Demise of the Incandescent Lamp?

[Mark Black]

For all of us out here (in many countries including the USA at least) who use "light bulb current limiters" we might want to stock up and put aside some extra lamps.

This made me think about it:
washingtonpost.com

And this is the "writing on the wall" crux of the whole thing:
Phase-out of incandescent light bulbs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not much else will work as well (or as cheaply) for the limiter application. Probably not going to happen overnight, but I'm just sayin'...

There is quite a bit of controversy over the decision to phase out incandescent lamps with arguments on both sides as to pollution, greenhouse gasses, and so forth. But regardless it looks likely that the politicians have spoken, and this thing WILL come to pass.

Personally I have burned through many incandescent lamps in my life, but never had anything that caused the smoke, stink, and concern over fire danger as did a CFL burning up in my bedroom table lamp so I regard CFL's now with some suspicion. LED's usually require at least a little bit of electronics so I kinda lump them in there as well. In any case neither will work for the current-limiter application as is the subject of my main concern. The implications for stage & DJ lighting will be interesting as well, to be sure.

Just thought I'd throw that out there...

[Chuck H]

I can't say as to DJ and stage lighting. That's probably going to suck for awhile. But as far as the CFL's and LED's seeming just as toxic or more so than incandescent lamps all I can say is that your not considering what's happening on the far end of the power line to make the thing operate. The amount of energy that must be generated to operate incans compared to the greener alternatives is the point. Less clean in your home but more clean at the power plant.

As far as current limiters go you can always build them with big honkin resistors and LED's on a voltage divider as indicators. Or something like that. I doubt it will ever come to that as there will likely be some industrial application by which incandescent bulbs will continue to be available. Though you may have to buy a special socket to use them. They will no longer be applicable in a general way for household use but that won't stop us.

Chuck

[g1]

Interesting. I was hoping standard bulbs would remain available because CFL's have problems with cold weather (life cycle vastly de-rated). I see they now have low-temp CFL's so that issue is being dealt with.
I guess the key for the bulb limiter is the question of "cheap & easy". I imagine they will always be available (same for gasoline IMO) but the price will keep going up to the point we don't want to use them as "fuses".
How about old automotive tail light bulbs? Not so easy as you would have to build a harness for a bunch in parallel, but the vintage auto stuff seems to always be around.
Perhaps others folks here have other suggestions?

[Alex R]

The light bulb limiter is a standard part of electrician's kit, it's not just us in our small corner that use them. So I'm hoping that's enough to keep the trade suppliers using a few. But if the manufacturers all close down I vote we all subscribe to buy out a plant in Kiev and keep the proud light bulb tradition alive.

[Mark Black]

I have given consideration to the different facets of the incandescent vs CFL & LED issue, and I have lots of CFL's in my house. I just don't particularly trust CFL's in terms of possible fire danger after the burn in my bedroom - something that future lighting fixtures will possibly address much as current ones have done for the incandescent lamp. You just can't stick a CFL wherever you used to use an incandescent, most notably in an enclosed fixture or other extreme temperature environment like an oven. As far as "carbon footprint" well, I would favor population control as a start - but apparently that's just me and along with all-of-the-above is most certainly better discussed in another forum somewhere... (steps off soapbox)

Regarding an alternative to the incandescent lamp for use as a current-limiter for our use as a test tool, I would seriously like to hear about an elegant cost-effective substitute that will meet the requirements of power-handling, resistance-rise tracking current-rise, and easy visual feedback.

I agree there will probably be some kind of access to incandescent-style lamps for the foreseeable future, so this is not an immediate doom-and-gloom scenario. Just wanted to point out a trend that may affect us.

[nashvillebill]

Phasing out incandescents....My oven has an incandescent light bulb in it. To my knowledge, there ain't a LED or CFL that can handle the temperatures of an oven, especially in self-cleaning mode.

Now, I'm all for saving energy, but just like the misguided banning of leaded solder in the EU, there needs to be some degree of common sense here.

[defaced]

120v 1A fuses have to exist. That's about what you have with a 100w incandescent bulb. Aren't the elements both tungsten?

[R.G.]

There was a thread on this a ways back. Yep, they're going away. Our political heroes are once again doing something which gets attention and does little to fix whatever was used for an excuse to do it. My disgust for the sheer prostitution of politicians knows few limits.

Politicians who beat their chest about having reduced pollution from power plants by replacing incandescents quietly ignore it when you ask about the vast quantities of mercury being spread around, some of which is in every fluorescent bulb made. They'll look for a different question to answer every time.

There is nothing which does the same job as the incandescent bulb. Sure, we can go figure out a time-dependent, (almost) purely resistive (imitating) electronic load which does a similar job, at larger cost and much higher complexity. Eventually.

1A fuses are not a replacement, unfortunately. Fuse filaments are low melting point alloys, almost the opposite of tungsten. Tungsten is almost unmeltable, which is why it can be heated to such an emissive glow without being destroyed. Fuse links melt at almost anything, which is why they... um, fuse. Light bulb limiters are there because fuses are expensive, and offer no time to probe the circuit before they open entirely.

[jrfrond]

CFL's and LED arrays have severe limitations with temperature, cost, viewing angle and luminosity vs. the incandescent. Like our old favorite electron tubes, they do waste a lot of energy in the form of heat, but they do their job well and are relatively rugged when used properly.

I'm not a chemical engineer, but I am relatively well-rounded (meaning knowledge folks, not just my Italian mid-section!), but it seems to me that the production of the amount of LED's required to build an array equivalent to a 100W bulb would have a greater carbon footprint vs. the single incandescent, not to mention the toxic cleanup required due to the heavy-metal doping required of the diode junctions.

I remember when the demise of the electron tube was predicted. We're still waiting. Don't worry folks. Mike Matthews at New Sensor will surely see a market for imported incandescent light bulbs and set up part of the Reflektor factory to produce them for us. Of course, THEN the question will be, how good are they vs. NOS light bulbs!

[Jazz P Bass]

I had a cfl in a trouble light that I dropped.
The base came off of the lamp.
Man, what a busy little circuit that is!

[gbono]

Why worry about having access to incandescent lighting when you still can get vacuum tubes - who ever thought tubes would still be available (or wanted)???

HB LEDs are only 2% of the total lighting market - you haven't seen anything yet. As far as LED fabrication and the impact on the environment - what about the pollution generated by the computer, LCD display or cell phone you use to access this forum?

As far a CFLs go, they are unreliable due to the poor manufacturing practices used to build them. Also check out the UV generated by any fluorescent light – that’s why the paper hanging in your office turns yellow over time (and so do you).

[R.G.]

...it seems to me that the production of the amount of LED's required to build an array equivalent to a 100W bulb would have a greater carbon footprint vs. the single incandescent, not to mention the toxic cleanup required due to the heavy-metal doping required of the diode junctions.

Every specialized job has its own specialized jargon and technical terms, which usually need translation to the language the rest of us use so we can understand it. It is always a mistake to think you understand what a technical specialist means when he says a word you think you know. He has a very accurate, specialized meaning within his speciality. In the case of politicians, this makes us conclude they are lying, when in fact, they have just used their specialized terms and we mentally apply the day-to-day meanings we use with otherwise-ordinary laypeople. Politicians are always telling the truth - we just don't properly understand the jargon.

I have collected the meanings of several specialized political words and phrases over the years, and here are some of them.
the environment: Place outside governmental offices where the peasants live.
pollution: reason for adding new laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
global warming: reason for adding new laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
carbon footprint:new technical tool for restricting and controlling the everyday actions of the peasants
cap and trade: useful tool to enact laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
tax reduction: taking money away from the peasants more slowly, generally to achieve return to office of incumbents
rule of law: restriction and control of the everyday actions of the peasants
business climate: how fast money goes to the government to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
justice:return to office of incumbents
thoughtful and intelligent government: the peasants return me to office

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power. Abraham Lincoln

[tubeswell]

Right that does it! I've off to the supermarket to stock up on a heap of NOS lightbulbs right away. I'm gonna fill my house up. In 50 years time I'll be able to auction them off one by one. ;-)

[jrfrond]

I LOVE your definitions! It all conveniently translates into one single character though:

$

Every specialized job has its own specialized jargon and technical terms, which usually need translation to the language the rest of us use so we can understand it. It is always a mistake to think you understand what a technical specialist means when he says a word you think you know. He has a very accurate, specialized meaning within his speciality. In the case of politicians, this makes us conclude they are lying, when in fact, they have just used their specialized terms and we mentally apply the day-to-day meanings we use with otherwise-ordinary laypeople. Politicians are always telling the truth - we just don't properly understand the jargon.

I have collected the meanings of several specialized political words and phrases over the years, and here are some of them.
the environment: Place outside governmental offices where the peasants live.
pollution: reason for adding new laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
global warming: reason for adding new laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
carbon footprint:new technical tool for restricting and controlling the everyday actions of the peasants
cap and trade: useful tool to enact laws to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
tax reduction: taking money away from the peasants more slowly, generally to achieve return to office of incumbents
rule of law: restriction and control of the everyday actions of the peasants
business climate: how fast money goes to the government to restrict and control the everyday actions of the peasants
justice:return to office of incumbents
thoughtful and intelligent government: the peasants return me to office

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power. Abraham Lincoln

[R.G.]

I LOVE your definitions! It all conveniently translates into one single character though:
$

Actually, that's incorrect. In government it is **always** about power.

If you have to choose money or power, pick power. You can always simply take money if you have power.

It is possible, but it is very much harder to get power if you only have money. Those with the power keep taking your money away. The powerful always become rich. The rich only sometimes become powerful.