Vintage 71 P Bass Pickups

[big_teee]

I have a pair of P-bass open pickup coils.
These are vintage wound with reddish Varnish wire.
It looks like I can repair the coil breaks.
There are no white and black wires left on the coils.
These belong to local guitar shop.
These have the 1971 date code on them.
He wants these as vintage as possible.
Is the jumper wire supposed to be white or black.
I'm going to wire them like the StewMac Pix below, I guess this is the vintage wiring layout?
I also have a brass ground plate.
Does the black ground wire from pickup wire to this plate, or go from pickup to Vol. Pot?
Or does the ground plate get wired separately?

[Sam Lee Guy]

Ah no! Not like Stewmac!

Looking from top with coils in place, all eyelets usually face bottom of guitar (towards controls). Bass side coil start with eyelet furthest away from other coil.(eyelet nearest neck) This have black wire to brass plate, folded down side of black rubber sponge and back again. Other eylet on bass side coil joined to same eyelet on treble coil (The one nearest the bridge) with white wire. Other eyelet on treble coil to hot.
If pickup hums when magnets touched, try swapping bass and treble coils and rewire as before. Original wire Belden PVC #22 AWG 7/30

Almost forget, brass plate connected to ground with black wire from other corner.

[big_teee]

They will end up looking like this when I'm done, from the top.
Thanks,
Terry

[David King]

Terry,
I'm about to wind my first P prototype and I'd love to know what the DCR is on these before you hand them back. I'm sure there is lots of data somewhere on the web but I'm lazy and it's never come up on this forum judging from my recent searches to that effect.

[David Schwab]

Terry,
I'm about to wind my first P prototype and I'd love to know what the DCR is on these before you hand them back. I'm sure there is lots of data somewhere on the web but I'm lazy and it's never come up on this forum judging from my recent searches to that effect.

10,000 turns per coil. Both coils in series is 11.6K.

[big_teee]

10,000 turns per coil. Both coils in series is 11.6K.

Davids right. My Guitar shop owner wanted to keep them low. 10-10.5k.
He has a 72 vintage P-Bass with after market pickups. He's trying to get back stock, to take to a big vintage Guitar show, at Arlington-Ft. Worth, Tx. this Month.

One more question, do they sound better with the brass ground plate?
Would they sound the same without the plate?
Do all the old vintage Fender P-Bass come with this plate?
Later,
Terry

[David King]

The plate was in my 1973 P and in all the P basses of that vintage that I've looked into. It's there to shield the back of the pickups from hum. I don't know how many dBs of hum are blocked by the plate, obviously it's not an ideal shield I'd give it a 40% chance with any directional hum which is better than no shield at all.
It's brass so perhaps some amount of eddy current losses. I doubt there would be an audible tone difference but I don't know.

[big_teee]

The plate was in my 1973 P and in all the P basses of that vintage that I've looked into. It's there to shield the back of the pickups from hum. I don't know how many dBs of hum are blocked by the plate, obviously it's not an ideal shield I'd give it a 40% chance with any directional hum which is better than no shield at all.
It's brass so perhaps some amount of eddy current losses. I doubt there would be an audible tone difference but I don't know.

Well it is wired in humbucking mode, with the RWRP, in series.
Looks like you could make them like a regular gibson style humbucker.
Both wound in same direction, then feed a start lead, Finish to Finish and ground the other start lead.
I'm making this one like the original because of the vintage thing.
I'm going to try and stick around a see if I can hear what it sounds like after the tech puts them in the bass at the Guitar Shop.
Terry

[Sam Lee Guy]

I can't hear any difference with or without the shield.

Yes the sheild was in all vintage basses.

70's pickups are wound both the same way then wired as a humbucker in series as you say but not all have tape under the windings and even with tape, some have windings shorted to magnets.

[Sam Lee Guy]

They will end up looking like this when I'm done, from the top.
Thanks,
Terry

Just to be really clear, the black earthed to the shield is the very top eyelet in this pic, right?

[big_teee]

Yes, Just like you said.
This picture doesn't look like another picture, on ebay of the rear.
The black wire is on Finish lead.
white strap wire on start, to finish of other coil.
White lead on Start to vol. Pot.
Sam Lee Guy, You were a big help and I thank you for your quick response yesterday!
Thanks,
Terry

[Sam Lee Guy]

Your very welcome. Only one more thing to add, from 1972 onwards often the treble half is turned with the eyelets towards the top of the guitar (away from the controls) to use a shorter wire between the two coils.

[big_teee]

Here's a picture of the Pickups after I got through with them before I take them back.
They wound up 10.3k Dcr. Like I said earlier Owner wanted them on the weak side.
I will take them back tomorrow. Maybe the tech will get them put back in and I can hear what they sound like.
I added additional pix to show the strapping for vintage fender. This is the colors and grounding for 71 P-Bass.
Please keep in mind that parts are old, and for vintage show nothing was to be overly cleaned and replaced. Brass plate, as is. Rubber pads, as is.
Later,
Terry

[Bill M]

They look good. Nice job. I bet they sound great.