Fender Twin High Impedance Speakers

[bobloblaws]

I have a 74/75 Fender Twin here that doesn't seem as loud as it should be. I was doing some troubleshooting, then on a whim I checked the impedance of the speaker cabinet. It turns out to be 16 ohm whereas the OT is looking for 4 ohm. I measured each of the two speakers individually and I was shocked to discover they are 32 ohms each and have been wired in parallel for 16 ohms. They at least appear to be original speakers, blue label Fender branded, typical for that era I think. At first I wondered if they might be defective, but both are virtually identical impedance, coincidence? Has anyone ever come across Fender speakers as described?

B.

[J M Fahey]

If they are as described, Iīd rather mistrust the meter.

What does it show on lowest ohm scale with probes touching each other?

What does it show when you read a standard resistor in the range 10 to 30 ohm?

[bobloblaws]

If they are as described, Iīd rather mistrust the meter.

What does it show on lowest ohm scale with probes touching each other?

What does it show when you read a standard resistor in the range 10 to 30 ohm?

No, my meter is fine Jaun. For example I have another Twin here which I measured at the same time, just under 4 ohms as expected. On auto range and the lowest manual range it shows 0.1 ohm with probes touching. A 16 ohm carbon comp measures at 16.3 ohm.

[Justin Thomas]

And check your meter battery...

That said: Ampeg used 32R speakers in the SVT and a few others, and still does on occasion. There is at least ONE Fender thst came with 32R speakers; they didn't really care as long as tje total was right. I think ypur speakers were replaced long ago. They may look original, but I doubt tharlt C10N was originalin that 67 Princeton Reverb I got in, either. Date code matched, though...

Someome may hve just "fixed it" toget through the gig & then forgot to fix it right later. Happens all the time.

Justin

[bobloblaws]

And check your meter battery...

That said: Ampeg used 32R speakers in the SVT and a few others, and still does on occasion. There is at least ONE Fender thst came with 32R speakers; they didn't really care as long as tje total was right. I think ypur speakers were replaced long ago. They may look original, but I doubt tharlt C10N was originalin that 67 Princeton Reverb I got in, either. Date code matched, though...

Someome may hve just "fixed it" toget through the gig & then forgot to fix it right later. Happens all the time.

Justin

Interesting. Do you have any idea which Fender amp had the 32 ohm speakers?

Edit: I just did a quick search. Looks like they might have come out of a Rhodes.

[Leo_Gnardo]

I just did a quick search. Looks like they might have come out of a Rhodes.

Right! Rhodes "suitcase" amp has 4 x 32 ohm 12 inch speakers. Tough thing to find when you need 'em.

Fender Bassman Ten combo, a fearsome foursome of 32 ohm 10 inchers. What's good, these days Jensen offers 50 watt MOD speakers with 32 ohm voice coils. They claim these also work in an SVT cab.

[Enzo]

I have a 10" 32 ohm new in the box for an AMpeg 8x10. Always wondered what else it could be used for.

[Justin Thomas]

Leo,

Since an original SVT cab only handled 280W to begin with, your 50Watters should do better in an 8x10". That's why Ampeg really pushed buying both cabinets. Also remember, there were no "bass speakers" back then... Ah, the good old days before all the modern "bass" speakers...

Justin

[Enzo]

Well, there weren't real bass 10's, but surely those 18s and even many 15s weren't made for full range.

[nevetslab]

Back in the 'old days', one had to resort to JBL 154C's that were intended for LF horn-loaded enclosures, or 130A or 130B woofers. Then, the LE15A's came into being, and not long after, the D140F bass speaker. Altec had their similar woofers that mounted into the theater A2 front-loaded boxes, and the smaller 825 cabint...Voice of the Theater line. Seemed to take years before real 10" bass speakers appeared (from EV)

[Justin Thomas]

But what is "real?" In my opinion, what they call "bass" speakers now sound like crap. I much prefer a Showman or Bassman cab or vintage Ampeg. What mattered was how thrymade the cabinet; and it could sound just as good for guitar.

I don't have any experience w. EVs; but if they're efficient I'd probably like them. And don't need a horn to "help" with the treble...

Justin

[J M Fahey]

EVs are killer for Bass,very clear and defined sound,which cuts well in the mix.
Similab to 60īs Bass speakers,lots of punchy midrange.

From mid 80īs on Bass speakers were constantly "improved" which means "Thiele-Small parameters were improved so now the 40-80Hz octave is reproduced like never before .... everything else was sacrificed for that "ideal" and now you need 500W into 2 x 10" with half a pound cone each and half a foot long voice coils ... which can not keep up with an unamplified drummer
Not kidding.
Now I regularly see everywhere Bass players with one of those brick sized Class D amps, anywhere from 250W (TC Electronics) to 350/500W (Ampeg/Fender/Aguilar) to 700/1000W (G&K) who are NOT heard, you canīt make out what are they playing, not even what key are they in, just a muddy undefined rumble similar to thunder 10 miles away or the Subway passing underground.

[Chuck H]

I'm surprised so many bass players and bass amp manufacturers still lean so hard to the audiophool side of things when SO MANY old recordings sound so good. I really think bass tone peaked with the Ampeg stuff. That was as hi fi as it should have ever gotten. I came up playing in the 80's when bass amps and keyboard amps were synonymous. Many general purpose sound reinforcement type instrument amps are still made that tout things like "Great for bass and keyboards." Now, keyboards have moved into modern pop and rock in the form of synthesizers, so it makes some sense that such an instrument would need a good "sound reinforcement amp". But again, old recordings of Rhodes, Hammond and Leslie stuff sound SOOOO cool, why would people seeking those sounds take such a left turn with the speakers?

And as Juan already noted in his description of the construction, efficiency suffers greatly with specialized speakers. As a guitarist I know there are less efficient speakers that I generally like the tone of, but I can "feel" the lack of efficiency. For real. It's sort of like wearing a condom, for lack of a better explanation. Yes, it's still good. Just not close enough to the bone

[Justin Thomas]

^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^
And while I'm at it, they sound like butt-ass-CRAP, too. It seems that "bass amps" aren't even hifi anymore, and more akin to the typical boom-chucka-chucka in every blingster's car.

Juan, it's you & me against the world... But I won't quit playing my 50W Bassman through those crappy 2x15" CTSs....

Justin

Edit: "^^^^^THIS^^^^^" is "what Juan said."

[Chuck H]

Ah, screw it. This stuff will all be digitally synthesized so hip hoppers can sample the "tonz" they like. Rock is dead! And so is the tube amp and the "full range speaker". Get over yourself and maybe just spend some time weaving baskets old man. No one wants to "feel" their instrument anymore. The just want to make the sounds everyone else makes. Soon enough it will ALL be played through hi fidelity reproduction gear with the pre EQ set as needed within the sample. I hope your home has a porch. Otherwise you won't have a place to put your rocking chair so you can tell those kids "Git offa my lawn!"