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Mysteries of the bench case#3: Wolf in chic's clothing?

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  • Mysteries of the bench case#3: Wolf in chic's clothing?

    This is a weird one...
    A customer comes in with a (new to him) blackface bassman head. The amp was demonstrating quite a bit of noise, but he also wanted us to go through it, and perform any maintenance necessary and asks us to find out what we could about in - ie. if we can date it, and what version it was, etc.
    I told him I'd check out the date codes and see if I can give him a general idea of when the amp was made. After opening up the chassis, I noticed that there were several resistors and film caps that had been replaced and it looked as if the much of the wiring had been redone recently.
    But the weird thing was all of the bypass and filter electrolytics were still the original paper covered mallorys. I'm thinking "who the hell makes that kind of overhaul, and leaves in the components which will need to be replaced in the course of routine maintenance at some point anyway?"
    After resolving the primary noise issue (due to poor lead dress), I called the customer and gave him the rundown on the amp. I let him know about the electrolytics and gave him the option of having us replace them while the amp was on the bench, or he could bring it back at a later time if he they became problematic and left it up to him. They weren't showing any obvious sign of laying down or causing any instability to me. He opted to have us replace them and here is when it gets interesting. I took care of the preamp first and began removing the main filter caps from the board. When I lifted the very last 8µF cap, the paper cover slipped off and exposed a shiny black case underneath with the familiar label "F & T".
    This is what I saw:


    -
    -
    I was like, "...the hell? Oh cute, they saved the original cover to match... wait a minute...."
    Then I grabbed one of the other caps and took a closer look
    -
    -

    -
    -
    Are you f-ing kidding me? Why would someone go through the trouble of...
    Then I grabbed the cathode bypass caps.
    -
    -

    -
    -
    you guys see it? I didn't at first, but I was able to slide the leads in and out of the case a half an inch. I removed the paper and here is the point I began to move from amusement to highly suspicious.
    -
    -


    -
    -
    So, I ask, is this just a case of some cultist going for vintage chic? Or was this someone trying to fraudulently claim the amp was in all original condition at some point and hoping the subterfuge would pass under quick inspection. After checking the date codes there is a gap of several years between the dates of manufacturer between the PT and OT and the choke.
    If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

  • #2
    Somebody has WAAAAAY too much time on their hands and is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAy to into "the vintage look".
    "I took a photo of my ohm meter... It didn't help." Enzo 8/20/22

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by The Dude View Post
      Somebody has WAAAAAY too much time on their hands and is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAy to into "the vintage look".
      right??? That's why I was thinking no way someone puts that much effort into something like this unless they're trying to screw someone.
      If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

      Comment


      • #4
        Dude, you should have seen the seam on the case of that dual-electrolytic. Then must have used a jeweler's saw, and it was then clear taped back together. It such a good counterfeit, I'm tellin' you
        If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

        Comment


        • #5
          Well, yes and no. Speaking for myself if I were a buyer, the amp would be worth more if I could see new caps and knew the amp had been re-capped. Sure, vintage is cool and often means $, but I'll pass on vintage electrolytics. Of course, not everyone thinks the way I do (thankfully ).
          "I took a photo of my ohm meter... It didn't help." Enzo 8/20/22

          Comment


          • #6
            It sort of reminds me of this.

            https://www.dhtrob.com/projecten/elna1_en.php

            Someone here posted it a while back.
            "I took a photo of my ohm meter... It didn't help." Enzo 8/20/22

            Comment


            • #7
              I have a customer who asked me to do similar cap replacements on his amps. I didn't go quite as far stuffing the dually bypass caps, but did as he asked on the hi voltage & bias filter caps. Luckily not everyone asks for this. In fact, him alone. As long as it's just one, I'll humor him.

              In another recent case, I had one of those Fenders that has the red moulded AC plug brought to the shop for servicing. Like most, the plug was twisting off the end of the cable, threatening to fall off in a shower of sparks any minute. So . . . for safety's sake I replaced it. When he picked it up, what a dressing-down I got for that! All of a sudden this otherwise reasonable fellow went all Marine drill sergeant on me, a very uncomfortable moment. Well it's a couple months later, and I have another red-plug cable, stabilized with a tight wrap of electrical tape, removed from another amp. I'll offer to install that on his vintage collector's-item silver face Deluxe and hopefully regain the peace. No charge of course. And don't come crying to me if it fails in a shower of sparks. Because they'll be an authentic collector's item, potentially worth a fortune, right Sarge? Surprise, surprise, surprise...
              This isn't the future I signed up for.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by The Dude View Post
                It sort of reminds me of this.

                https://www.dhtrob.com/projecten/elna1_en.php

                Someone here posted it a while back.
                It must be April 1st. What could possibly be the point of putting them in a wooden coffin?
                Last edited by Dave H; 11-15-2018, 10:04 AM. Reason: spelling

                Comment


                • #9
                  Ha, that's a good one.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SoulFetish View Post
                    This is a weird one...
                    A customer comes in with a (new to him) blackface bassman head. The amp was demonstrating quite a bit of noise, but he also wanted us to go through it, and perform any maintenance necessary and asks us to find out what we could about in - ie. if we can date it, and what version it was, etc.
                    I told him I'd check out the date codes and see if I can give him a general idea of when the amp was made. After opening up the chassis, I noticed that there were several resistors and film caps that had been replaced and it looked as if the much of the wiring had been redone recently.
                    But the weird thing was all of the bypass and filter electrolytics were still the original paper covered mallorys. I'm thinking "who the hell makes that kind of overhaul, and leaves in the components which will need to be replaced in the course of routine maintenance at some point anyway?"
                    After resolving the primary noise issue (due to poor lead dress), I called the customer and gave him the rundown on the amp. I let him know about the electrolytics and gave him the option of having us replace them while the amp was on the bench, or he could bring it back at a later time if he they became problematic and left it up to him. They weren't showing any obvious sign of laying down or causing any instability to me. He opted to have us replace them and here is when it gets interesting. I took care of the preamp first and began removing the main filter caps from the board. When I lifted the very last 8µF cap, the paper cover slipped off and exposed a shiny black case underneath with the familiar label "F & T".
                    This is what I saw:


                    -
                    -
                    I was like, "...the hell? Oh cute, they saved the original cover to match... wait a minute...."
                    Then I grabbed one of the other caps and took a closer look
                    -
                    -

                    -
                    -
                    Are you f-ing kidding me? Why would someone go through the trouble of...
                    Then I grabbed the cathode bypass caps.
                    -
                    -

                    -
                    -
                    you guys see it? I didn't at first, but I was able to slide the leads in and out of the case a half an inch. I removed the paper and here is the point I began to move from amusement to highly suspicious.
                    -
                    -


                    -
                    -
                    So, I ask, is this just a case of some cultist going for vintage chic? Or was this someone trying to fraudulently claim the amp was in all original condition at some point and hoping the subterfuge would pass under quick inspection. After checking the date codes there is a gap of several years between the dates of manufacturer between the PT and OT and the choke.
                    these procedures were also descripted in the Gerald Weber books,lol,apart from preserving the original look (i mean,what is good in seeing a bulged capacitor?)the main reason is for retaining the "original vintage value" on the market.
                    Of all the different forms of feticism,i could understand those who buy nice girl's used underware,but this?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It is a common practice in the restoration of old radios to preserve their original appearance.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        "In another recent case, I had one of those Fenders that has the red moulded AC plug brought to the shop for servicing. Like most, the plug was twisting off the end of the cable, threatening to fall off in a shower of sparks any minute."

                        I have had good luck chasing the sheathing back up inside the plug and applying super glue around the joint and in the two small openings on either side of the plug.
                        It's weird, because it WAS working fine.....

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Pedro Vecino View Post
                          It is a common practice in the restoration of old radios to preserve their original appearance.
                          I did the same new caps in the old cases in a 1964 Magnavox Magnasonic , however I did leave service notes of the mods with the paper work.
                          If you don't know where your going any road'll take you there : George Harrison

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I have occasionally slipped the old cardboard covers back on in very old stuff (30's, 40's) and old radios like Pedro mentioned. But no gluing or anything else, it is very obvious at closer inspection.
                            Agree with SoulFetish there may have been some deception intended here.
                            Originally posted by Enzo
                            I have a sign in my shop that says, "Never think up reasons not to check something."


                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by shortcircuit View Post
                              I did the same new caps in the old cases in a 1964 Magnavox Magnasonic , however I did leave service notes of the mods with the paper work.
                              THAT, my friend, makes all the difference in the world and you are a gentleman for doing so.
                              If I have a 50% chance of guessing the right answer, I guess wrong 80% of the time.

                              Comment

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