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Eden WT-1205 - trim pot adjustment to increase preamp gain?

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  • Eden WT-1205 - trim pot adjustment to increase preamp gain?

    A little history first...

    When Eden first released the 2 channel WT-1205 bass amp, a lot of users complained that there was not enough gain available in the preamp stage, particularly if they were using a passive bass. Eden's explanation was that they held back preamp gain so that people using high output basses would not damage their speakers when the dynamic bass and treble boosts and/or Turbo Boost (+6 dB) functions were also engaged. Essentially this strategy amounts to 'Idiot proofing' to avoid unnecessary speaker warranty claims. After numerous complaints from users who felt they were qualified to set the proper gain structure, Eden subsequently offered several 'gain increase mods' to address their concerns.

    My amplifier has received all of the 'gain mods' offered by Eden but I would still like to have more gain available in the preamp stage. In my case I am unable to get the preamp clip light to clip unless I turn the gain control to the maximum setting and hit my strings VERY hard. Consequently, I am unable to find the sweet spot and maximize signal to noise.

    Upon examining the attached WT-1205 schematics I noticed that there are gain trim pots (VR101 on upper board, VR1 on lower board) inside the amp. I was wondering if I could simply adjust these pots to ramp up the available gain in the preamp or will I also need to alter the value of the resistors (R185, R136, R138 on upper board, R235, R236, R238 on lower board)?

    I have also attached the spec sheet for the THAT4301 dynamic processor in case it will help someone answer my question.

    Eden has been unwilling to provide any assistance other than to tell me that the 'gain mods' should have addressed my issue. I do not agree with this assessment and several other WT-1205 owners I have spoken with share my opinion.

    Thanks in advance for your help.

    Cheers,
    Duff2
    Attached Files
    Last edited by duff2; 12-17-2009, 02:07 AM.

  • #2
    THAT 4301

    There are two pinout drawings for the 4301 IC.
    One is for DIP & the other is for a surface mount IC.
    The DIP has "legs " that are soldered into holes in the PC board.
    The surface mount is just that. No holes. Just pads.
    Can you identify which IC you have?

    Comment


    • #3
      It's a DIP.




      Cheers,
      Duff2

      Comment


      • #4
        The input, including the tube section, appears to be missing in the above schematics. Might be an idea to increase the gain at the first gain stage.

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        • #5
          I see input jacks and two tubes on page 2 of the "lower" file.
          Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 12Bass View Post
            The input, including the tube section, appears to be missing in the above schematics. Might be an idea to increase the gain at the first gain stage.
            I have been told that in Eden amps, including the WT-1205, the tube doesn't provide any gain. Apparently it's being used as an impedance matching device in this circuit (unity gain, cathode follower configuration).

            As Enzo has stated, the part of the circuit containing the tubes is on page 2 of the lower board schematic.

            Cheers,
            Duff2

            Comment


            • #7
              Duff,

              I played WT300 yesterday and it's hard to believe that WT1205 needs any gain modifications. I used maybe 30% of the amp possibilities and it was already too loud. Have you checked it with another bass guitar? Assuming that you did, why didn't you try to adjust VR1, which is described as "Gain Trim"? It changes the voltage on 4301 that determines the gain of the chip. Before you do it, just measure the voltage on the trimmer (or on R235) in order to be able to revert the changes. I don't think that you need to change anything else. Of course it would be nice to do this adjusment with a signal generator and an oscilloscope. Do you have it?

              PS: where did you find information on required "gain modifications" in this amp? I'm asking because I fix Eden amps but I couldn't find any info on this subject.

              Mark

              Comment


              • #8
                Doh! Completely missed the second page of both schematics.... Still trying to decipher what's going on where, as the WT1205 looks quite a bit different from the earlier WT amplifiers. The gain staging is a lot different too.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Yes, it is much more complex amp than for example WT300. It has a studio quality compressor based on THAT Corp chip 4301. Additionally, it has also limiters on preamp outputs. They (the limiters) can also influence the problem mentioned by Duff. That's why I recommend investigating the problem with a generator and an oscilloscope. It is possible that the limiter is set up incorrectly. But the trimmer description "Gain Trim" suggests that it's rather a problem with the compressor adjustment.

                  EDIT; also please note that there are several limiters in this amp. One is based on RV100B, RQ100, RQ101, RQ102, and the other on U204, OP200, Q204 and Q205. So an oscilloscope is a must.

                  Mark
                  Last edited by MarkusBass; 12-18-2009, 02:26 PM. Reason: Info on limiters

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