multiple speakers and SPL

[eschertron]

My interpretation:
A speaker is like a motor running almost at idle, not having an appropriate load. Consequently its power efficiency is low. Increasing the load increases efficiency.

I'll buy that there's an acoustic impedance mismatch. Part of the reason behind the mechanism of the middle ear.
I think in general a denser medium transmits energy with greater efficiency. Is that what you think is going on, each driver 'boostrapping' the effort of its companions? If so, does this idea of "local densification" have a physical basis? My null hypothesis is that it's going to be the average air density that matters. Or am I sideways on this?

[Helmholtz]

Each driver loads the other by increased sound pressure. Of course sound pressure modulates air density. Its not about average but instantaneous values. Its impedance, not resistance.

[nickb]

Excellent!

That's exactly how Prof. Zollner explains the phenomenon in his book "Elektroakustik für Bühne und Studio".

Off topic:

1) I'd like to read Zollner's work
2) It's in German
3) Your English is excellent and my German is laughable
so how about you help the translation effort? Please?

[HaroldBrooks]

All I know is that I prefer a lower-powered amp with lots of speakers over high-powered amps with a single speaker...

Justin

I've been holding that opinion for many years now. Your ear and brain can make a fair approximation of the size of the sound source, and an 'array' of speakers by it's very nature has to be spread out, so it sounds big, even at the same volume. Then there is the concept of enhancement of low bass, and even though people are fond of using 82hz as the lowest note on a guitar, there are intermodulation components in power chords that come out of no where when you compress and distort the signal, and when those lower frequencies are produced cleanly by an array of speakers that are coupled together, the sound is bigger yet, at least in perception.

[Malcolm Irving]

...
1) I'd like to read Zollner's work
2) It's in German
3) Your English is excellent and my German is laughable
so how about you help the translation effort? Please?

I'll second that!

[Helmholtz]

Off topic:

1) I'd like to read Zollner's work
2) It's in German
3) Your English is excellent and my German is laughable
so how about you help the translation effort? Please?

What do you suggest? While I may try to translate a few lines, I can't offer to translate whole chapters. Have you checked if there is an English version of the book? The title might be "Electroacoustics for Stage and Studio" by Manfred Zollner. German version 561 pages, 100 pages about speakers. Zollner wrote a number of books, including standard literature on electroacoustic and filter design. You may inquire here:
https://www.gitec-forum-eng.de/

[eschertron]

I've been holding that opinion for many years now. Your ear and brain can make a fair approximation of the size of the sound source, and an 'array' of speakers by it's very nature has to be spread out, so it sound big, even at the same volume. Then there is the concept of enhancement of low bass, and even though people are fond of using 82hz as the lowest note on a guitar, there are intermodulation components in power chords that come out of know where when you compress and distort the signal, and when those lower frequencies are produced cleanly by an array of speakers that are coupled together, the sound is bigger yet, at least in perception.

In the natural environment we hear all kinds of reflections, producing cancellation and phasing. These cues help make auditory spacialization possible. Perhaps the speaker array fools the brain by providing a source that the ears cannot reduce to a point, therefore a 'bigger' source.

[nickb]

What do you suggest? While I may try to translate a few lines, I can't offer to translate whole chapters. Have you checked if there is an English version of the book? The title might be "Electroacoustics for Stage and Studio" by Manfred Zollner. German version 561 pages, 100 pages about speakers. Zollner wrote a number of books, including standard literature on electroacoustic and filter design. You may inquire here:
https://www.gitec-forum-eng.de/

I haven't been able to find any English editions of any of his books, sadly. He could make a forture. Malcolm will tell ya

[Malcolm Irving]

I haven't been able to find any English editions of any of his books, sadly. He could make a forture. Malcolm will tell ya

You can make a small fortune by writing a book - but only if you start out with a big fortune.

[Chuck H]

You can make a small fortune by writing a book - but only if you start out with a big fortune.

Or the other, even more grim scenario. In the US mid west it's said that the best way to end up with a million dollars running a cattle ranch is to start with two million. I've read that most authors do it for the love. Occasionally it pays the bills. And things get lost in translations too. Certainly all the good tech info can be preserved, but then there's any of the authors flair, timing and other nuance that can get lost. And though this is a tech book sometimes it's these things that make it more accessible.

P.S. Sometimes I'll go to a Japanese website about a subject of interest and do a web browser translation. The blunt translation can be pretty funny.

[HaroldBrooks]

"... I've read that most authors do it for the love. Occasionally it pays the bills. And things get lost in translations too. Certainly all the good tech info can be preserved, but then there's any of the authors flair, timing and other nuance that can get lost. And though this is a tech book sometimes it's these things that make it more accessible.

P.S. Sometimes I'll go to a Japanese website about a subject of interest and do a web browser translation. The blunt translation can be pretty funny.

I like your style Chuck H !!!

I remember someone on a pocket computer website I often frequented was lamenting that there were no English manuals available for the fabulous Sharp PC-1425 Statistics pocket computer. He was mostly correct, but there was a PDF version of the German manual, and since I was lucky enough to even find a Sharp PC-1425 from Europe, I decided the German PDF manual was enough for me, so I used OCR software (Shareware version) to convert the PDF page by page into a word document, then pasted the Word Doc page by page into Google Translate, and finally, I had my (sometimes strangely translated) an English manual ! Now I could use every function and every feature of that gem of a pocket computer, and even though it took 4 hours or so to do the conversion, it was well worth it to me, to recover the tech manual for that computer.

After looking obsessively for roughly 5 years on international Ebay sites, I finally found an English language Manual !!! Not sure if it's the only one in existence, but the English version has to be really rare, as I've never seen another after searching daily for years on end.

But the point is, I didn't just sit around and wait for the unobtanium English version, I made do with the German translation. I've also purchased Pocket computers from Japan, Belgium, England, France, Germany, Bulgaria, and Italy. It's great now that you have a tool like Google translate, because honestly it's a bit late for me to become fully conversational in any of those Languages, but if I am motivated, I can still get the job done.

If anyone is interested, here's the dialogue lamenting the bad fate of not having a tech manual for the Sharp PC-1425 Statistics pocket computer :
https://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgi...cgi?read=83501

And here is the pocket computer in question (built in Basic language Statistics functions and 2 dimensional array tables, ... Hey it's from 1986) :
http://pocket.free.fr/html/sharp/pc-1425_e.html

Yes, I am a bit of a Geek, and I also own the Japanese version, and feel very good about it !

[Chuck H]

Yes, I am a bit of a Geek,..

I always prefer the term "nerd" because I'm (just) old enough to know that a geek is a side show freak that bites the heads off chickens, has two heads or a monkeys face, etc. How geek ever became synonymous with nerd I really don't know.

[Enzo]

Times change, I remember when "gay" meant happy and bright.

[Chuck H]

...

[Chuck H]

BTW, at least one of Zollner's works seems to be in the process of translation:

https://gitec-forum.de/wp/en/gitec-community/the-book/

Looks like good stuff

And there's definitely some love for his work and a smattering of English language discussions about it if you look around.