Soldering headache.

[Sea Chief]

Ive got a serious soldering WTF is going on & Ive spent ages. Pls help.

Ive been tinkering/ building hifi power supplies/ modding preamps, building gtr amps, pedals/ general house diy soldering stuff for 10 yrs. Never a problem with soldering irons. Good ones, or 30w realtively low cost ones, all have done me well. Ive only gone thru 4 or so (ie the element may go after a few yrs or I forget & leave on & handle melts a bit etc). All I do is either buy another or a new tip. P-easy soldering Ive always found.

And so recently I buy another, 40w for undoing point-to-point wired board stuff & general solder jobs. I buy my usual solder, again low-cost but never a prop (never 1 dry solder even). Iron seems a tad hotter as expected & so solder flows quick. I heat for 10 mins, dip very end in flux as usual & tin tip. But I whip thru a tip in a few days. Hmm too hot iron? Ok I buy another tip no big deal. This one tho will not let solder onto the tip. It balls & falls off. Eh? I use 1/4 tube of solder but cannot get it to flow even a few mm's onto tip, nothing, just hundreds of solder balls on my bench. I struggle to use it like so for even small jobs, but it just wont work. It looks like a new tip still after 3 days of trying (completely opposite to the first tip). For eg I try to join two simple wires: I have to leave iron touching for 3-4-5 godam mins until eventually it might just at last melt, then I quickly try to add solder but it sticks instead of properly flows. WTF?

I order new tip. Same thing. I order another from another supplier. Same thing. Wtf! Im so puzzled I call up manufacturer of s'iron/ aplology etc & sends a replacement next day. Same damn thing. What the f**k is going on? Im going mad here.

Any ideas? thx SC

[flyingdutchman]

You bought a cheap Chinese solder iron?

Trust me, a good solder iron is an essential tool. I settled on a Weller Magnastat TCP 24Vac 50W thermostatic a long time ago and never looked back. These solder irons tend cost a few bucks, but they're worth it.

[Sea Chief]

You bought a cheap Chinese solder iron?

Trust me, a good solder iron is an essential tool. I settled on a Weller Magnastat TCP 24Vac 50W thermostatic a long time ago and never looked back. These solder irons tend cost a few bucks, but they're worth it.

Well as said Ive had a few over the years. The most expensive a weller 30w made in china. Fine. The least expensive 30w made in china too. Fine also.

Everything is made in china now. Even Vox amps are. If I bought a new temp-controlled £75 soldering iron, it would be made in china. I dont/ cantwarrant spending that much. Besides I may well have exactly the same problem; its the problem I need to find out- why its doinfg this/ what is the root cause. Me? the iron? the tip? the solder? the mains voltage?

[Paleo Pete]

Chrome plated tip? Sandpaper. Same happened to me with a couple of new guitar jacks, tried to solder a half dozen times, and I know I do a good soldering job, solder would just roll off. 30 seconds with some 180 grit or a foamboard fingernail file and it takes every time. Knock the chrome surface off, or just rough it up and it works great. Too slick for solder to stick I think. I'm not positive, but it seems one of my soldering tips did the same.

[Sea Chief]

But the (nickel) plated tip it has is meant to be there. Shiny yes, but so have been all the tips Ive ever bought. And they all have worked. Its a new iron, right out of the pack. I shouldnt have to sand the tip down, surely.

Nevertheless Ive done what you suggest, 30 secs with a gtr nail file, so the copper is nearly showing. Im sure I shouldnt be doing this, but will try.. its heating up now.

I have had this 'balling'/ not taking to tip/ unuseable iron iirc once before, with my very first Antex, a medium cost £30 one, which I took to be my beginner's first efforts doing something wrong & binned it. I almost gave up there and then, but persevered and bought another (far cheaper) iron just to see if I could do this 'soldering thing'. That worked perfectly for 4 yrs: solder took to tip, never any 'balling', and off I went doing all sorts.. so its not neccessarily a 'cheap' iron thing.

Whatever it is- I simply need to know. Its a curse.

[Sea Chief]

Just tried hving sanded- exactly the same.

It seems hot enough too: as soon as I touch the solder to tip it melts to a ball and drops off. I try just dipping very end of tip into flux first, exactly the same.

WTF is this sh*t?!

Its driving me f**king mad. I cannot do the jobs I had lined up. If I knew it was the iron- fine I could get another (Ive just got another FOC/ so its nlikely it is this). If I knew it was the solder- fine I could get some other (the same stuff Ive been using for years). If I knew it was my technique- fine (I can forget the last 10 yrs ive been soldering and re-learn from page 1 if I must/ nonsensical). I dont give a flyng f**k what it is- I just want to know WHY.

[mhuss]

Did you try skipping the tip tinning bit and just using as-is it to try some soldering work? I've always used solder with embedded flux and have never used a separate flux dip in over 30 years of soldering. I saw that behavior once long ago with a cheapo soldering iron I was using to fix something backstage before a gig. I found the balling puzzling, but got the job done.

--mark

[Sea Chief]

Did you try skipping the tip tinning bit and just using as-is it to try some soldering work? I've always used solder with embedded flux and have never used a separate flux dip in over 30 years of soldering. I saw that behavior once long ago with a cheapo soldering iron I was using to fix something backstage before a gig. I found the balling puzzling, but got the job done.

--mark

Good point- yes I tried everything. Flux or not, sponge or not, either/ or not. Sanding tip, or fresh new. Leaving for 25 mins or leaving for 10 mins. No difference whatsoever. Solder balls/ falls off tip. Iron cannot be used.

Ive tried going straight to the job, but will not work properly. As said even simple test to tin a wire end, or join two together and Im waiting minuits with no sign of melting. Thats not right. If I cannot even tin a damn wire end then I cant solder anything. Three brand new tips and all the same. It seems like 'the voltage has been compromised' but this is highly/ utterly unlikely (even if down to say 225v it would just take a few more mins say to get up to temp maybe).

Thing is Ive never had a problem (bar 1st time 10 yrs ago) with this. Ive used the same solder, the same type of irons (quite likely the same elements with different labels). UnlessI know wht the cause is, and as said my no 1 was medium cost and showed similar symptoms, I cannot have any confidence when I buy another £40 medium cost one instead that it wont do exactly the same.

I want to find the reason. Tip covering? (whatever it is can be ground off tho). Tip temp? (solder melts immediatley but in balls tho). Iron temp? (tip seems hot as before). Solder? (same stuff Ive used resolutely for 5 years without once 'balling'). My technique? (same as Ive always done). Voltage from wall? (surely even a few VAC out and it would still heat to speeed even if a few mins extra). What else??

[Jazz P Bass]

The solder 'balling up' upon melting tells me the tip is too hot.

[soundguruman]

There are a variety of reasons why solder won't flow properly...

Dirt / contamination on the iron tip...the tip must be perfectly clean, this is not an option.
A. a wet sponge is considered inferior these days, a "soldering iron tip cleaner" is preferred. It does work much better for a variety of reasons...
Link: Soldering Iron Tip Cleaner | eBay The stainless ones are better I think...
A1. The water on the sponge can be contaminated with water system chemicals. This contamination (on the tip) can prevent heat transfer, and make you pull your hair out.
The tip looks clean and does not work worth a crap, because heat can't be conducted from the tip.
Use distilled water or a tip cleaner instead.

contamination on the board or part or terminal: Oxidized metal won't solder. Clean it thoroughly with something like Scotch bright metal polishing pads.
Remove all remaining crud with solvent (like isopropyl alcohol) Circuit board, etc...should be cleaned by scrubbing w/ alcohol, before soldering...
I use Q tips and alcohol, or alcohol and a toothbrush quite often, to scrub crud and flux off boards.
If the parts/board/terminal is not perfectly clean and un-oxidized, don't expect the solder to flow. This is not optional.
Copper circuit tracks can be cleaned with a gum eraser.
If the copper is not bright clean and shiny, solder will never flow onto it. Oxidized copper CANNOT be soldered.

Too high or too low a temperature.
40Watt iron will not solder everything. The bigger the mass you are heating, the more power is required. There is no substitute for too little heat!
That's why most people should be using a real soldering station, instead of a soldering iron. The ability to increase/decrease heat is essential to good soldering results.
Most soldering would improve immensely, if people would just buy a real soldering station. The consumer grade soldering irons are not remarkable in performance.

It's almost a joke to try to work on tube amps with a cheap soldering pencil...There is NO WAY I could survive with a 40 watt soldering iron. I use 30-85 watts adjustable, all day long. A range of 280C-450C in temperature adjustment is ROUTINE. 450C will be used to solder a wire to a steel chassis, and that's LOW for chassis attachment...
Especially if you are DE-soldering / solder wicking, / soldering to chassis... you need way more than 40 watts. (don't pretend it's enough)
Don't expect professional result without using professional tools. Without the tools, you are making it much harder (or impossible) on yourself.

[Sea Chief]

Hi- thanks for thoughts & I take all points on board. The iron is defo not too hot JP as for eg, I try to melt a typical resisitor solder joint & it takes up to 20 secs. (Thats not right If anything its too cold if its not melting a joint before 20 secs surely). Im used to doing this hundreds & hundreds & hundreds of times w'out ever a problem; I touch & in 2 secs melts/ sucker off. I wipe crud off tip with my cleaner, sponge, then flux & tin it. Perfect every time, & maybe a thousand times with iron(s) exactly like this.

But its defo not contamination of tip either: Ive 3 times used a brand new tip not even dipped in flux, wiped on sponge, or in my tip cleaner. Ive just tried to flow a smidge of solder onto the new tip. I try when nearly up to speed, and I try once defo up to speed (Ive also tried first dipping in flux, or sponging a tad, either/ or combos of each until my brain hurts I just dont understand: it continues to ball & I turn off the iron unused).

If I can just find out the cause I can blast the Co responsible.. and consider replacing whatever the c*ck it may be.


Ive done ths hundreds of times before without a moments trouble. Now it seems an absolute impossibility. Its absurd.

[Jazz P Bass]

Get a new one.
This one is obviously crap.

[Sea Chief]

Get a new one.
This one is obviously crap.

But I just have.
(reminds me of Neil on bathnight: "Neil your filthy! go & have a bath".... "But I've just had one.").

Thing is JP they're all 'crap' arent they/ all made in china even expensive ones I bet are still crap and chinese too. Just with a lump of a TCP next to the crap iron. Tbh Ive had no problem at all for 10 years with crap chinese irons! thats why I dont understand this crap.

[Randall]

Maybe you got a bad batch of solder, have at least tried some different?

[dai h.]

The solder 'balling up' upon melting tells me the tip is too hot.

My thinking also. If you have a Variac (I'm assuming this is a cheap non-temperature controlled iron), try turning the voltage down (to turn down the temperature). Also, which (maker) iron is this? IME cheap irons can work okay if you can adjust the temperature (with a Variac or perhaps a resistor in line with the AC voltage--they tend to overheat though so you have to turn them down or off to cool them off a bit). Mostly (how well things go or don't go) is down to technique, I think.