Advice on speaker 30watt versus 50 watt weber blue dog

[d. spree]

Am about to build a Tweed Deluxe - either a Mission or a TubeDepot. I want to upgrade the speaker and love the sound of the Weber Blue Dogs - my question is do I go for a 30 watt or 50 watt speaker - most kits come with a 50 watt. What are the things to consider in terms of performance? Appreciate any responses.

Ken

[cminor9]

I put a 50w in my 5e3 and it's great! The 30 would do too. That is a great speaker for that amp. I don't know how much speaker breakup you'd get with a 30 over a 50 because both are well over the power of a 5e3 , but that's assuming you even want speaker breakup. Maybe the 30 would compress more but I dunno...that amp is also pretty compressed as is.

[Bruce / Mission Amps]

I am not a big fan of the Jensen MOD 12-50 speakers... especially in the tweed amps. But, different strokes for different folks!
For a generic speaker, the C12Q is not bad at all even though it is not super efficient.
I actually prefer the Eminence NEO magnet Lil' Texas or NEO Tonker Lite with a slightly modified 5E3.
Some of the Weber Speakers are real good... the 12A125 would be my first choice for a classic speaker tone, after about 30-50 hours of break in.
My friend Adam at Tungsten Amps has a custom made AlNiCo from Weber, based on the 12A125 Jensen P12Q,.... that is stellar!!
The blue dogs are good too.... the AlNiCo 15 and 30 are excellent... again they are tight speakers and need a good work out before deciding if they are right for you.

[pops]

One thing i have noticed is that a higher watt speaker is usually warmer than the lower watt speaker. If you want a warmer sound use the 50.

[Chuck H]

Well, what is the physical difference between the 30W and 50W speaker of the same name? I would think that they both use the same cone for the same tone??? So it really comes down to heat dissapation. What is it about the 50W that allows for more heat dissapation? Does this difference affect the voice of the speaker? If they both use the same cone and have similar efficiencies the break in time would be the same. Since both are so far above the 5e3 wattage there should be no difference in compression induced by the speaker. In a perfect world both speakers should perform identical in that amp. But we know that isn't true. So what are the physical differences and how do they affect the tone? that's the real Q. I would guess that the higher wattage speaker uses a slightly larger magnet and, so, has a little more bass. This based on some rough experience.

FWIW I've liked the sound and descriptin of the ceramic Blue dog for years, but never tried one (I never seem to get past my usual Celestion choices before I find a speaker I like in a particular amp). I'd be interested in the final results and what speakers you are comparing too.

[d. spree]

Well, what is the physical difference between the 30W and 50W speaker of the same name? I would think that they both use the same cone for the same tone??? So it really comes down to heat dissapation. What is it about the 50W that allows for more heat dissapation? Does this difference affect the voice of the speaker? If they both use the same cone and have similar efficiencies the break in time would be the same. Since both are so far above the 5e3 wattage there should be no difference in compression induced by the speaker. In a perfect world both speakers should perform identical in that amp. But we know that isn't true. So what are the physical differences and how do they affect the tone? that's the real Q. I would guess that the higher wattage speaker uses a slightly larger magnet and, so, has a little more bass. This based on some rough experience.

FWIW I've liked the sound and descriptin of the ceramic Blue dog for years, but never tried one (I never seem to get past my usual Celestion choices before I find a speaker I like in a particular amp). I'd be interested in the final results and what speakers you are comparing too.

I will keep you posted - I am in the middle of the build from a Tubedepot kit - I have completed the Chassis and am wiring the board - waiting for the cabinet and have not yet heard from Weber where I oredred the 50 watt blue dog about a week ago. My board build is waiting some info from Tubedepot about upgraing the couopling capacitors - want to use orange drops but the kits caps are .1uf / 630 volts and the nearest thing I have been able to find in orange drops are .1uf / 600 volts. Am wondering if this is an okay substitution and have contacted tubedepot but not yet heard back.

[Chuck H]

The 600V Sprague's would be fine. One important thing when using non axial caps in PTP or eyelet board construction is to make sure the bend in the lead is done carefully, well below the enamel so as not to crack the seal. I've cracked plenty without issue but it could reduce longevity, so I've heard.

[d. spree]

The 600V Sprague's would be fine. One important thing when using non axial caps in PTP or eyelet board construction is to make sure the bend in the lead is done carefully, well below the enamel so as not to crack the seal. I've cracked plenty without issue but it could reduce longevity, so I've heard.

Thanks for the advice - will check very carefully when bending the cap leads - this means I can get the board finished very soon.

[pops]

I have had the Jensen 20W (i think or 25) and 50w in the same amp and the 50 was much warmer and not near as bright. I don't believe they use the same cone in both and magnet size are definitely different, not sure about the gap on the voice coil, may be slightly larger. And not sure of the efficiency either, but i do know a higher power speaker is warmer. Now that is not always the case, but in speakers that are similar C12N,C12R, whatever it stands true. Jensen builds speakers that have more power , but are built to sound different and some can be brighter. All speakers will be warmer after they are broken in.

[d. spree]

Thanks for the advice - will check very carefully when bending the cap leads - this means I can get the board finished very soon.

Thanks Pops

[tubeswell]

'nother vote for the weber 12A125.

I had a Jensen RI P12R that I only just put in an 18W tweed amp, and it let me down almost immediately (in the middle of a gig) the night after I put it in. Supposed to be rated at 25W, but I don't believe it. A G12M (20W) greenback is more reliable (because I had one on that same amp for 3 years and I took it out to try the Jensen, but the GB is still going fine).

[clyde1]

I'm not a fan generally of the Jensen RI's. To reiterate, the Webers are the way to go, 12A125, Blue Dog alnico 30 watt, not as bright as the 15 watt, not as responsive either. Another great Weber is the Silver Bell, ceramic is cleaner than the alnico, fabulous speaker.