, the burden of the administrative side of dealing with Customs and such, it's non-existent.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by J M Fahey View Post
    Thanks Pepe.
    As they say here: "tú no tienes ni un pelo de tonto" which can be translated literally as "you donīt have any "foolīs hair" (in your head) meaning "you donīt have the tiniest bit of foolishness"

    Although the literal translation also applies
    Muchas gracias, Juan Manuel!

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    Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
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    Member Alberto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    With the exception of A3, all the other grades charge too high for my taste, making'em sound darker by default, unless when you make "hot" p'ups for Metal and such
    I've used them in low wind humbuckers (7,5k-8,5k) and they didn't sound dark at all to me, but I suppose it depends on the design of the pickup as well.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alberto View Post
    I've used them in low wind humbuckers (7,5k-8,5k) and they didn't sound dark at all to me, but I suppose it depends on the design of the pickup as well.
    Yeah, that too... if they work for you, that's all you need, Alberto, isn't it?

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    Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
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    I'm guessing that WAL might have got their ceramics from Cermag then too...

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    Member Alberto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    Yeah, that too... if they work for you, that's all you need, Alberto, isn't it?
    And for my customers as well, I hope

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    yes, cobalt prices went through the roof as you all know. They seem to have stabilised somewhat at the moment.

    Sorry LtKojak our mags dont meet your needs, id love to hear what we could do to give you a better sound.

    Just for info, we offer trade discounts on request as well as standard discounts if a minimum order qty is achieved.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cermag View Post
    Sorry LtKojak our mags dont meet your needs, id love to hear what we could do to give you a better sound.
    Mike, is that you posting here?

    I honestly don't know what you could do, short of changing your whole production and annealing process to match the BH curve analisys results of american-made mags from the 50s and 60s, plus "worsen" (for the lack of a better word) your pouring molds so your "roughcast" offerings look more like the vintage ones.

    I completely understand that's quite a tall order and that's never going to happen for just one guy that's not even a boutique winder... specially considering that basically THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG with your mags to start with.

    For the record, as I sold all my Sensmag A3 bars, now I'm currently using one of your A3s in the neck p'up of my own guitar, and being basically satisfied with it, although I had to set the p'up a little bit lower to match and balance the output of the bridge when the toggle switch is in the middle position, and consider too that the bridge p'up has an A2 in it.

    Hope this helps!

    Yours very truly,

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    Last edited by LtKojak; 05-31-2018 at 02:41 PM.
    Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    Mike, is that you posting here?
    yes, its Mike thanks for your comments. Well received.

    We've done some work on HB bars that are half A2 and half A3 or A4 (basically half bonded together). had some positive responses but im sure we didnt get full feedback from guys that have done this.

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    You can thank Mr. Pig, the pretend president and his idiotic "trade wars" crap he saw on Fox. Your vote has consequences, and you are paying for it now.

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    [url]http://www.SDpickups.com[/url]
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    Quote Originally Posted by cermag View Post
    yes, cobalt prices went through the roof as you all know. They seem to have stabilised somewhat at the moment.

    Sorry LtKojak our mags dont meet your needs, id love to hear what we could do to give you a better sound.

    Just for info, we offer trade discounts on request as well as standard discounts if a minimum order qty is achieved.

    Dear Cermag,

    I've used your magnets for a while now, since you're the only company on my side of the pond to manufacture guitar-oriented magnets. Kudos for posting here, you've obviously kept an eye on the needs & demands of pickup makers! Your range seems to have expanded in the last year or so, and I thought I'd chime in with a few comments.

    I haven't found using your magnets to result in particularly dark sounding pickups, I guess part of it is winding styles & the type of wires used.

    I did notice a change in quality in your products in the last few months, the first magnets I ordered from you guys had quite a few bubbles in them, but the issue seems to have disappeared in the last couple of orders I received, which is a nice thing. Did you up your QC/manufacturing processes?

    Now, the one thing that still has me ordering from your American competitors is the lack of a bevel option for your rod magnets, both for the practicality of inserting the magnets into the flatworks (I like a tight fit in my pickups, and not having a bevel means a small part of the forbon is gouged out by the sharp edges of the magnets) and for customers who want a vintage-correct bevel on their pickups.

    I'll give you guys an email, I'm going full-time into pickup making this years and I'll be needing more of those tiny, shiny bits of metal...

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    Member Alberto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by epizootics View Post

    and not having a bevel means a small part of the forbon is gouged out by the sharp edges of the magnets) and for customers who want a vintage-correct bevel on their pickups.

    I'll give you guys an email, I'm going full-time into pickup making this years and I'll be needing more of those tiny, shiny bits of metal...
    Also, bass players don't like sharp edges. I've made a few P bass pickups using Cermag's rod magnets, my customers love the sound (more than other magnets I've tried) but sometimes they complain about the lack of bevel.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alberto View Post
    Also, bass players don't like sharp edges. I've made a few P bass pickups using Cermag's rod magnets, my customers love the sound (more than other magnets I've tried) but sometimes they complain about the lack of bevel.
    Really?

    That's an incredibly specific thing to complain about... specially considering that real vintage Fender p'ups didn't have bevels, nor do most of the repros offered by high-priced boutique winders.

    But, then again, I don't wind bass p'ups, so what do I know, uh?

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    Member Alberto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    Really?

    That's an incredibly specific thing to complain about... specially considering that real vintage Fender p'ups didn't have bevels, nor do most of the repros offered by high-priced boutique winders.

    But, then again, I don't wind bass p'ups, so what do I know, uh?
    I should have added that those weren't standard p-bass pickups, actually I made them to fit non standard routes, wood mount, and without covers, so the magnets were protruding a bit on the top side

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    Last edited by Alberto; 06-12-2018 at 10:48 AM.

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    Senior Member LtKojak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alberto View Post
    I should have added that those weren't standard p-bass pickups, actually I made them to fit non standard routes, wood mount, and without covers, so the magnets were protruding a bit on the top side
    Oh, I see. Well, that explains why they ended up in the ER with blood all over their instruments...?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    Oh, I see. Well, that explains why they ended up in the ER with blood all over their instruments...?

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    Quote Originally Posted by epizootics View Post
    Dear Cermag,

    I've used your magnets for a while now, since you're the only company on my side of the pond to manufacture guitar-oriented magnets. Kudos for posting here, you've obviously kept an eye on the needs & demands of pickup makers! Your range seems to have expanded in the last year or so, and I thought I'd chime in with a few comments.

    I haven't found using your magnets to result in particularly dark sounding pickups, I guess part of it is winding styles & the type of wires used.

    I did notice a change in quality in your products in the last few months, the first magnets I ordered from you guys had quite a few bubbles in them, but the issue seems to have disappeared in the last couple of orders I received, which is a nice thing. Did you up your QC/manufacturing processes?

    Now, the one thing that still has me ordering from your American competitors is the lack of a bevel option for your rod magnets, both for the practicality of inserting the magnets into the flatworks (I like a tight fit in my pickups, and not having a bevel means a small part of the forbon is gouged out by the sharp edges of the magnets) and for customers who want a vintage-correct bevel on their pickups.

    I'll give you guys an email, I'm going full-time into pickup making this years and I'll be needing more of those tiny, shiny bits of metal...

    Thanks for the chance to answer..

    With regards to the issue of porosity in magnets, this is something that is inherant with cast magnets. We have a set standard for pass/fail when it comes to despatch. im sorry you received a batch with inclusions in them, they should have been scrapped off if they were very bad at our end. Normally i think the standard we send is quite high.

    For the bevel, we can put bevel on any magnets. We do offer this on the "1/4 dia rods as this is what we have only ever been asked to put them on. would people like to see this on the 5mm dia and 0.187" versions?

    i dont always check here everyday so best way to get hold of me is email, which is on our website. i can send samples if it helps?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak View Post
    SensMag today is NOT the same company it was in 2012. They've upgraded everything, got ISO9000 compliant and now they're one of the best foundries in the world for consistency of their grades, even on custom ones. They can perfectly repro vintage mags without even destructive analisys of the sample!

    For the record, you can still have 2012 prices if you're willing to buy bigger quantities. (500 pieces and up of each type/grade)
    They are still making the vintage rough cast magnets when I worked with them through Allstar and Magnetic Hold. Previously to that no one was making rough cast magnets. Sensmag still makes the ones I spec'd, but Magnet Hold were unable to reproduce the first rough cast ones I did with them when I ran out. This was in 2007. Now days everybody makes rough cast. I still half belief that doing individual bars like we did has some kind of effect, because in replacement tests in real PAF's with my Allstar remaining magnets, I couldn't tell any difference between the vintage and the new rough cast mags. I still have quite a few of those left and some of the Maghold ones. The second batch from Maghold came out way too thick to use, so I had them grind them flat to my specs. Was a sad day because theirs looked like originals.

    0 Not allowed! Not allowed!
    [url]http://www.SDpickups.com[/url]
    Stephens Design Pickups

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