Seeking Info & Opinions Re: Electromuse Eye-Beam Pickup (for Lap Steel)

[rjb]

I used to own an Electromuse with an "Eye Beam". It sounded great, not weak at all.... Certainly the one great thing about mine WAS the pickup.

That is encouraging news!

Did this pickup work or was it dead when you got it?

Good question. I got the lap steel in the '80s and vaguely remember it had "issues". Used it as a wall decoration for many years. When I recently opened it up, I found the pickup's core had rusted; the rust had "bubbled up", splitting the protective cloth tape and severing inner coil wire. But I did have a flood in the '00s that destroyed the original chipboard case- that may have been how the rust got started. So I can't say the pickup was dead when I got it. Uh, what was the question?

Also, these aren't really all that rare, but aren't "common" either

I've been finding that out. The other big kids already yelled at me about it.

I'll add that any "old timer" who had to "oil" their strings to keep them from rusting and uses that fact as some measure of the quality level of an instrument is, in my book, officially a "coot"!

I'm sure he's a coot, but was fondly remembering an old playmate. He said he stopped oiling iron strings when Gibson's monel strings came out.

[jason lollar]

I was just taking guesses never having seen one but when I hear it only had a few turns of wire on it it makes me think maybe it was made for an amp with different input impedance which I have ran across once in a while but apparantly thats not the case- youll have to charge up the magnet and see what it does if it seems extremely weak.

[Mike Sulzer]

I was just taking guesses never having seen one but when I hear it only had a few turns of wire on it it makes me think maybe it was made for an amp with different input impedance which I have ran across once in a while but apparantly thats not the case- youll have to charge up the magnet and see what it does if it seems extremely weak.

It sounds as though it was intended to be used with a transformer, like a low to high impedance microphone transformer.

[rjb]

It sounds as though it was intended to be used with a transformer, like a low to high impedance microphone transformer.

Cranking up the speculator:
I've seen (presumably) older ones online that came with a jack for a removable cord. Mine came with a 12-foot pigtail with standard 1/4" phone plug on the end. So maybe they were originally designed for low impedance, and the internal design never changed when they switched the "interface".

Like Jason said, I'll just have to crank it up & see what it does.

-rb

[rjb]

You want to weigh it on the bobbin, so you can then wind the bobbin to the same weight. I did that recently with a '76 Thunderbird bass pickup.

So... I can use any wire, as long as it weighs the same? Is that to maintain balance and avoid "neck dive"?
-rb

[rjb]

Just gathering information...

I used to own an Electromuse with an "Eye Beam". It sounded great, not weak at all...the one great thing about mine WAS the pickup.

Mr. Finger (or do you prefer to be called Sweet),

Could you tell me:
1) What the Electromuse was plugged into?
2) Whether the hand rest (or whatever you call the metal "U" that arches over the pickup) was installed?

Thanks,
-rb

[Sweetfinger]

Mr. Finger (or do you prefer to be called Sweet),

Could you tell me:
1) What the Electromuse was plugged into?
2) Whether the hand rest (or whatever you call the metal "U" that arches over the pickup) was installed?

Thanks,
-rb

Call me what you want, just don't call me between 4 a.m. and noon!
Mine was missing or never had a handrest/arched protective cover. I probably had it plugged into the shop test amp- an old Crate G-40C. I had to re-crimp the cover back down over the pickup on mine, and being the curious type, took a gander at the assembly before packing it back in. I remember thinking that it was a pretty cool and unusual pickup design considering its age. It might be the earliest sidewinder design on the market. Personally, I think you should use the original magnet(if you have it) and wind the coils with 43 or 44 up to where they fill out the internal dimension of the cover. I remember mine was a pretty tight fit under the cover. If you don't have the magnet, you'll probably have to use a ceramic bar from a cheep-o single coil because its unlikely you'll find an alnico bar with the correct orientation. Neos are going to have way too much string pull. Maybe someone can dig up the original patent for the thing.
Another thing- It is possible that I redid the harness in mine. Don't remember. If I did I could have put any value of pot in.

[Joe Gwinn]

That H-beam looks like it was cast. How hard is the metal? Can you file it?

It may be alnico or cobalt steel or the like. To retain a magnetic charge, it will be pretty hard, physically and magnetically.

Anyway, if it's what I suspect it is, it will be pretty hard to replicate in small quantities.

I would just clean the old one up by wet sanding with a 3M sponge-backed wet-dry sandpaper pad, dry carefully, and varnish.

[rjb]

We're a maroon.

...maybe they were originally designed for low impedance...

The Electromuse lap steels were often sold with a cosmetically-matching, Valco-manufactured amplifier- one model similar in design to early Fender Champs. So, presumably, the pickup was "meant" to plug into a "normal" guitar amp.

D'oh,
-rb

[rjb]

That H-beam looks like it was cast. How hard is the metal? Can you file it?

What you see in the photo is after a session with Mr. Rotary Tool and his grinding wheel. I removed much corrosion and pitting; before I rounded the ends, it was obvious the piece had been cut (or snapped?) from a long bar. The ends were pretty jagged.

I'm a novice to this stuff, and originally thought it was "plain old steel" because it looked to me like a piece of common hardware. I agree it must be something else, but couldn't tell Al Nico from Cobalt Steel if they were wearing name tags.

Thanks for the advice and information,
-rb

[rjb]

Mine was missing or never had a handrest/arched protective cover.

I asked because something Jason said on his site made me think the cover might help boost the signal level:
Supro® Steel Guitar Pickup
"The steel plate that goes over the strings spreads the magnetic field to surround the strings. This increases the pickup's sensitivity and reduces magnetic pull on the strings which increases sustain."

I probably had it plugged into the shop test amp- an old Crate G-40C.

...so, the Eye-Beam produced a healthy signal into a "modern" amp....

It might be the earliest sidewinder design on the market.

I thought a sidewinder was something else. The Eye-Beam is a single coil-wrapped magnet oriented parallel to the strings. I thought a sidewinder has a steel bar or line of polepieces in "normal" configuration, with a pair of coil-wrapped magnets oriented parallel to the strings, facing in to the bar or polepieces. (I didn't say that very well, but David Schwab can explain it better). So the Eye-Beam might be a pre-cursor to the sidewinder....

Personally, I think you should use the original magnet(if you have it) and wind the coils with 43 or 44 up to where they fill out the internal dimension of the cover. I remember mine was a pretty tight fit under the cover.

Hmm. Mine didn't have all that much magnet wire, and most of the winding was "clumped" in the middle of the bar.

Neos are going to have way too much string pull.

Even little baby Neos?

Maybe someone can dig up the original patent for the thing.

I know Wikipedia calls it a patented design, but I can't find a Patent Number or "Patent Applied For" anywhere on the pickup.

Another thing- It is possible that I redid the harness in mine. Don't remember. If I did I could have put any value of pot in.

Mine has the original Allen-Bradley pots. 20K volume pot is another reason to think low winds.
Maybe they switched at some point, and I've got an earlier version....

OK, I've got to stop wasting time with the computer, and get moving on this (and other, more important, things).

Thanks,
-rb

[Sweetfinger]

Regarding the Lollar pickup. The Eye-Beam isn't a "string through" pickup like the old Supro or horseshoe Ricks.

I may have assumed that it was a sidewinder based on the two outside blades and center core. I didn't disassemble mine.

Is the "H" shaped chunk of metal itself the magnet? If so, I'd just wind a big fat coil and move along. If the "H" is not the magnet, or is only weakly magnetized, my inclination would be to wind it as a sidewinder- Glue a bar magnet right in the center and wind your coils on either side. Your backup to that is to dump the "H" entirely and wind a flat Dearmond "Hershey bar" style coil and stuff it under the cover with a facing of whatever you wanted to show through the toaster slots(black plastic, gold foil, pearloid).

[Joe Gwinn]

What you see in the photo is after a session with Mr. Rotary Tool and his grinding wheel. I removed much corrosion and pitting; before I rounded the ends, it was obvious the piece had been cut (or snapped?) from a long bar. The ends were pretty jagged.

What triggered me was the black pits and organic shape.

Alnico and cobalt steel are pretty brittle, so snapping could well have been the approach.

I'm a novice to this stuff, and originally thought it was "plain old steel" because it looked to me like a piece of common hardware. I agree it must be something else, but couldn't tell Al Nico from Cobalt Steel if they were wearing name tags.

Can you file the metal, or does the file just skate on the metal?

If you grind the metal in a dark room, what do the sparks look like?

[rjb]

Regarding the Lollar pickup. The Eye-Beam isn't a "string through" pickup like the old Supro or horseshoe Ricks.

By itself, the Eye-Beam isn't a "string through" pickup. But with the hand guard in place, it does have a steel plate over the strings.

Is the "H" shaped chunk of metal itself the magnet?

Yup.

...with a facing of whatever you wanted to show through the toaster slots(black plastic, gold foil, pearloid).

Wow, I hadn't thought of using anything other than black cloth tape.* What a great way to customize my axe!**

* True; not being snarky.
** Approaching snarkiness.

Thanks again,
-rb

[rjb]

Can you file the metal, or does the file just skate on the metal?

I tried a few different files, and it didn't exactly cut like butter. I switched to the grinding wheel pretty quickly.

If you grind the metal in a dark room, what do the sparks look like?

I actually did grind it in the dark, by the light of a citronella candle. But I have no specific recollection of the sparks. They weren't polka-dotted, or three feet long....

Sorry,
-rb