12" and 10" in the same cab?

[Mostro]

Hi, I have a 12" and a 10", and I thought about building a cab with both. I havenīt seen many cabs with this combo of speakers. Anybody ever tried this?

[Mark Hammer]

People HAVE done it, though I couldn't cite you a list of manufacturers and models.

If you decide to make one, keep in mind that speakers of different diameters tend to have different depths. This means that the shallower speaker of the two needs to be set back a little bit from the deeper one so that the wave front of each is aligned. At 30 feet in front, or at 15 feet away at 45 degrees from the cab, that absence of alignment may have little impact. But if you think of it, you'll realize that you spend most of the time standing in front of the amp at a distance short enough for the staggered arrival to have an impact on the tone. You won't hear a delay between them with an inch or whatever difference in their distance, but there may be cancellations occurring.

That depth staggering can be achieved by simply having a secondary baffle attached to the main one, and the shallower speaker affixed to the secondary baffle.

[mbratch]

The Juke Warbler 1210 has 1x12 + 2x10 configuration.

[zhyla]

At 30 feet in front, or at 15 feet away at 45 degrees from the cab, that absence of alignment may have little impact. But if you think of it, you'll realize that you spend most of the time standing in front of the amp at a distance short enough for the staggered arrival to have an impact on the tone.

Just out of curiosity, why do you think the distance of your from the cab will make a difference in the relative phase of the two wave fronts?

[Mostro]

Thanks for the answers. Mark, Iīm looking at my NS-10 monitors, and the two drivers are roughly in the same plane (Iīm talking about the front). Do you mean the plane where the dome is in? Of course they are not full range drivers like they would be in a guitar cab... they handle different parts of the spectrum. I know about time-aligned monitors, but are there time-aligned guitar cabs? Hmmm...
I guess the best course of action would be to try it... maybe with just a baffle, to see how it sounds, or make a cab with interchangeable baffles that could be converted to a 2x12 or 2x10 if the mixed speakers idea fails.
I seem to recall some Gretsch or Gibson old amps that had mixed speakers...

[Mark Hammer]

Once a person is further away from the cab, a much larger proportion of what they hear is reflected sound. That is not to say there IS no reflected sound when you stand in front of the amp, but the amp's perceived amplitude is much greater than what is coming from reflected sources. So, whatever cancellations and tonal weirdness may be created by slightly staggered drivers (and it is not a given) will be more audible close up than farther away.

Now, having said all of that, take note that my mention of staggered drivers is really a holdover from the audiophile sound reproduction area. In that particular universe, especially when one is dealing with different frequency content assigned to different drivers, the group phase lag introduced by passive and active crossovers or however frequency-division is accomplished, and the critical importance to good sound of aligning harmonic content with its fundamental, making sure the drivers are physically aligned so that their content hits your ears at the same time is a big deal. If you're slamming a cheap Strat clone into a fuzzbox, much of those assorted audiophile needs tend to fall away. Still, if all it takes is sticking a piece of 1/2" plywood with a 10" diameter hole between the baffle and speaker to be able to completely set that concern aside, why not?

Ultimately, all that really matters is if it sounds good to the player. My suggestion is not something one HAS to do; merely something to consider in case the musician finds it doesn't sound nearly as good as what they thought it was going to sound like. Call it an "exit strategy".

[Mark Hammer]

yeah, you are correct, the two domes in the same plane.

I seem to recall that some builders have deliberately used non-aligned drivers. Buzz Feiten had a speaker cab that was glowingly reviewed in Guitar Player (but then, what isn't?) years ago, which used two 12" Celestions, one lounted to the inside of the baffle, and one mounted to the outside (rear-loaded and front-loaded). Couldn't tell you if that resulted in their domes being staggered by much, though. There were also other aspects to the cab construction that likely played a greater role than how the speakers were attached.

[Mostro]

Ultimately, all that really matters is if it sounds good to the player. My suggestion is not something one HAS to do; merely something to consider in case the musician finds it doesn't sound nearly as good as what they thought it was going to sound like. Call it an "exit strategy".

Yes, thatīs why I thought about the interchangeable baffles. The "time-aligning" wood ring is a nice idea. Looks like I have a lot of "exit strategy" wood to cut...


Thanks