Cricket sound with Fender Blues Deluxe Reissue Amp

[LeoZeppelin]

Hello all,

First of all, thank you very much to everyone who replied back to my previous thread. It was very informative for a novice like me and did help me make a decision on amp.

Based on my budget constraints and my quest for best (or what works decent enough atleast) approach, I bought Fender Blues Deluxe Reissue (1x12). I figured I would rather spend money to get a decent 1x12 rather than a screwed up 2x12 (I have had that experience with Peavey ValveKing 2x12 -- it was cr*p to be very honest with all those cheap stuff they assembled in to make a 100W 2x12 costing 670ish).

Anyway, what brings me here this time is a problem that I have been facing with the Fender Blues Deluxe Reissue (BDR). In general, the amp is good but in 2-3 minutes after I start playing, it starts making a sound like crickets make in night. There is no hum or no other buzz...just that cricket sound. If you crank up the volume, it pretty much becomes unplayable with all that annoying sound. Clean channel makes a bit more of this sound as compared to the drive one. Switching between input sockets or using/not using footswitch does not make any difference. Positioning the amp does not change anything either. I use a Gibson Les Paul with a Burstbucker Pro and 490R ceramic humbucker. I switched between them, tuned the coil tapping on and off...but in vain!

If I touch the metal board on top or any metal thing on amp, the noise goes away to a large extent but not completely. If I move away from the amp (mostly towards left side with amp facing straight), the noise gets terrible and unbearable. I don't know if it is the proximity of a DVR that makes it worse on left but it shouldn't be that terrible with DVR 5 feet away and below. If the volume is not too high and I touch the strings on guitar, the annoying noise goes down (similar to when I touch the metal parts on amp)...although not as much as it does when I directly touch the amp. I don't want to assume but is it earthing problem? When I sit in front of the amp facing it, the annoying noise reduces. I also tried different cables but that did not make any difference.

I opened it up to see if it is a lose tube causing this pain in the A. I figured that it uses 3 - 12AX7s and 2 - 6L6s (5881). Honestly, I could not move the tubes. They won't twist and I just didn't want to crack them. I don't know how they would come out really. I assumed that if they are not moving, they are probably sitting well and are tightly inserted..so I guess that "probably" rules out the lose tube dilemma, right?

So far, no luck. I was playing it 10 minutes back and I got annoyed to the point where I had to throw it all aside and ask the experts what they think is causing this and what I could do to fix it?

Thank you very much in advance.
Best Regards.

[pdf64]

Are you sure the amp isn't still under waranty (5 years?)?
Tubes pull out - use a slight circular motion whilst pulling. Hold any tube retainers open. Don't twist!
If you unplug your guitar/cable from the amp, does the noise stop?
Can you check it out in a friend's / neighbour's / relative's house (to rule out bad house wiring)?

[LeoZeppelin]

Some more updates:

Some updates to my previous post guys:

1) The touching metal parts on amp and the noise goes away, that is now correct always. Each time I was doing that myself and probably me coming closer to the amp was taking care of interference I believe. I made someone else touch the metal part when I was away and that made no difference whatsoever.

2) I tried the thing I should have tried earlier. With amp volume sufficiently high, I gently hit the preamp tubes with a screw driver and guess what, 2 of them turned out to be micro-phonic. I could hear the hitting noise on the speaker clearly. One doing so more than the other but that kind of tells me what "might" be the issue.

Do you guys think that micro-phonic pickup can cause that cricket sound? I don't know honestly so asking the Gurus. I don't know if that is the cause behind cricket sound but that definitely is an issue, nonetheless.

[LeoZeppelin]

Are you sure the amp isn't still under waranty (5 years?)?
Tubes pull out - use a slight circular motion whilst pulling. Hold any tube retainers open. Don't twist!
If you unplug your guitar/cable from the amp, does the noise stop?
Can you check it out in a friend's / neighbour's / relative's house (to rule out bad house wiring)?

Thank you for replying pdf64.

I bought the amp from Guitar Center last Saturday. I still have 5 years intact on it with 2 years GC's warrenty I bought on top of that (With a hope that it is useful to some extent).

I can try pulling the tube out again. Going by the fact that 2 of them are micro-phonic, do you think that may have a tendency to make the cricket sound like the what I mentioned?

I am calling GC tomorrow and will have those tubes replaced but next thing is definitely trying it out at several places to be sure that noise is not reproducing (if replacing tubes takes care of that).

Really, I never thought that getting a decent tube amp is much harder than it looks. I have some bad juju when it comes to buying electronics (unless I buy a very expensive one).

[Jared Purdy]

When tubes go micro-phonic, I am told that they can pick up all kinds of sounds from inside the cabinet, and then project them through the speaker. The "cricket" sound that you are hearing may well be what your guitar playing sounds like going through a microphonic tube and then through the speaker. Just replace the tubes, and don't change anything else. Check one thing at a time.

About the only thing I would say you could/should do, aside from replacing the tubes, is plug the amp in another outlet away from any other electronic devices to see if, as onew other postered suggested, there might be other inteference. I had to do that with mine (PeaveyC30) as the plug that I had it in must of had falty wiring as there was all kinds of weird spunds coming through the amp. When I plugged the amp into a heavey duty extension cord, and then into a power bar, problem solved.

Do the tubes though, and try another outlet in the mean time. Just my $.02 worth. Good luck.

[LeoZeppelin]

I am confused now

Thank you for replying Jared.

So I went to GC to get tubes replaced. Amp did not cr*p out at GC like it did at my place. But I could reproduce the problem proving that tubes were microphonic. I got 2 new tubes but the guy who was helping me said that it will make sense to get the amp biased to make sure that there is not too much/too less power running through the amp. Honestly, I have never heard of the term biasing an amp before he mentioned it...probably because I never had to get it done.

I took my amp to where I jam with the old tubes intact. No cricket sound..I played for 4 hours constantly and not even a small indication of the problem. Hitting the tubes would still make that slight microphonic sound though but not as bad as it was at my place.

My only and only guess is that despite a surge protector power extension chord outlet (sharing 5 other plugs from different electronics items - PC, Monitor etc), it has to be interference from something at my place. Unless I am missing a point here...??????

Another question; does biasing before putting in new tubes make sense? Does getting it biased make sense in general anyway? I just bought this amp like a week ago....shouldn't it be biased already?

Thank you.
Best Regards.

[pdf64]

Don't hit tubes, especially with a screwdriver! Their main mitigation for microphonics are the wafer thin mica supports, and mica is quite a fragile material.
All tubes are microphonic to some extent, especially if they are positioned early in the signal chain, with lots of gain after them. By that same token, a microphonic tube moved to later in the signal chain might not exhibit microphonics (as there's now less gain after it).
At GC, was that problem you reproduced the cricket noise, or (screwdriver induced) microphonics?
Biasing - the amp will need adjusting to each pair of output tubes that are put in it. However, Fender sell tubes in color rated pairs, so as long as you put in the same colour as were originally in there, you should be good.

[LeoZeppelin]

Back in black!

Don't hit tubes, especially with a screwdriver! Their main mitigation for microphonics are the wafer thin mica supports, and mica is quite a fragile material.
All tubes are microphonic to some extent, especially if they are positioned early in the signal chain, with lots of gain after them. By that same token, a microphonic tube moved to later in the signal chain might not exhibit microphonics (as there's now less gain after it).
At GC, was that problem you reproduced the cricket noise, or (screwdriver induced) microphonics?
Biasing - the amp will need adjusting to each pair of output tubes that are put in it. However, Fender sell tubes in color rated pairs, so as long as you put in the same colour as were originally in there, you should be good.

Hello guys,

I am gonna bring this thread back to life...after a year! I wished to find a solution to my problem (explained above) last year but...got very busy for months, unfortunately.

Firstly, thank you all for replying. Mr pdf64, your comments have been been quite helpful. Grazie!

The problem still exists. Now that I've been focusing on music, as I must, I couldn't take the same annoying noise again today when I was about to record a solo. I put a brand new 12AX7 GT (Russian made) to replace the 1 of the tubes. Well, nothing improved. I have 3 different spare 12AX7 GT (Chinese made). I tried them in each position but nothing worked.

The noise gets much worse and unbearable as you crank up the volume. It goes out-of-the-roof-worse when I use coil splitting to make my Les Paul use single pickup OR when I power on my tube driver overdrive pedal.

I have new cables, it is not electromagnetics of the house because this problem reproduces at a lot of different venues. I am guessing that a microphonic tube possibility can be ruled out since I tried a few other tubes in its place. Although, against Mr pdf64's advice, I did try to hit it with a screwdriver to hear any microphonic sound and I don't know if what I hear on hitting it is a slight reverb sound or another microphonic tube.

I thought that before taking the amp back to GC, out of frustration, for repair (sending it to Fender basically), I will ask around here if there is anything that I can do to fix it and save the time instead.

At GC, was that problem you reproduced the cricket noise, or (screwdriver induced) microphonics?

Microphonic sound was discovered by hitting with a screwdriver. I don't know how else to find out the microphonic sound.

Cricket noise just starts sporadically (but surely) within a few minutes after plugging in the amp and may stop for 2 seconds in between to give me a respite but does come roaring back. (I may have to double check tomorrow but...).... if the amp has no cables plugged into the input then there is no cricket noise...or no noise I guess?

I have started to wonder if one or both of the gigantic power tubes are shitty! Hard to tell...cuz they don't make microphonic sound when hit with a screwdriver (gently, I must say) but may be something else might be wrong with them?

Biasing - the amp will need adjusting to each pair of output tubes that are put in it. However, Fender sell tubes in color rated pairs, so as long as you put in the same colour as were originally in there, you should be good.

I am not sure what is this color rated pair. They all are 12AX7 GTs (Chinese made)...12AX7-c and look the same.

Would you suggest biasing before sending it for repairs to Fender? Any chance that the bloody circuit is shot somewhere? This amp is awesome but this thing is driving me nuts. It is like having a beautiful but annoying girlfriend who wouldn't shut up

Help/Suggestions plz!

Thanks!
Best Regards.

[guitarmike2107]

Have you looked inside the amp for any crickets nesting..... sorry somebody had to say that

Have you tried a different guitar cable

Honestly, record the noise and then take it back to the shop with the noise recording. if it didnt work from early in its life thats what you should have done.

[MWJB]

It never worked right from week 1, take it back to GC.

This isn't typical of Blues Deluxes, yours has a problem & is unplayable.

When PDF64 was talking about "biasing & tube grade" he meant your 5881 power tubes, not the 12AX7. 12AX7 are self biasing & can be changed without any adjustment.

"Microphonic sound was discovered by hitting with a screwdriver. I don't know how else to find out the microphonic sound." STOP hitting things with screwdrivers! Turn everthing on the amp fully up (except reverb), no guitar plugged in, now just lightly flick the preamp tube with the outside of your fingernail...you will still hear a "tink" sound, this does not mean that the tube is microphonic - louds bangs, whines, fizzes, buzzes & whistles are what you are listening for. If you get a noisy tube, replace it. The preamp tube farthest from the power tubes is the most likely suspect.

Turn the amp off & let it cool all the way down. When cold, power up as before, all controls fully up (except reverb) and now with just your finger tip, rock the 5881 power tubes GENTLY in their sockets, listen for crackles & bangs. These tubes may heat up quick, they will get very, very hot at the socket end first, so ONLY touch the free end & stop when they get warm, or use an oven glove.

Does this cricket noise occur with no guitar plugged in? If so, power down, let the amp cool, & pull out the small preamp tube next to the power tubes. Does this cure the problem? If not - you have a power tube/circuit problem.

If it does cure it, pull out the other 2 preamp tubes, replace the one next to the power tubes only - if this causes the cricket noise, you know the problem is this tube or associated circuit. If still no cricket noise, then replace the middle preamp tube & repeat process until all tubes are installed & running quietly.

Do not move/replace tubes with the amp powered up, power down & unplug from the wall at each installation.

If just substituting preamp tubes & power tubes (of the same manufacture & grade) does not sort your problem, go back to GC (it's what you should have done in the first week).

[Zipslack]

Other considerations...

Keep in mind that this amp is not 100% tube...there are some opamps used for reverb and for pre-out and post-in effects loop. Also, I'm thinking you could also have a problem with a capacitor arcing-over internally or a similar effect from cold-solder joints. Don't automatically assume it's the tubes...also DO NOT TAP THE TUBES WITH A METAL OBJECT! Use a pencil or chopstick...and be delicate. Try to eliminate the noise by turning the reverb all the way off and/or disconnecting the reverb pan, then check the pre-out and post-in connections to see if that makes a difference - this will also help determine if the noise is pre-amp or in the power amp section.

With everything that's been said, I would also say take it back and exchange it...if you mess around too much you may void your warranty and be stuck with it.

[LeoZeppelin]

Have you looked inside the amp for any crickets nesting..... sorry somebody had to say that

Have you tried a different guitar cable

Honestly, record the noise and then take it back to the shop with the noise recording. if it didnt work from early in its life thats what you should have done.

haha, yea I must have done that a year ago.

The sound is more like crickets (many) on coke...going crazy! I have tried different cables and power sockets.

[LeoZeppelin]

It never worked right from week 1, take it back to GC.

I think I will do that if anything quick fixes don't narrow down to any problem.

Does this cricket noise occur with no guitar plugged in?

I do not remember this with the volume too high but I will try this again tonight. From what I remember, if nothing is going inside the input signal, there is no cricket noise atleast but still some noise on clean channel also as you raise the volume. A hiss is acceptable and obvious but I am talking about a noise and cricket noise too. With drive it just.... makes me mad even saying it.

I will try that exercise again tonight.

Thank you very much for the detailed reply.

[LeoZeppelin]

@Zipslack:

Also, I'm thinking you could also have a problem with a capacitor arcing-over internally or a similar effect from cold-solder joints.

I have started to believe that actually after my tube switching experiment.

DO NOT TAP THE TUBES WITH A METAL OBJECT! Use a pencil or chopstick...and be delicate.

Yes. I saw the GC guy doing that...the store manager. So I thought it was OK. But apparently not.

Try to eliminate the noise by turning the reverb all the way off and/or disconnecting the reverb pan

I tried putting reverb and presence to 0. Moving treble a bit down makes some difference in noise in general but not in cricket noise.

then check the pre-out and post-in connections to see if that makes a difference - this will also help determine if the noise is pre-amp or in the power amp section.

You mean the ones on Preamp Out ones? Plug input there?

With everything that's been said, I would also say take it back and exchange it...if you mess around too much you may void your warranty and be stuck with it.

Not sure if exchange is possible now although I have 2 years of GC warranty in addition to Fender's 5 years limited warranty that comes with the amp. But good point, I will not do any surgery on it. Just tube experiment, and then I am done.

Apparently, I've been spending more time posting in forums and fixing amp and bi***ing about it than playing music...it is frustrating!

[LeoZeppelin]

One thing that I must mention, in case I was not clear about it earlier is that the cricket sound is quite sporadic. I might be playing for 2 minutes and I will hear it..sometimes for 20 minutes there will be nothing and then it will just show up like grouchy neighbor. Sometimes it will go away in between for a few seconds and will come back again right away. Not sure if that information helps.

I will go home and do some experiment with the tube switching like you guys suggested and plugging cable in and out. Unless there is anything additional that you guys might want to suggest, I will take it to GC.

PS: When you put the amp from standby to on, you can see the power tubes having some blue light in them. My guess is that blue light emission is suggesting some X-rays? Since this is my first tube amp, I don't know if that is an expected behavior or not.