Opinions on the Adams winders?

[musikman013]

I am still a newbie at pickup making but have been a Luthier for 13 years. I would love any info that anyone can share about these Adams winders before i commit to buying one. The other hand made winder i used died and i was considering picking this one up.

Any info or opinions helps!

Thanks


Adams Pickup Winder

[SkinnyWire]

No idea on the quality, but it looks a bit like the Schatten winder:

STEWMAC.COM : Pictures of Schatten Pickup Winder

You can probably piece something together for less, but it seems like a reasonable price if you want to avoid the effort to build your own. I think one or two folks here can comment on the capability and reliability of the Shatten.

[Jeff Callahan]

I started with a Schatten, and fell into a Adams as well, I haven't used either in a few years, the Adams is comparable to the Schatten, but both need a bit of tweaking in my opinion to make them wind nice. I think the Schatten was closer to spinning true than the Adams. My Schatten is the second generation type which means old (I think they are on at least 4th now). So the Adams was a bit nicer in the sense of digital counter and enclosed mechanics, all of which has been changed on the newer Schattens.

If i were you, (cheap advise here), I'd buy the build you own Schatten kit from Stew-mac, and spend some time making sure the mounting plates are spinning true. That has been my demise with those type of winders. It is crucial in my opinion to make certain you are spinning without any run out.

Other than that you may want to upgrade the motor, my Schatten was slower (old model so may have been changed) than the Adams.

You will want to buy some stainless rod stock and some stop collars and make a few wire traverse setups that can be swapped out instead of constantly adjusting the stop collars when you need to wind a different style of pickup. This is a real time saver and well worth the few bucks (nobody likes to spend more time adjusting the traverse than winding).

It would be better to have a motor that runs CW and CCW so you only have one face plate to true up. It also would be less of a hassle to reverse wind say a middle strat pup (don't need the second wire traverse set up) . I found that on both winders, one side of the winder was more true than the other, so if I wind a Strat set with RWRP middle, it was problematic and time consuming to set up and execute.

I would also remount the winder on a bigger board (see pics), this will allow you to space things out how you feel comfortable. On the Adams, I raised the traverse bar up a 1/4" to match the Schatten, which was what I was used to.

All these things are small points, and just about anything will work, but hopefully you find some points that can save you a little hassle.

Good luck,
Jeff

[musikman013]

Well thank you both, I'm familiar with the Schatten and know the Adams is basically the same thing, I was just wondering if anyone had experience with the Adams as it looks a bit nicer quality. Looks can be deceiving though. Jeff I really appreciate all the info! Thank you much!

[Jeff Callahan]

My Schatten was built out of aluminum and my Adams was built from MDF (don't know what Schatten is doing now). Either one is a good entry level winder. It comes down to how straight the arbor is, how flat the mounting plate is, and how well the parts (holes and set screws) were machined. Probably a roll of the dice. I doubt either manufacturer dial indicates the face plate to make sure it is spinning true.

You can't expect that high of tolerances for that price, just make sure you dial it in before you get to far and you won't be disappointed.

Adams wins in the bikini contest though

Jeff

[musikman013]

Is there a different winder that you use? What would that be? Im always trying to take it to the next level! Please do share.

[Joe Gwinn]

If i were you, (cheap advise here), I'd buy the build you own Schatten kit from Stew-mac, and spend some time making sure the mounting plates are spinning true. That has been my demise with those type of winders. It is crucial in my opinion to make certain you are spinning without any run out.

In practice, this means you have to have access to a lathe or vertical mill to make the mounting plates. It's just possible with a drill press, if you have a good enough unit and really understand how old-time machinists made their magic, and have their tools. Making the plates accurately enough is completely impossible with any handheld drill. So, don't try to make the mounting plates et al unless you have the equipment. Just buy the plates, or hire someone with the machine tools.

Other than that you may want to upgrade the motor, my Schatten was slower (old model so may have been changed) than the Adams.

The Schatten motor is simply too small. There are a number of threads on the motor issue.

[Jeff Callahan]

Yeah I agree with Joe, I had my plate machined by a machinist, a little pricey, but spins perfect. I wouldn't make new plates for the Schatten unless you have the skill and tools to do so (it may cost more than the machine to hire it out). First try to manipulate them to make it work if you find you are having problems. Also, a nicely constructed bobbin is just as important, and may be more of a problem than the run out you may have in your winder.

Also I heard the motor issues as well, that's why I mentioned it, but I guess I was lucky with mine. I never replaced the motor, and I wound many hundreds of pickups on it. It is pretty slow with tension on it, but suited me well for the couple years I used it.

Lots of winder info on this forum, but here's what I am using since you asked...

It is a Gorman Starwinder, with a face plate I designed to accurately center most standard bobbins. The holes in the face plate are for location pins that locate the bobbins with a press fit onto to pins (all spacings of humbuckers screw and slug as well as P90), and there is a 4-40 thread for the fender stuff in the center. I have it setup for hand winding here, but can also be programed for machine winding.


Jeff

[David Schwab]

Not only is the Schatten motor too small, but the motor speed control board is a bad design. Mine darted running very slow, and after talking to Schatten on the phone, he talked me into buying a new motor. That started running slow also. Then I realized it was the speed control board. He wanted me to send them the winder to repair, but I needed it, so I removed the belt from the motor, and the left platen, and chucked a DeWalt variable speed still to the left axle, and it's been that way ever since. Works much better now.

I have had zero problems with the mounting plate not being square. The bobbins spin just fine with no wobble.

I have an older Schatten with a steel enclosure, but I think both the Schatten and the Adams winder are over priced for what you get.

[Jeff Callahan]

I hear that Mojo will be putting out a winder early next year, maybe they have heard the complaints and will put a bigger motor in their version. To me it means more to have an accurate winder than to have one with more power.

Jeff

[musikman013]

If this is true about Mojo it makes me want to wait and see but at the same time i am eager to get to winding asap! I have got the winding fever!

[David Schwab]

I'm not sure how a hand winder could be "more accurate." You compensate as you wind. All you need is a motor and a way to hold the bobbin and a counter. That's why the Schatten and Adams winders are too expensive IMO.

Jeff, I have no idea why you would be using that Gorman as a hand winder! Seems like a waste of an expensive machine.

I'm gong to keep my modified Schatten as a quick hand winder for prototypes and such, but I'm moving my production work to automated winders. Then I will have accuracy and repeatability.

[jason lollar]

the mojo winder is probably the same one I posted in tools. There were some comments about the faceplate being on the left but to me even though I wond on the right it wouldnt bother me at all- its all the same- back and forth

[David Schwab]

the mojo winder is probably the same one I posted in tools. There were some comments about the faceplate being on the left but to me even though I wond on the right it wouldnt bother me at all- its all the same- back and forth

Oh, so it's the WSC winder? It sure looks better than the Schatten/Adams.

Yeah, I don't care if it's on the left or right. I'd just move my chair to the left a little. lol

[David King]

I thought this thread would be about the Adams-Maxwell winders. What a bummer someone borrowed that name for another cheapass knockoff of a dreadful Schatten design.
Adams Maxwell 1201 3A Bobbin Winder | eBay Someone lucky got this one for about what the Schitten sells for.
They normally sell for about $1200 and up.
http://www.adamsmaxwell.com/images/P...ec%20sheet.pdf