Ceriatone Hey What 504OL

[broughton1320]

Anyone here built a Ceriatone Hey What 504OL? I just rec'd my kit, and I was a bit surprised by the lack of documentation. There are a few funky things in the layout that I'm unsure about. I'm new to this game and it's entirely possible I'm being an idiot, but you gotta start somewhere. As this is not quite "faithful" to the design of the original I don't really have anything to fall back on. Anyone see anything weird with this?
I plan to document the build start to finish. If anyone is interested I can post. Let me know.
Take Care!

http://www.ceriatone.com/ceriatone/w...April-2021.jpg

[jack briggs]

Anyone here built a Ceriatone Hey What 504OL? I just rec'd my kit, and I was a bit surprised by the lack of documentation. There are a few funky things in the layout that I'm unsure about. I'm new to this game and it's entirely possible I'm being an idiot, but you gotta start somewhere. As this is not quite "faithful" to the design of the original I don't really have anything to fall back on. Anyone see anything weird with this?
I plan to document the build start to finish. If anyone is interested I can post. Let me know.
Take Care!

http://www.ceriatone.com/ceriatone/w...April-2021.jpg

Perhaps you should go ahead and mention what you're having trouble with.

cheers,

[The Dude]

Agree. If there are specific questions you have about the layout, why not ask them. Many of us don't have the time to scrutinize an entire layout. It might also help to post the schematic.

[loudthud]

I like the 'Linked' input. I incorporate a similar feature in most of my Four Input Jack amps.

[g1]

It might also help to post the schematic.

It sure would. Unfortunately, Ceriatone does not provide them and Nick seems to be against them in general. For me that is a disservice to people who want to learn, so I tend to try to steer people away from his kits.

For what it's worth, this is supposed to be a Hiwatt DR504 clone with the OL adding an extra gain stage utilizing the previously unused triode.

[The Dude]

That is f'd up! Selling a kit without a schematic? I certainly wouldn't buy a kit without one.

[g1]

That is f'd up! Selling a kit without a schematic? I certainly wouldn't buy a kit without one.

I agree, but I'm starting to think that most kit builders can't read them anyway, and don't have much desire to learn to do so.
So we end up with a generation of kit builders using only layouts, without any understanding of the circuitry, or how to troubleshoot when the builds don't work.

[Enzo]

A layout tells you how to solder parts in place. It tells you nothing about circuits.

[g1]

Here's a Hiwatt schematic from Mark Huss' site: https://hiwatt.org/Schematics/DR504OL.gif

[Chuck H]

Yes, I looked around and saw that schematic. I even downloaded it to post here pending inspection. But I didn't post it because I immediately noticed that the input circuitry didn't include the "linked" jack and I wondered what else might be different. This schematic, as far as I can tell, is an individuals take and build of this circuit rather than a representation of the Ceriatone circuit. Though they may be (and are likely) similar enough I just don't (can't) know that.

[Helmholtz]

It sure would. Unfortunately, Ceriatone does not provide them and Nick seems to be against them in general. For me that is a disservice to people who want to learn, so I tend to try to steer people away from his kits.

In the early years Ceriatone did provide all schematics on their website. I actually downloaded a few.

[g1]

Yes, I looked around and saw that schematic. I even downloaded it to post here pending inspection. But I didn't post it because I immediately noticed that the input circuitry didn't include the "linked" jack and I wondered what else might be different.

That's kind of why I specified it was a Hiwatt schematic.
About the only thing you can do if you want a Ceriatone schematic is take the original circuit schematic and pencil in any changes you can find by looking at the actual Ceriatone layout.

[broughton1320]

I'm sorry I haven't responded to you guys. Life got a little busy for a minute. I had tried to post a .jpg of the layout with the areas of concern circled but I couldn't get it to upload. By the time I added the link I had forgotten I hadn't posted specifics. Sorry about that.
I was pretty surprised when I didn't get any documents aside from a parts inventory when I rec'd the kit. Most of the things I was unsure of I have since figured out.
My issues now stem from parts familiarity. The jacks that came with the kit are the "switching" type (not sure if that's what they're actually called), and all I've ever messed with are the old school types. On the "linked" jack there is a shorting bar going from ground to signal. Call me an idiot but I don't understand why that would be done. Is it a mistake? I've seen that there are sometimes funky things in these layouts.
The only other thing is the caps. They are TAD caps (look like repro mustard caps), and none of them are banded. Is there a trick to finding the outside foil lead?
Thanks in advance

[g1]

What do you want to do with the outside foil lead? The layout has no indications, the original mustard type had no markings either. It's not really a factor until you get into very high frequencies, much beyond the audio range. No major manufacturers of amps pay any attention to it.

On the jacks, there is a tip contact, and a tip switch contact. A sleeve contact, and a sleeve switch contact. If you put a plug into the jack, you will see that the tip contact 'leaf' stays touching the tip. The tip switch contact is no longer touching the 'leaf'.
The shorting bar goes from ground to the tip switch, not to the tip. So when you plug something in, there is no connection. But when nothing is plugged in, the tip is grounded via the tip switch, so it won't pick up noise.

[broughton1320]

What do you want to do with the outside foil lead? The layout has no indications, the original mustard type had no markings either. It's not really a factor until you get into very high frequencies, much beyond the audio range. No major manufacturers of amps pay any attention to it.

On the jacks, there is a tip contact, and a tip switch contact. A sleeve contact, and a sleeve switch contact. If you put a plug into the jack, you will see that the tip contact 'leaf' stays touching the tip. The tip switch contact is no longer touching the 'leaf'.
The shorting bar goes from ground to the tip switch, not to the tip. So when you plug something in, there is no connection. But when nothing is plugged in, the tip is grounded via the tip switch, so it won't pick up noise.

Thanks for the info on the jacks. I realised there was a purpose for the new design but was unaware of its implimentation.
This is my first foray into a circuit this complicated. For the purpose of noise reduction I was told to always have the outside foil "facing" ground or low impedance (whichever applies). I've never played with the "high end"/vintage parts, so I've never used a cap that wasn't marked. I may be overthinking or overengineering, but I was under the impression that this was common practice. Am I going too far or is this good "circuit hygiene"?