I Thought I Wound a Pickup but, Got an Ice Pick Instead

[old guy]

As a generally happy guy, my first & 2nd attempt at winding a premium PAF has sent me to the anals of Fender

I bought the best quality components, assembled a variable speed winder (0-10,000rpm) with splindle running true, had all the time in the world and more focus than a lizard on a cockroach YET, both attempts sounded 70% less in volume compared to a 57 Classic AND, high 'E' and 'B' strings made wax flow from my ears.
I went through all my A2, A3, A4 & A5 bar stock magnets yet, the shrill, piercing treble wouldn't go away nor, would the volume increase.

USA nickel silver covers and baseplates
USA unplated 1018 slugs & plated 1018 screws
42AWG plain enamel wire (purple)
28 guage lead wires
USA steel spacer
Hand carved Michigan Rock Maple spacer
USA PAF spec butryte bobbins
braided shield wire

1st completed pup;
screw side 3.9k
slug side 3.7k
Total DCR: 7.6k

2nd completed pup;
screw side 4.1k
slug side 4.5k
Total DCR: 8.6k

[Stratz]

What direction did you wind the coils and how did you wire them together?

The parts you listed should make a decent sounding pickup providing the magnets were charged to an acceptable level.
If a small flat blade screwdriver will stick to the slugs or screws the magnet should be charged enough for the pickup to sound decent enough.

Are you sure you're not having phase issues?

[copperheadroads]

It's the Hand carved Michigan Rock Maple spacer !!!! Theres you problem!!!
you need Silver Maple from north of the border .....
Other variables affect you tone . the way it is wound for one has great influence on tone.

[big_teee]

I agree with Stratz.
Sounds like a phase issue.
Needs to be wired similar to this.
Google Image Result for http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/i-3200/3200_03primer.gif
Both bobbins wound in the same direction and wired like the diagram.

[old guy]

What direction did you wind the coils and how did you wire them together?

The parts you listed should make a decent sounding pickup providing the magnets were charged to an acceptable level.
If a small flat blade screwdriver will stick to the slugs or screws the magnet should be charged enough for the pickup to sound decent enough.

Are you sure you're not having phase issues?

Both coils wound the same direction ... counterclockwise.
The 2 'outside' or 'finish' wires are wired together for the series thing.
One 'inside' or 'start' wire goes to ground (the screw side bobbin). That's soldered to braid & baseplate.
The other goes to the 'hot' lead of the braided wire.
North side of mag goes to slugs side.

No phase issues if you mean with the 2nd pup. It's not even installed. Both cavities in SG Standard are empty as I stuff one pup in at a time until I find what I need. Test amps are Marshall 100 head, Marshall 50 head and Fender DeVille. All amp controls are 'flatted' out.

[big_teee]

Both coils wound the same direction ... counterclockwise.
The 2 'outside' or 'finish' wires are wired together for the series thing.
One 'inside' or 'start' wire goes to ground (the screw side bobbin). That's soldered to braid & baseplate.
The other goes to the 'hot' lead of the braided wire.
North side of mag goes to slugs side.

No phase issues if you mean with the 2nd pup. It's not even installed. Both cavities in SG Standard are empty as I stuff one pup in at a time until I find what I need. Test amps are Marshall 100 head, Marshall 50 head and Fender DeVille. All amp controls are 'flatted' out.

The phase issue we were both referring to is within the same pickup.
for example if both coils are wound the same direct and you wired one start to one finish, then that pickup would be out of phase.
Or If you accidently flipped one coil over when putting them together, which granted is hard to do with PAF type pickups.
I did that once in a mini bucker, both the top and bottom look the same, and one got flipped.
Also if you wired one coil CW, and one CCW and wired finish to finish then that pickup would be out of phase.
Sounds like all of your wiring looks good.
What Pots, and what size Tone Caps are you using.
T

[eschertron]

Both coils wound the same direction ... counterclockwise.
The 2 'outside' or 'finish' wires are wired together for the series thing.
One 'inside' or 'start' wire goes to ground (the screw side bobbin). That's soldered to braid & baseplate.
The other goes to the 'hot' lead of the braided wire.
North side of mag goes to slugs side.

don't the magnets need to be opposite polarity for the RW/RP humbucking effect to take place?

[copperheadroads]

If everything is fine ,give it a day or so to see if the tone smoothens out any

[big_teee]

don't the magnets need to be opposite polarity for the RW/RP humbucking effect to take place?

Because one coil is against the north side of the magnet, and one coil is against the South side?
This creates the RW/RP.
humbucker pickup polarity - Google Search

[old guy]

The phase issue we were both referring to is within the same pickup.
What Pots, and what size Tone Caps are you using.
T

The bobbins are wound as per the Stew Mac pic ... that was my reference for winding. They are the butryte ones with the square & round hole deal so, that, combined with a magic marker tick, keep my alignment straight.
My wires are white for starts and, are soldered on before the wind begins. My ends are black with the screw side one going to ground.
Pots are the 'Historic Spec Gibson 500k Audio' which measure in at 510k and 512k.

Caps are not used as I'm going alligator clips to braid and hot,then clipped to Switchcraft jack. I don't want any 'coloration' of the tone at this point. To me, you are only as good as your source. I got a handful of fancy caps, 22s & 15s, but over the years of performance and swapping things back & forth, I found nothing that exceeded the performance of the stock Gibson ceramic disks.

[eschertron]

Because one coil is against the north side of the magnet, and one coil is against the South side?
This creates the RW/RP.
humbucker pickup polarity - Google Search

My mistake. When the OP said N to Slug side, I was thinking that meant N up on both bobbins

[big_teee]

The bobbins are wound as per the Stew Mac pic ... that was my reference for winding. They are the butryte ones with the square & round hole deal so, that, combined with a magic marker tick, keep my alignment straight.
My wires are white for starts and, are soldered on before the wind begins. My ends are black with the screw side one going to ground.
Pots are the 'Historic Spec Gibson 500k Audio' which measure in at 510k and 512k.

Caps are not used as I'm going alligator clips to braid and hot,then clipped to Switchcraft jack. I don't want any 'coloration' of the tone at this point. To me, you are only as good as your source. I got a handful of fancy caps, 22s & 15s, but over the years of performance and swapping things back & forth, I found nothing that exceeded the performance of the stock Gibson ceramic disks.

Did you say the screw side Black finish is Grounded.
If the white leads are the starts, then one white would be grounded, and one white to the hot leads.
I like to test the pickups in the guitar with the pots and caps used in final assembly.
If in a LP type, I use 4 500k pots.
I like a .022uf in the neck and either a .033uf, or .047uf in the bridge tone.
If the guitar is a mahogany neck, it may be darker sounding than a LP type with a Maple neck.
Use whatever tone value you prefer, but I would test the pickups with both Vol and Tone pots, and Caps installed.
Good Luck,

[old guy]

Thanks guys!!! Let's all have a shot out of Copperhead's Gibson bottle ! I'll undo the tape wrap and look again in the morning. I greatly appreciate your time and input.

[old guy]

OK ... here we go ... I can't unwrap my crepe tape ... it's pulled on so tight and has sealed so good, I don't wanna chance breaking the short start lead. How do you check for phase when you have a 2-wire braided line, not a 4-wire. Can you do it with an analog multimeter and piece of plain steel rod across the slug row and screw row?

[rjb]

...when you have a 2-wire braided line, not a 4-wire

If I'm reading posts #10 and 12 correctly, the concern is that you shunted one of the coils by connecting both ends to ground.
That could account for low output and trebly sound.

If by 2-wire braided line, you mean 2 wires plus shield (AKA mic cable), measure the resistance between the 2 wires.
If you mean coax cable (like originally used for pickups), measure between the central wire and the shield.
Your reading should be the total DCR for both coils in series (7.6 or 8.6K).
If that part is OK, then you can start worrying about phasing.