Ric 4001 treble pickup rewind?

[soundmasterg]

Jetglo? Blech!!

I refinished my 1989 230 to Blue Boy because black shows all your fingerprints and smudges, plus it had been refinished black over the top of the original red and too much paint was causing checking. Blue Boy would look MUCH better!!

[David Schwab]

Jetglo? Blech!!

I refinished my 1989 230 to Blue Boy because black shows all your fingerprints and smudges, plus it had been refinished black over the top of the original red and too much paint was causing checking. Blue Boy would look MUCH better!!

Before I ever heard of, or saw Blue Boy, I thought of doing it a similar color.. like a light sky blue. It's actually an interesting color now, so my only reason to refinish it is I like black Rics.

It wasn't particularly pretty maple... my other Ric was a lot nicer, so I had decided to paint it purple (hey, it was the 80's!), and I settled on a Duco auto paint color, Burgundy Mist. It's sprayed on thin enough so you can see the walnut stripe up the middle.

Here's a shot of the back of the head, so you can see the color. The next two shots are the back of the August bass' neck, showing the curly wood, and the fingerboard on the August bass, which appears to be tulipwood. I started to make it a lined fretless....

[David Schwab]

This whole thread made me want to get my restoration going so..

I just bought a high gain neck pickup on eBay (cheap) from a '97 4003. I'm going to get a toaster cover, remove the heads on the poles, and make a high gain toaster...

I'll take photos of the whole process.

See that? This damn forum is making me spend money! lol

[soundmasterg]

High gain toasters are cool. I've got one in my 350v63 that Possum wound for me to around 12k with 44. This one I drilled out the polepieces and put in 1/4" alnico magnets though. I didn't glue them in yet either so I can swap different magnet types and see how the sound changes. Its easier to do that with these since the magnets aren't already glued in like in a real toaster, plus the magnets go through the whole bobbin rather than having a solid plastic top like the modern toaster.

The other way of course is to shave off the tops of the polepieces and put on a toaster cover and keep the ceramic rubber magnet on the bottom of the pickup. I've got one of these that Jeff Rath did. Its in my bass right now and is around 10k. It sounds pretty good, though I'm not sure if there is a sound different with the changing of the polepieces or not.

Would love to see pics when you get it going!

[David Schwab]

Jeff Rath is the one that gave me the idea! I was hanging out at the Ric Resource forum a lot last year. He does nice work. I couldn't play a 5 string with the neck that narrow though.

I might rewind the pickup. I'll see how it sounds. I like that hollow spongy toaster tone. I was mostly interested in the bobbin. I haven't decided if I'll change the magnet yet. My original toasters had the six long alnico rods.

[soundmasterg]

Yeah, Jeff has some good ideas. I can't play a 5 string at all! The high gain with toaster cover that Jeff did for me is a 6 pole high gain at about 10k. Its in the neck position on my bass at the moment and I like it. It is a bit brighter than the 4003 high gain, but gives a really cool in between sound. I'll have to play around with it some more to decide if it will stay or not. I've got the half inch spacing on my bass.

I like the toaster sound too, especially on guitars. The ~7.4k toasters in the bridge position just don't work well on the guitars though because they end up being about half the volume as the neck pickup. Sticking in the 12k toaster that Possum wound for me on a high gain bobbin that I drilled the pole piece holes larger on has made a huge difference on my 350v63. I'll be doing this on my 12 string too, though I think I'll go with somewhere in between the 12k and the 7.4k. I haven't tried the 12k toasters on a bass yet, but I didn't like a 6k toaster I had very much on the bass.

[ken]

Thank you for the info. I rewound it with 5000 turns of #44, got about 6Kdcr, and the customer was happy.

Ken

[David Schwab]

I like the toaster sound too, especially on guitars. The ~7.4k toasters in the bridge position just don't work well on the guitars though because they end up being about half the volume as the neck pickup. Sticking in the 12k toaster that Possum wound for me on a high gain bobbin that I drilled the pole piece holes larger on has made a huge difference on my 350v63. I'll be doing this on my 12 string too, though I think I'll go with somewhere in between the 12k and the 7.4k. I haven't tried the 12k toasters on a bass yet, but I didn't like a 6k toaster I had very much on the bass.

I had changed the pickups on my Ric just because the Toaster never got enough bottom, and the bridge pickup was really weak with the cap. When I bypassed the cap it was a great sounding pickup, but then it overpowered he toaster!

Now that I don't play the bass anymore I want to restore it for the times I want that stock Ric tone. I'm going to wind the bridge pickup on the hot side so it balances with the high gain neck I just picked up.

[soundmasterg]

Yah the stock toasters are a little lacking on the bottom end in a bass. They are smoother sounding than the high gains though......the high gains have a spikiness in the high end that is annoying sometimes. Must be the ceramic magnets....

[mkat]

David,

Do you know anything about why rubber magnets were used on these pickups rather than bar magnets?

I used to own a '74 4001 more than 17 years ago and really don't remember much about the pickups on it. I didn't like the sound much then, but I'm interested in the details now since I'm building basses and winding pickups.

How's your restoration going? Have you rewound your high gain toaster yet?

[Instigator]

Those rubberized magnets are less expensive to produce, I'm sure.

[David Schwab]

I'd guess at the time they switched the horseshoe over to the current pickup they needed a strong magnet, so they went with the ceramic. The toasters still used the alnico rods. I'm not sure how they ended up with the rubber magnet, but John Hall said that they used them because it got the tone they were looking for. It was probably a pretty strong magnet for the time. And cheap.

I haven't done anything with that pickup yet. I'm waiting to get some 44 AWG wire. It has all the old wire removed and is sitting in a zip lock bag. I posted some pickups here when I took it apart. I was surprised to find foam rubber wrapped around the pole screws.

[salvarsan]

I haven't done anything with that pickup yet. I'm waiting to get some 44 AWG wire. It has all the old wire removed and is sitting in a zip lock bag.

Whew! If I made a pickup with a big block
of aluminum like that, I'd nickname it "Eddy".

Do you have any measurements on the bobbin's inside dimensions?
You _know_ why.

Oops. Nevermind. Instigator already did it months ago.

-drh

[David Schwab]

Whew! If I made a pickup with a big block
of aluminum like that, I'd nickname it "Eddy".

That and the entire bridge pickup surround. They later switched to a plastic bracket.

Do you have any measurements on the bobbin's inside dimensions?
You _know_ why.

Oops. Nevermind. Instigator already did it months ago.

I'll give you mine anyway....

Distance between flats: .381"
Core (screws with foam rubber): about 0.152" X 2.24"
Screw pole pieces: 0.132 diameter

The flatwork is 1.103" X 3.035" but the coil is only wound out to about 0.80" X 2.51"

The rubber magnet is 0.309" thick, by 0.995" X 3.247"

[mkat]

I haven't done anything with that pickup yet. I'm waiting to get some 44 AWG wire. It has all the old wire removed and is sitting in a zip lock bag. I posted some pickups here when I took it apart. I was surprised to find foam rubber wrapped around the pole screws.

Thanks for the info. Yeah, I saw the pics and was surprised myself. There are a few holes under the magnets and a V notch cut into the side, drilling and cutting through rubber is easier than brittle materials.