Tube amp for rock, need advices :)

[Matthew]

Hi everyone,
Here my problem, i play in a guitar rock band( as guitarist ) , and i need an new tube amp, but I have difficulty to choose one ?
One month ago, i enter a guitar store and played a Hiwatt custom 50 it was really great
I have also played a mesa boogie lonestar which was fantastic .
I play mostly classic rock stuff, led zeppelin , queen, pink floyd , ...
But I don't play metal.
I'm very interested by these two amps ( hiwatt custom 50 and mesa lone star special )
And others like mesa boogie stiletto or even the elctradyne ,....
so which one do you think i should buy, i will played it in my bedroom, with my band and on a max 300-400 people show.
Thanks for your advices

PS: Sorry for the english I'm french

[Rob Gee]

Hey Matt. Welcome to the forum. I'm assuming you'll likely be opting for same head/combo/cabinet configuration. The Hiwatt comes as a head, or the 1x12 and 2x12 combo configurations. Mesa offers a rack-mountable head and a 4x10 combo configuration which isn't a format offered by Hiwatt, so I'll exclude these two formats from my suggestions.

Both amplifiers are excellent products. They are quite different in their design, features. They also differ in their price range (I'm also from the US, could be different in France). Hiwatt's amp sits (steeply priced if I may) at no less than $3,100 US currency. The Mesa, on top of being a much more versatile amp, can be had in any of its configurations for under $2,000.

The fact that it will partly see use as a practice amp in a bedroom would have me suggest the Mesa hands down over the Hiwatt. The Mesa has flexibility of its power section being switchable between 5, 15, and 30 watts.

I wouldn't generally recommend Mesa amps to anyone, but after the reading I've done for you, I'm rather impressed. I'll be curious to try one out for myself in the future and see if I'm as surprised aurally as I am looking at the endless list of features packed into this little pup.

Do yourself the favor of checking out AS MANY amps and builders as you can. Check out some of the cheaper manufacturers and their high-end tube combo amps. Some of those companies make quite versatile amps, and you could afford to buy 2 or 3 for the same price as either the Mesa or Hiwatt. I've heard a lot of people are quite impressed with the Egnater Rebel series, which are half the price of the Lone Star Special.

I have never bought a brand new amp. Used amps can (sometimes) be an excellent deal if you do your research and have a reputable tech look the piece over before purchasing. Don't forget that ALL used amps WILL benefit from having been looked over and serviced by a qualified tech to make sure they're in proper operating condition.

Hope this helps. If I can help with anything else, let me know!

-Rob Gee

[kg]

matthew: how good are you with a soldering iron?

[Matthew]

--> Rob Gee :
thanks a lot for answering my question, it was really helpful
I read a lot of reviews, saying that the hiwatt, was not the best amp to play led zep' ( hiwatt = bright clean amp am i right ? )
In fact I play with a fender custom strat and I search a warm clean tone, and a hot distortion, that's why i was thinking about the mesa LSS
another question : is the mesa boogie lone star special, in 30 w mode , loud enough to play in some gigs ( 400 person max ) ?
At last the electradyne ( 45/90 w ) or the stiletto (10/50/100 w ) would be okay for a bedroom, or is it too much power ? And what about the lonestar classic (vs the LSS ) ?
thank you very much !


--> kg
not bad
two week ago i was thinking about building a DIY amp,
but unfortunately i realise that i have no time to build an amp,
anyway thanks for your advices

[GregS]

Thought I should mention there have been cases with the Mesa LSS blowing rectifier tubes and fuses. There are some threads on this forum about this. You might want to check them out and factor this into your decision of what amp to get.

[Beerman]

--> Rob Gee :
thanks a lot for answering my question, it was really helpful
I read a lot of reviews, saying that the hiwatt, was not the best amp to play led zep' ( hiwatt = bright clean amp am I right?

That's odd. A Supro was Jimmy Page's main amp early in the piece, but later (68 - 71), his main amps were Hiwatts.

I think the Hiwatt will be ideal for live use, should be easily maintained... Some amp techs have been known to reject work on Mesa amps.

Would probably buy something small for bedroom use though... The Hiwatt will be loud.

[tedmich]

go to Sloclone and build a SLO for ~$500; the bragging rights are extreme!

But if you just want to play, the mesa should work well; its "multiwatt" setting would let you dial in 10-50-100w depending on where you are. ~10w through a small ported speaker box sounds quite nice for bedroom playing
I use small Focal speakers

also French!

[Steve Conner]

That's odd. A Supro was Jimmy Page's main amp early in the piece, but later (68 - 71), his main amps were Hiwatts.

That's what I thought too! If you play Zeppelin and Pink Floyd, the Hiwatt might give you more British mojo. The Custom 50 has a master volume, so you should be able to get a usable tone from it for home practice.

They also have a lower powered Custom 20.

The Hiwatts look expensive in the US because of import duty. The situation might be different in France, because France and Britain are both part of the EU. So the Hiwatt won't be hit with import duty, but the Mesa amps will.

[Matthew]

Thanks all, for your answer, so you think i should go with the hiwatt Custom 50 ?
The issue is that i tried a mb electra dyne, and it was oohhh great, the clean was fabulous and the two other "channel" vintage hi and low were absolutely gorgeous
In fact i don't know which amp to choose lol, i'm lost between hiwatt custom 50 or electradyne ( and why not a bogner shiva? )
So could i ask you a last question
At low bedroom volume , could i have a good tone with the electra dyne ( clean crunch and overdrive ) ?

Thanks a lot !

[HTH]

They are two quite different amps, I suppose you should buy the one you like the sound of best.

Hiwatts are built like tanks and very reliable - can't really say anything about the Lonestar as I've no experience with them.

If you're thinking of getting a Hiwatt, factor some kind of power attenuator into the budget as they really do sound best cranked up - the DR103 I used to own only came alive with the master up around 6 (which was LOUD!!!). They do take pedals very well too, so they are a great base to build your tone if you like to use a few pedals.

Lastly, if you get a Hiwatt, make sure you use Fane speakers (or Fane clones like Tayden offer). They are quite important to getting Hiwatts to sound 'right' (imo) - they always sounded too bright with Celestions to my ears.

[tedmich]

All IMHO

Hiwatts are legendary, mostly due to the fact they were waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overbuilt to military spec and they didn't fall apart while touring like the shoddy amps made at the same time. They are beautiful inside and easy to fix. You're Pete Townsend playing a few hundred concerts a year and bashing everything ...go Hiwatt over Vox or Fender.

But if you want an amp with good usable distortion and sustain you will need a pedal train to get a Hiwatt to do this; if you already have ~30ft of signal processing upstream the Hiwatt will take that signal and amplify it very well and dependably.

I see little utility in having a very expensive tube amp that needs 2-3 $0.50 JRC4558 op amps upstream to give it any sustain, but that's just my opinion. The Hiwatts are tough, loud and look good in a stack but for that price you could pretty much get a Framus, Engl, Koch or Roadking and ditch the pedals, with many of these amps capable of giving a clean signal that rivals the Hiwatt.

IMHO

[woodyc]

The Hiwatt is a great amp but not ideal. The Lonestar has reliability issues and its expensive to fix. For rock, you should try a Marshall 2203 (or any master-volume model) with a 4x12 cab.

[HTH]

All IMHO

Hiwatts are legendary, mostly due to the fact they were waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overbuilt to military spec and they didn't fall apart while touring like the shoddy amps made at the same time. They are beautiful inside and easy to fix. You're Pete Townsend playing a few hundred concerts a year and bashing everything ...go Hiwatt over Vox or Fender.

But if you want an amp with good usable distortion and sustain you will need a pedal train to get a Hiwatt to do this; if you already have ~30ft of signal processing upstream the Hiwatt will take that signal and amplify it very well and dependably.

I see little utility in having a very expensive tube amp that needs 2-3 $0.50 JRC4558 op amps upstream to give it any sustain, but that's just my opinion. The Hiwatts are tough, loud and look good in a stack but for that price you could pretty much get a Framus, Engl, Koch or Roadking and ditch the pedals, with many of these amps capable of giving a clean signal that rivals the Hiwatt.

IMHO

try telling that to David Gilmour - I think he does pretty well with those fuzz boxes and a Hiwatt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7nUk...eature=related

[tedmich]

try telling that to David Gilmour - I think he does pretty well with those fuzz boxes and a Hiwatt.

YouTube - "This Heaven" solo - David Gilmour, AOL Sessions

David Gilmour, SRV etc etc. they can (could) have any amp they wanted and they chose clean tube amps that are very expensive (though likely free for them!) and then put OD/dist/fuzz pedals upstream (in SRV case reportedly 2 tubscreamers in series) to get distortion and sustain. But for someone who pays for their gear and doesn't have unlimited resources (at least 10% here ) you can have a modern amp which does it all, and the complexity can just come from the ....music.
IMHO

[riz]

I always thought fuzz boxes were a lot cheaper than amps... I'm back to the pedals>>> good-clean-amp formula for my live work. The post that stood out to me suggested a Marshall. Hard to go wrong there for rock, if it's classic-type tube amps we're talking about here. I have a friend who tours with Mesa, I would stay away from them myself...