PAF or???

[JoeM]

Anything about this pickup that would verify or not that's it's a genuine PAF?

[big_teee]

Hi Joe:
Some more pictures would be good.
Here's some info on a Web-site that may be helpful.
Gibson PAF Humbuckers Pickups Patent Applied For Pickups M69 M-69 pickup rings - Vintage Guitars Info
Are there any stamp marks on the feet?
Is the Pickup still working, and can you measure the DCR?
T

[JoeM]

Thanks Terry,

I should have taken more care in photographing the PU, but here's another and one of the guitar it's in - a 1960 Gibson ES-345.

The PU works fine and measures 7.32K installed in the Guitar. The bridge PU I know has been replaced, it a Duncan JB, measures close to 16K.

[big_teee]

Thanks Terry,
I should have taken more care in photographing the PU, but here's another and one of the guitar it's in - a 1960 Gibson ES-345.
The PU works fine and measures 7.32K installed in the Guitar. The bridge PU I know has been replaced, it a Duncan JB, measures close to 16K.

I don't know much about PAFs, but that year model, and it does have the phillips screws, and the stamp marks on the feet.
I will move this to the main Pickup Area, More Vintage guys hang there.
Good Luck,
T

[big_teee]

Bump!
Can some of you PAF Guys Look at this?
JoeM is wanting to know what he has?
Thanks,
Terry

[David Schwab]

No one is going to be able to give a definitive answer based on some photos. It's probably the stock pickup, but why is the decal scratched off?

Is this just because you want to know, or I'm guessing more likely it's a how much is this worth question?

[JoeM]

David, I'm not concerned how much it's worth. It came with the guitar in the photo and the person I bought it from mentioned he wanted to part it out. Since I know the bridge isnt stock, just wondered if there was something about the pickup that would show it's not original.

I'm quite aware it's difficult to be absolute with just a photo, but I'm sure the PAF guys would be able to tell me immediately if something was clearly showing it's NOT a PAF.

[jonson]

It is difficult from a pic but there are still plenty of them out there not yet in the hands of collectors and money makers. It's pointing in the right direction and I see you are starting to strip it with the screws out so simple things like all black pigtails and two strand shielded cable are instant giveaway if wrong. Sorry but there are plenty of guys who would say no and offer nothing and you are in Ca. How far from Seymour Duncan as he is an honest man and may be worth a trip.

[JGundry]

It looks like it could be the stock pickup. However the black mounting ring is not an original M-69 ring so the ring has been replaced.

[David Schwab]

David, I'm not concerned how much it's worth. It came with the guitar in the photo and the person I bought it from mentioned he wanted to part it out.

See that's what I was talking about. This disgusting habit of "parting out" a perfectly good vintage guitar to make a buck. Then what are you left with?

[jonson]

The rings could well have been changed when the Duncan went in. The odd bit to me is 2 pickups 20 years apart both showing almost identical ageing on the covers. So are they both origional or both been aged. If someone wanted to keep the origional covers then why swap the rings or has most of this been parted out allready.

[David Schwab]

The rings could well have been changed when the Duncan went in. The odd bit to me is 2 pickups 20 years apart both showing almost identical ageing on the covers. So are they both origional or both been aged. If someone wanted to keep the origional covers then why swap the rings or has most of this been parted out allready.

I'm assuming it's the original cover, since JBs don't usually come with covers.

[JGundry]

Are you sure this guitar is a 1960? Looking at the photo of the guitar there are few things that make this guitar likely a 66' or older. Mainly small bevel on the pickguard and headstock angle. Next would be a possible narrow nut. Also I think the switch tip on a 60 would be ambered bakelite. I have two 67' ES-335's and they are great guitars but they are not in the same ballpark as far as price goes with a 60' ES-345 or ES-335. The guitar still might have P.A.F. spec. pat number pickups but you won't know unless the cover comes off.

[JoeM]

Thank you all for the replies.

Yes, It's a 1960. It may not show well in the photo, but the neck angle is a lot shallower than later 335s or 345s. The pickguard is not original, an original '60 would have the guard extending down more toward the bridge. Serial numbers indicate late 1960.

Kind of a mystery. The changes from stock as well as the jack plate and a headstock repair (very well done) takes the vintage value out of it and puts in an affordable players category. I saw one on E-Bay not too long ago, all stock but otherwise nearly identical, with hardly any wear for 25X what I paid for this.

Anyway, I appreciate the comments. Based on the comments here and the link Terry posted, and descriptions of what a PAF sounds like it seems that the neck is the original PAF. I have no clue what's up with the decal though, unless someone tried to remove it to place on another pup to pass it off as a PAF.

[JGundry]

I love these player grade vintage guitars. Just for comparison this last weekend I bought a red 67' ES-335 for $2600. The issues that made it player grade were stop tail added (in the correct location), non original pickups and non original cream rings and old Grover tuners added long ago. Other than that no breaks and apparently all original otherwise. The guitar arrived Tuesday and the funny part is it has an older wide bevel 64' guard and a bakelite switch tip that I could probably sell on Ebay for $500. As it is I'm going to refret it myself, put ThroBak pickups and ThroBak black butyrate M-69 rings on it and enjoy playing it at gigs without freaking out over the value of the guitar. As is it plays and sounds great.