Anyone use SHUGUANG tubes?

[Alan0354]

Congrats!
Sounds like a hellofa Deal!
Let us know how they turn out.
T

Thanks. It's still available if you need it.

[Alan0354]

I never try to compare different tubes. Maybe there's a difference. But just like the 4 different Marshall Plexi 50W OT comparison test, yes, there is slight difference between them, But I think I can make it work with any one of them.

As you all know, a slight change of the value of the tone stack makes a huge difference in sound, slight change of divider chain in the signal path, value of the caps in parallel with the resistor in the signal chain.........All that make a day and night difference in the sound. I just feel the tiny variation of the same component made by different brand is not significant. You can easily get back the difference by massaging some values of the components of the circuit.

In my amp, I make it a point to buy the cheapest components available, make it a point to use all MF resistors, cheap Chinese caps from Weber for tone stack, all small caps are ceramic disc cap.......and now using the cheapest tubes.........Classic Tone OT.

[Audiotexan]

I never try to compare different tubes. Maybe there's a difference.

I think it's quite a worthwhile experiment for most, assuming they have the ears for it. There's often substantial differences in tones to be had by 'tube rolling' (comparing different tubes). From circuit to circuit it's amazing how one might prefer a given tube, then turn around and in the next amp, that same tube is not even in competition. For instance, my MkIII simul-class LOVES a Mullard in V1. But in my VTM60, I preferred the Shug's.

But again, that's more noticeable/applicable with NOS types, and assuming you have at least 4-5 different ones to try.

For instance, I'd never use Telefunkens in a guitar amp. But they're first choice in a hi-fi. With Amperex B/B being a close second.

Edit: There's quite a difference with tubes alone thanks to different material components used, much less processes, but, bearing in mind, if you're considering production runs of any value, you're probably best to do as most current builders do, and build/voice your circuit around what's going to be readily available.
/Everything I mentioned above the edit, is more for expanding your own horizons about the differences that do exist, and do affect tone./

[gui_tarzan]

I guess my choice of Ruby GZ34/5AR4 over the others was a good one.

And I just ordered a 10 pack of those tubes. Four bucks each is too good to pass up to have for projects and such at the least, if they're good they're well worth it.

[Alan0354]

Price is very good, I even bought 4 6L6!!! I am debating whether to buy 4 EL34 and 4 6V6. Being a home brew warrior, that will last me a long long time!!!!

I already received the 10 12AX7 two days ago, arrive even before I can finish putting in the preamp into my Bassman. Hopefully I can fire it up tomorrow and use the new tubes.

I crushed one of the 6L6 of my Pro Reverb, it's kind of dead right now. I just received the 6L6 as I am typing this, I am going to completely retube the Pro Reverb with all the Shuguangs tonight and see how they work.


Guys, if you are in need of tubes......which I am sure you do. Go to ebay. This is really good price, stock up!!! I am!!!

[Leo_Gnardo]

Four bucks each is too good to pass up to have for projects and such at the least, if they're good they're well worth it.

Holey sox! where did you find 'em at $4 ??

[g1]

Holey sox! where did you find 'em at $4 ??

See post #10.

[bsco]

With my short tube experience I've wound up Anti JJ, Pro TAD, and had pretty good luck with New Sensor tubes (Sovtek, Tung-Sol).
The TADs are China made, either to their specs, or with lots of TAD testing and Screening.
I've never tried, but always heard good things About Ruby.

Somebody correct me if I am wrong please, but I think the Traynor line of amplifiers do use RUBY tubes from time to time and I think they use Sovtek as well.....the one's that I have had to service sounded good to me...but I don't buy lots of tubes to test in my Marshall JMP......and Fender uses G/T so when I have to do a warranty repair, I have to use those...Mesa has their own LINE of tubes as well....To me, as long as it sounds good, and don't short out in a short amount of time, and are fairly quiet, then that works for me....having said that, I have gone to our local music store, bought a new G/T tube only to get it home and find out it was worse than the one I replaced....I even had them cause hum.....and they are all made by a handful of manufacturers.....but all kinds of brand names...just like the vcr racket...so when somebody says to me that they perfer a particular brand over a number of others, they do have their reasons...I respect that....but for me I can't think of a single brand that I would say are the best....then again, I have not been at the music side of electronics nowhere near as long as some of you...there is still much for me to learn....

[Leo_Gnardo]

See post #10.

Had a look at post 10 as you suggested, thanks g-one, and what a hoot! HOW can they sell at these prices? Their store is only a mile away - and they charge whopping BIG prices there for tubes. (Some of my customers insist on buying their own at Alto before bringing their amps here. I cringe when I see what they pay at the store. One fellow with a 100W Marshall had 3 out of 11 tubes bad, right out of the box. 27% failure rate = yikes! At another Alto branch the in house amp guy offered to charge only half an hour labor for plugging the tubes into an amp. Not testing, setting bias, none of that. Just plugging them in.) As long as they average a profit, it's their business, I'm not gonna care. But I may have to wind up the salesmen: I can buy the same item, on the internet, from YOU, and get an 80% discount. So why should I buy them from the store? Bizarre!

Distinction between RUBY and Shuguang 5AR4 - note Stan's comment in post #8. Although Ruby is a major Shuggie dealer, the 5AR4's they sell are made by their own separate production line, not Shuguang. So Alto may be selling $4 5AR4's all right, let me know how that works out. If they go up like so many firecrackers don't blame Ruby, they didn't make 'em.

bsco, Groove Tube is, and has been for about 5 years, owned outright by Fender. You notice the matching system for output tubes no longer grades into 10 groups, only 3 now. GT as a rebrander will source from wherever's they can, and hopefully cull out the worst before offering them for sale or installing in new Fender amps. I've seen all sorts of brands, all the currently available ones plus semi-oldies like Tesla, EI, =C=, and others, relabeled and sold by GT. You'll also notice GT now only sells tubes that fit Fender amps. All the oddball items have gone by the wayside. They are there to serve Fender first and us next. That's the way the cookie bounces.

[big_teee]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong please, but I think the Traynor line of amplifiers do use RUBY tubes from time to time and I think they use Sovtek as well.....the one's that I have had to service sounded good to me...but I don't buy lots of tubes to test in my Marshall JMP......and Fender uses G/T so when I have to do a warranty repair, I have to use those...Mesa has their own LINE of tubes as well....To me, as long as it sounds good, and don't short out in a short amount of time, and are fairly quiet, then that works for me....having said that, I have gone to our local music store, bought a new G/T tube only to get it home and find out it was worse than the one I replaced....I even had them cause hum.....and they are all made by a handful of manufacturers.....but all kinds of brand names...just like the vcr racket...so when somebody says to me that they perfer a particular brand over a number of others, they do have their reasons...I respect that....but for me I can't think of a single brand that I would say are the best....then again, I have not been at the music side of electronics nowhere near as long as some of you...there is still much for me to learn....

I said that about JJ, because I've had too many failures.
Both Power and preamp tubes.
You can use the JJs if you want to, I choose not to.
I have one Traynor that I bought in 08, and it came with sovtek 5881WXT tubes.
They are the tubes I always Fire up a new amp with.
They are IMO kind of sterile sounding, but seem to be built like a tank.
Once I get the amp stable, then I put in a new set of choice.
T

[Alan0354]

Update:

New tubes in Pro Reverb, everything sounded good. Tapped the tubes and no funny sound. So I call this good. I don't see 70% acceptable, it's 100% so far. I am happy.

[Leo_Gnardo]

I don't see 70% acceptable, it's 100% so far. I am happy.

Maybe they only sell the dodgy ones over the counter at list price +. As I said, the bizarre world of store/online shopping.

It would be a heck of a thing to have to order online to get a rock-bottom price, with the store only a mile away, and people I know working there. Nonetheless I'm glad to know they're available at these prices.

I hope yours continue to work to your satisfaction. Time will tell.

[Alan0354]

Well, I used only 3 12AX7, 1 12AT7 and two 6L6 for 5 minutes. So I still have long ways to go. So far, it's 100%. Hope the rest are not duds!!!

[Enzo]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong please, but I think the Traynor line of amplifiers do use RUBY tubes from time to time and I think they use Sovtek as well.....the one's that I have had to service sounded good to me...but I don't buy lots of tubes to test in my Marshall JMP......and Fender uses G/T so when I have to do a warranty repair, I have to use those...Mesa has their own LINE of tubes as well....To me, as long as it sounds good, and don't short out in a short amount of time, and are fairly quiet, then that works for me....having said that, I have gone to our local music store, bought a new G/T tube only to get it home and find out it was worse than the one I replaced....I even had them cause hum.....and they are all made by a handful of manufacturers.....but all kinds of brand names...just like the vcr racket...so when somebody says to me that they perfer a particular brand over a number of others, they do have their reasons...I respect that....but for me I can't think of a single brand that I would say are the best....then again, I have not been at the music side of electronics nowhere near as long as some of you...there is still much for me to learn....

bsco, be aware that a lot of those guys do not make tubes. For the most part Ruby sells rebranded tubes, it isn;t a secret. Ruby sells Shuguang, but also JJ, Sovtek, etc. Look at the letters on the end of their tube type, it usually codes the origin. CZ for Czech republic for example (JJ).

I imagine Traynor is like Peavey or anyone else, they buy production quantities of tubes from whoever can reliably provide them. The best tube in the world is useless to an amp factory if they can only get 500 of them when they need 10,000 or more. So this month production line might be using Ruby and next month JJ. Someone like Peavey will buy tubes through Ruby instead of direct from the tube maker, often because Ruby tests, grades, and culls the bulk tubes. If PV ordered direct from the tube maker, then they would have to sort and test all the tubes.

GT is another rebreander. Hell you can often look at a GT 6L6 and read the Sovtek lettering under the GT paint. GT does not make tubes. Mesa, same deal, they do not make tubes, your new Mesa 12AX7 will be Sovtek or EH or whatever under the label. So there is no Mesa line of tubes, just other brand tubes Mesa sells.




You know, I think it is one thing to look at a 12AX7 and see it is flat from DC to microwave, but that is within the curves. I believe that the tube shouldn;t make much difference in polite amplification, but what about when they are pushed off their curves? perhaps they respond differently in some ways when overdriven. And that might explain a lot of perceived differences in sound. After all, no one plays their Marshall down in hifi land.

I am reminded of cars. Most cars will drive down the road or freeway very well. Stable, smooth. But then try to corner REAL hard. My mom's old Chevy would understeer then - the car wanted to plow along the direction it was going rather than follow the curve. On the other hand my buddy's VW had a serious oversteer, which meant when pushed into a turn, the rear end might come around the curve before the rest of the car. Those differences only show up when cornering very hard.

[Justin Thomas]

Yes, there are only three (maybe 4) factories currently making tubes in scale: Shuguang in China, Reflektor (Sovtek) in Russia, and JJ in the Czech Republic. Is SED (the original Svetlana) still making tubes for our common guitar amps?

So unless it's old stock used or new, if it's new production, it came from one of those three factories. Anything else is tested/rebranded/screened etc, or custom made for a distributor to their specs. But it still came from one of those factories. Stan (km6xz) has posted several times on the Shuguang boxing and silkscreening them however you like if you order 1,000; I'm sure if the quantities are big enough, they'll tool up for you. Places like Ruby can afford the economies of scale, probably similar with Eurotubes/JJ.

Personally, I aim for middle of the road, and I have not tried any of the "reissues" made in Russia yet. I've primarily done JJ, and on occasion the 5881WXT that Terry mentioned - they are tough to kill! Ordered my first China-12AX7 a while ago, I'll plug it in when I need it.

Justin