Most expensive new Tele pickup set?

[salvarsan]

Those Barden type pickups are supposed to be a bitch to rewind, probably the $200 rewind price is well spent in hours to take it apart and fix...

Oh, yeah. Those bobbins are glued together, must
be miserable cutting it apart in a way that it can be
reglued, although he may simply discard the old bobbin tops.

Anyway, I'm glad that Joe got a business manager and returned
to the trade. He's a local fixture in the WashDC music business.

-drh

[redtele]

While hand winding is time consuming , there for costing more. Is it really anymore accurate. I mean if a certain amount of wraps is going to determine your tone. A machine will scatter wind . Whats the difference ? Should it cost that much more ?
Thanks Donnie

[David Schwab]

While hand winding is time consuming , there for costing more. Is it really anymore accurate. I mean if a certain amount of wraps is going to determine your tone. A machine will scatter wind . Whats the difference ? Should it cost that much more ?
Thanks Donnie

I doubt there is any different. Without a motor spinning your coil, it just takes longer to do the same thing.

Is a router better than a chisel? Is a bit-and-brace better than an electric drill?

Slower machines or tools allow you more control at times, but it depends on the application and context. If I want a pickup cavity on a solid body guitar I'll be using a router. I'll use a chisel for more delicate things.

I couldn't see sitting there and winding wire on a bobbin by hand when I can hand guide the wire while it's spinning on a coil winder.

It's hype wrapped in absurdity!

[Electricdaveyboy]

So, who makes a good set of replica Black Guard Telecaster pickups?

-drh

Don´s (web site) says that he can do it !

by the way were is my Nano Farad Blackguard ( or was it BLACKGAURD)Book ?

[pickupjunkie]

but the costs are growing

Gibson even says their guitars are for collectors, and Epiphones are for players! However, it's not like it's a hand made guitar, although some of the necks are hand carved to start with.

I recently did a setup on a $10,000 Les Paul. It was a really nice guitar. I'm not sure it was worth that money though. $5,000 maybe. Guitars have gotten expensive.

When I bought my Ric 4001 new, it was about $300!

David I agree with the 10K being out of sight but I build guitars and even building them from scratch I have a minimum of 1200-1500 dollars in them. Of course using top of the line everything not to mention 200-400 being handwound pickups from one of you guys LOL But I think a lot of guitar buying is driven by excellent advertising and has been for years....whats the first thing a guitar player asks about a guitar, pickups, and amp? "Who plays those?" I believe in the US we have such a herd mentality that if a popular player was playing a russian boar turd with copper strings a dealer could get 10K for it LOL ...I also think tone and playability are such subjective things and so different to people who's to say what is great and what is crap... I never would have thought I'd pay what I do for hand wound pu's but I do because they sound so good and after all the electronics are the backbone of an electric guitar. To each his own I guess ... I do know we are now swamped with factory made far eastern stuff some of which is pretty damned good! I often wonder how much longer the ole "Made In USA" brands can stand the pressure.

[ken]

So... are you saying that advertising/marketing matters more to the average player than actual performance?

Happy New Year,
Ken

[salvarsan]

So... are you saying that advertising/marketing matters more to the average player than actual performance?

Well ... sure.

What was your point again?


No, more seriously ... a lot of people are susceptible to hyperbolic advertising copy
and get sucked into buyers self-justification ("I bought it, it cost a lot, so I _must_
think it's good.").

Often, there are genuinely outstanding pickups out there that are
marketed with plain words so you would never know until you try
them.

I'd like to think that the boutique pickup market has raised the bar
on quality in the last ten years such that now you can get great
pickups tailored to your particular playing style -- if you can clearly
express your needs and circumstances.

-drh

[ken]

What I was trying to say (with very heavy sarcasm indeed) in my last post was that many people tend to hear with their eyes not their ears. The 'herd mentality' is rampant nowadays, and there are very few groups out there that do not seem to have a favored instrument or parts maker. Those pickup makers who are just starting out nowadays have a much harder time trying to rise above the hype noise than ever before.

Maybe what the pickup world needs is a kind of 'mall' website where any pickup vendor can post a page of their product listings, soundclips, etc. without favoritism or bias of any kind. This can be broken into various groups based on price, music genre, etc. so the shopper can browse and make up their minds without any pressure. Each vendor can pay the host a monthly rate for this posting privilege, which keeps up the hosting fees, etc.

PS. Lots of people here make fine Blackguard Tele pickups - but advertising your own pickups in a pickup maker's group is a lot like excreting into a running electric fan. You tend to get flooded with errr... byproducts.

Happy New Year,
ken

[pickupjunkie]

So... are you saying that advertising/marketing matters more to the average player than actual performance?

Happy New Year,
Ken

Ken Im not sure that is the case but I do know that endorsement deals are the backbone of the big companies and some of the smaller ones as well. Its funny because I am friends with several well known musicians and they have endoresement deals with lets just say "Brand X" but when they are in the studio and many times when playing live almost to a person they are using their favorite handmade with handwounds. But hey ya know every person is different.

Happy New Year

[Possum]

blackguard here....

I make blackguard pickups, neck, Broadcaster and a Nocaster I call the '51. My friend lent me his '51 bridge to rewind, its still here, I copied every detail off it and believe me the details are where its at, I don't know anyone making these the correct way, even Duncan's Broadcaster is completely wrong. Don probably makes something correct because I told him all the details....
These are all basically a bitch to make which is the reason the so-called reissues are done wrong, they do them different because the right way is not production friendly :-)

[ken]

I make blackguard Tele pickups too, the lead 50B, 50E (hot), and a 50R rhythm pickup.

The early Tele pickups weren't really standardized till later on, so there were many variations. For example, the Blackguard book mentions some lead pickups with both top and bottom flats the same thickness, differing magnet diameters, and variances in DCR from around 6K to 9K and higher. I don't think Leo was all that picky when he was starting out and needing parts.

Endorsement deals are a joke. Some players out there will sell their images to anyone with a product to advertise, but may or may not actually use these products onstage. Pickup makers are actually kinda lucky, because to the uninitiated one pickup looks pretty much like another unless you have a logo on your pickup cover that actually shows up in photos. Say Joe Blow signs a deal with Fender to only play Teles onstage. Then, Joe swaps out the pickups in the guitar he got from Fender with a set of Possum's finest. What is Fender going to do... haul in Joe's guitar at random to see if the pickups are still original?

Happy New Year,
Ken

[Electricdaveyboy]

[QUOTE=Possum;85589]Those Barden type pickups are supposed to be a bitch to rewind, probably the $200 rewind price is well spent in hours to take it apart and fix...


Yes Possum,
the old Barden pickups are sold for big money on ebay but most of them have broken coils.Mostly the wire start/end is broken off the solderjoints under the pickup.I had a bunch here for rewind.One payed 600 euros for a set and both pickups worked only on one coil.
A lot of Danny Gatton fans jump on them.

[Spence]

I make blackguard pickups, neck, Broadcaster and a Nocaster I call the '51. My friend lent me his '51 bridge to rewind, its still here, I copied every detail off it and believe me the details are where its at, I don't know anyone making these the correct way, even Duncan's Broadcaster is completely wrong. Don probably makes something correct because I told him all the details....
These are all basically a bitch to make which is the reason the so-called reissues are done wrong, they do them different because the right way is not production friendly :-)

You're right. Me and Over The Pond Guy haven't been using black string like it says on your website. Come on Dave, you can't possibly track of all the pickup makers in the world so that's a bit of a sweeping statement.

[David Schwab]

I don't think Leo was all that picky when he was starting out and needing parts.

I recently read an interview with George Fullerton. He said Leo's real passion was making pickups. So he was always trying out new ways of doing things. Leo was supposed to be so fussy about the designs of things that he bought several boats and then redesigned them down to the bolts used, and submitted the designs back to the company!

Fullerton said the first Fender solid body was really just a pickup testing rig and that a lot of the local musicians would ask to borrow it because they liked the bright chimey tone. Leo was always trying out new variations.

I had a Music Man bass in my shop for a setup once that had a covered pickups without the usual large pole pieces. I was intrigued so I took the pickup out and it had dual rod magnets for each string like a Jazz bass! The owner said it was a prototype that never went into production.

I think he was always looking for the best/easiest/cheapest way to do things while maintaining quality. He was a very clever guy.

[ken]

Supposedly Leo's other passion was yachting. He is said to have over 30 patents for various parts of boats when he died.

Leo was very frugal indeed. When he changed the screws in Telecasters from flat to Philips head, he just didn't throw the old screws away. He mixed them all up, which is why it took years for him to use up all the flathead screws.

Supposedly, the reason he started to make amplifiers was because he ordered a boxcar load of wood for guitar bodies, but when he got the wood it was only 3/4 inch thick and the woodlot wouldn't take it back.

Leo - an inspiration to us all

Ken