watts?

[Mr.coil]

right on Enzo

[Mr.coil]

Well stated!

[Mr.coil]

I remember when ss am radios showed up in autos....late 50's The whole world was used to the 4 -15 watts rms that the tubes radios put out. after they were clipping ...even 10 15 % you did not mind so much. However when the first ss radios came along they were a poltry 2 watts into 8 ohms...and when you got to 2 watts it sounded like crap... no head room, no pleasent overtones, nothing, just 3rd harmonic distortion and a lot of it! but it seemed to be just as annoying at 2 watts as 15 somehow.

I think this may have helped start the whole thing. Everyone thinks its loud when there is distortion present.

I remember a sound system I built for a 400 occ. disco...back in the early 70's. The owner said " no distortion" I said fine. We built the worlds only (at that time) 5,000 watt amp, 32 12 inch woofers, 36 mids, and 36 tweeters!

125 dB on the dance floor....no distortion! it was all fine and dandy until....There were a lot of law suits about hearing loss because no one thought it was loud, not the djs, not the bar owner, not the patrons.

The point is, we are wired mentally to equivicate loud with distortion...

The human "lizard ear" does not like 3rd harmonic distortion...it sounds like something is sneeking up on us in the wild...breaking twigs, phaze distortion, sounds that seem to come from behind...and the like.

Tubes however have 2nd harmonic distortion....its like a chorus...its in tune...we tolerate that much more.... so we turn it up more.... Thats why we think tubes are louder..



Thats my two cents worth.

Mr.Coil

[Steve Conner]

That's a bit of an over-simplification, although I broadly agree with the conclusion.

Tubes make odd harmonic distortion too. An overdriven push-pull power amp generates mostly odd harmonics and practically no even ones.

And you can build solid-state circuits (with JFETs) that generate only second harmonic. Single-ended tube stages actually generate a whole bunch of other harmonics, because tubes have a 3/2 power law. So according to your theory, the JFETs should sound better than tubes.

Odd harmonics are discordant and threatening, sure, but that discord is what adds the aggressive edge to a distorted guitar, and makes rock'n'roll what it is. It would sound too sweet and bland without them. My experiments with JFET circuits tend to bear that out: they sounded pretty dull, until I added other harmonics besides the second.

Finally, consider woodwind instruments like the clarinet, which being pipes closed at one end, have only odd harmonics and no even ones. I can't remember the last time I was terrified by a clarinet sneaking up behind me in the wild. A bassoon, maybe.

[Mr.coil]

Even though..its oddly harmonic...did you mean buffoon?

Just kidding...thanks for the input

I must go out to the shop...and make a black face out of a silver one.

later,
Mr.Coil

[kg]

steve:

whether or not i'm terrified about that clarinet closing in from behind depends on where it's headed.

[Mr.coil]

Speaking of Headed where is this conversation going?

I am going have to go back into the previous room and try and remember why I came in here...
MC