Weber 5E3X2

[LesCarr]

I just finished assembling my circuit board and then will mount all the hardware & trannies in/on the chassis. I need a schematic or layout that show the voltages in the proper places so I can do a pre-start voltage test, can any body help me with this.
I am new to this, but I had some electronics experience over 25 years ago. the knowledge of which I have mostly forgotten.
Any help will be appreciated

[teleamp]

The unloaded voltages will be higher.

What I do is (before installing the board), wire the PT, on/off switch, pilot lamp, fuse assy and power cord. at that point you can check to see that the transformer is working. Plus, it gets the PT wires out of the way.

[LesCarr]

Thanks for the advice. I'll keep this in mind
I also need to know the voltages on the circuit board as well.
I wonder if a schematic from a 5E3 will do or is the Weber 5E3x2
drastically different the schematic I have found so far show no voltages
for the connection point from circuit board to the pins on the tubes and the voltages at the filter caps etc.



Mikey

[teleamp]

The voltages should be the same as for a 5E3, except for the voltage across the cathode cap/resistor.

[LesCarr]

Work in Process

Heres some pictures of the Weber Double Deluxe (5E3x2) I am building
Some of the wiring shows a little bit of nick because of the extra bending I has to do to get everything to fit and look OK.
Boy those Sprague Condensers sure are huge.
Any comments or suggestions will be OK I appreciate critique as long as it is constructive.

[Bruce / Mission Amps]

I don't know if anyone has posted the voltages in that current layout but I can tell you they were never the same as a standard 5E3.
Not sure what trannys Weber is using now but my original 5E3X2 (my name) was using the same two power and output trannys as found in a silver face Pro Reverb, a 35 watt amp.
The Pro Reverb OT was actually a little small for four 6V6s idling at close to 12 watts each, so I had Heyboer build me a bunch of larger 5Kohm ones that worked much better and the amp could make an honest 26 to 28 clean watts from 80Hz on up to around 7KHz.
Great sound with some bass shelving tweaks.

I don't like the use of a 100 ohm power tube biasing resistor... that will run the power tubes pretty hot if the B+ is higher then around 375vdc while loaded.
When I actually did these, (pre-Weber involvement) they were always done with a matched quad of low to medium rated 6V6EHs, a 12AX7EH, a NOS 12AY7, a NOS 5U4GB rectifier and a 150 ohm to 200 ohm 15 watt power resistor.
Also, I found that using a 1500 to 2200 ohm 5w screen node resistor seemed to give it a little more gas and I used a 27K to 33K, node dropping resistor for more vintage preamp tube voltages.

*********************
added:
I have nothing to do with WeberVST anymore so, with respect to any current products, speakers or amps kit ideas I might have drawn up, designed, beta tested or helped out with, I don't have any first hand info on any of them.

By the way the fixed bias mod kicks ass.

[LesCarr]

I have found PT & OT 's I will use a Power Trans. 340V-0-340V at 200ma, 6.3V at 5A (supports EL34s!), 5V at 3A. 50V bias tap, center-tapped heater winding . Output Trans. 4,000 ohm primary to 4/8 ohm secondary. Both branded but Heyboer built.
Yep big iron, bigger than originally called for I believe. These are for 2x6L6/EL34 and should handle the 4 6V6's well. Which I think someone somewhere said it would also help the heat problem.
I will first use Weber's setup (as reference) and then try your idea yours seems to make better sense, with a little more work.
Then I want to set the amp up to run a couple of the sockets using one or the other 6L6 or EL34, Two tubes/sockets only V 6&4 or V3&5 POSITIONS. I also have two JJ KT-77's that will run in octal sockets in place of 6L6's.
I am going to buy some clear shrink tubing fto improve the Filter Cap clearance problem and also use a 3/16 or 1/4 inch board spacer
I'm a newbe so please define, NODE.
Or define their whereabouts please

[Bruce / Mission Amps]

I have found PT & OT 's I will use a Power Trans. 340V-0-340V at 200ma, 6.3V at 5A (supports EL34s!), 5V at 3A. 50V bias tap, center-tapped heater winding . Output Trans. 4,000 ohm primary to 4/8 ohm secondary. Both branded but Heyboer built.
Yep big iron, bigger than originally called for I believe. These are for 2x6L6/EL34 and should handle the 4 6V6's well. Which I think someone somewhere said it would also help the heat problem.
I will first use Weber's setup (as reference) and then try your idea yours seems to make better sense, with a little more work.
Then I want to set the amp up to run a couple of the sockets using one or the other 6L6 or EL34, Two tubes/sockets only V 6&4 or V3&5 POSITIONS. I also have two JJ KT-77's that will run in octal sockets in place of 6L6's.
I am going to buy some clear shrink tubing fto improve the Filter Cap clearance problem and also use a 3/16 or 1/4 inch board spacer
I'm a newbe so please define, NODE.
Or define their whereabouts please

Node just means a spot in the B+ rail where a resistor, in series with the B+ allows, you to "tap off" for lower voltages after the resistor and you have a grounded high voltage filter/decoupling cap at that spot too.
You could build this so you can run either four 6V6s or two 6L6s or two EL34s, wire all four sockets as you would for El34s and then with respect to the high voltage center tap of the OT, run two pairs of power tube sockets on each side and each socket on a single cathode resistor of about 270 ohms to 330ohms.
That will allow you to yank out two power tubes, one from each side.
You could have two 6L6s or two EL34s or four 6V6s because each socket has a means to bias the power tube individually.

[hasserl]

I built one of these kits. I used the trannies that came with the kit, but I used the low voltage taps of the WO22798 PT and a 5U4 rectifier to arrive at 334VDC B+. The kits come with a WG34 Copper Cap, which puts out a higher voltage, then there is a 100 ohm 10 watt power resistor in series with the B+ to reduce voltage. Like BRuce, I don't like that approach, using the 5U4 brought the voltage down just fine, thank you very much. Not using the 100 ohm power resistor opened up a space on the board, which I filled with a second power tube cathode resistor, so I have two pairs of tubes each running a 250 ohm resistor/25uf cap. One is connected to a switch so it can be switched out for half power (I need to wire that up with the 4 & 8 ohm OT taps and a DPDT switch so I can switch the impedance when I switch the power setting).

Clean output with all four tubes on is 32 watts at 1kHz.

[Bruce / Mission Amps]

Ah ha!
I didn't see the latest revision with the 15 watt 100 ohm resistor as a B+ dropping resistance.
Looks they have made some changes.
I wouldn't do that dropping resistor either.
That unnecessarily uses up high voltage power tranny current doing no audio work.

The older WO22798 was an inexpensive Chinese copy of my 50 watt, HEYBOER, which I had spec'd with a high and low high voltage tap so I could use it with my tweed 6L6 amps or my 45 watt Crusader amps... I now use the Mission Heyboer 798 in the 35 watt Aurora amps too... great all around PT.
I gave those specs to Weber a few years ago and he had their Chinese winder build their version of it so if it is any good it, it would be a nice general purpose power tranny for a casual amp builder.


Use a NOS 5U4G or 5U4GB in the 5E3X2 and it should work well with a single 180 to 200ohm 15 watt biasing resistor.
I think the way the kit was, alway seemed to have the four power tubes a little hot, so just use the lower voltage tap and pick a combination of cathode biasing resistor and rectifier that has each 6V6 tube idling at around 11-12 watts and it will work great.
If you can pop for a reissue Super Reverb type OT, it will sound even better.

[hasserl]

If you can pop for a reissue Super Reverb type OT, it will sound even better.

Thanks for the tip, I may have to give that a try. But I'll need one with multiple impedance taps as I'm running a single 15" 8 ohm.

[LesCarr]

Bruce wrote:
"Node just means a spot in the B+ rail where a resistor, in series with the B+ allows, you to "tap off" for lower voltages after the resistor and you have a grounded high voltage filter/decoupling cap at that spot too.
You could build this so you can run either four 6V6s or two 6L6s or two EL34s, wire all four sockets as you would for El34s and then with respect to the high voltage center tap of the OT, run two pairs of power tube sockets on each side and each socket on a single cathode resistor of about 270 ohms to 330ohms.
That will allow you to yank out two power tubes, one from each side.
You could have two 6L6s or two EL34s or four 6V6s because each socket has a means to bias the power tube individually."

I'm new to this can you illustrate the above described mod? I have never wired an amp for EL34's before. This my first from scratch build