What the heck is B+, and that A on AA764 Champ Schematic?

[Rob Mercure]

Is MSU "Miami State University?" I spent a while in Cincinnati as the "Senior Tech" (which means the only full time one) at Buddy Roger's Music. But I've never had a formal electronics class in my life - I was a hyper active (before it had the alphabet soup of letters) electronics nerd in high school and I learned as I needed to by dragging home television chassis for parts - as Steve did. My "lesson plans" were the RCA Manual and the ARRL Handbook - these aren't some college level textbooks but instead the "shop manuals" for the working tube era corner TV shop guy. Here in Wise County there were no - absolutely no - TV "repairmen" -we weren't called "techs" - who had any sort of college education and this was before the community college system hit Virginia. There were a few guys who were trained in the military, a few under the "Manpower" program, but the majority of us learned on our own from the few printed materials available.

So I still maintain that Eric could learn more in an evening - as far as the very basics of tube electronics - from the RCA Manual than from the internet, despite his protests. But reading is a habit that has to be learned just like playing a guitar or holding your liquor or flirting with women or driving a motorcycle well or anything else. Yeah my mother was a librarian and was smart enough to let me learn and roam where I wished and I did grow up pre-internet and cable TV but I was also an emotionally disturbed clinically hyperactive child (they wanted to put me on amphetamines in the third grade - Ritalin wasn't invented yet). So if you think that sitting still and slowing down enough to learn something was easy for me you're flippin' crazy - just ask the numerous high school teachers that gave up on me.
But now at 54 I can look back at having been a somewhat successful tech for over 35 years, have owned and run my own small repair business, have been the primary tech for a large business (BRM above), have gotten a Master's degree and served a land use planner at state and county level as well as a couple of year (in hell) as the manager of a small town (as well as being an environmental organizer, a certified massage therapist, a state Forest Warden/forest fire fighter, helped direct a homeless shelter, helped direct a hospice, etc.).

So there ain't no excuse for not learning nor taking the time to make yourself learn if you're are interested in something no matter how shitty the learning institutions that you've had to endure!

My not so humble opinion.

Rob

[martin manning]

Rob, no, MSU is Michigan State U. Miami U. is in Oxford Ohio, and takes its name from the Native Americans that used to live in these parts. If you lived in Cincinnati, you probably know all that... BR Music is the local music store for me. I'd guess you know Dave Miller, whom I see and talk with once or twice a week since my son takes lessons there.

There are lots of ways to get where you are going. I have learned a great deal from the 'net, in terms of practical things... this forum is like being able to look over the shoulder of some very knowledgeable people. The other thing that it does is point out some of the best reference books, and there are some pretty good electronic references I've found on-line too. I kind of like books though, much better for flipping through.

MPM

[Shontsy]

Maybe I'll check out RCA and ARRL, and even Pease. Maybe they're not so bad. I've never seen any of these.

I was busy restoring cars and motorcycles in my formative years. I can throw parts in buckets, leave them for 3 years, and put it all back together with no leftover parts. THAT I am really good at! That and playing football, doing RC cars and planes, riding dirt bikes, who knows what all. I'm a man of 1000 hobbies. That's one reason it takes so long for me to learn the stuff that doesn't come natural to me. I spread myself so thin, it's hard to fit it all in, so I wind up going in spurts of activity and inactivity on any one persuit. OH well, it's not life and death or anything, it's just free time killers! At least I'm doing something constructive with my time, I guess!

Thanks for the feedback!

[Shontsy]

Oh YEAH, the radio guy with the huge pack that always gets shot! I forgot about that. Windtalkers and all that. Yeah, I knew about tube radios in cars, but that seems more practical than one you just carry around with you. Cars were huge, they had plenty of room! Not to mention gasoline fired heaters in some too!!! Yikes!

[tubeswell]

I

But reading is a habit that has to be learned just like playing a guitar or holding your liquor or flirting with women or driving a motorcycle well or anything else.
But now at 54 I can look back at having .... gotten a Master's degree and served a land use planner at state and county level as well as a couple of year (in hell) as the manager of a small town (as well as being an environmental organizer,).

So there ain't no excuse for not learning nor taking the time to make yourself learn if you're are interested in something no matter how shitty the learning institutions that you've had to endure!

My not so humble opinion.

Rob

Hey Rob - Land use planner! - Ditto :-) (I too trained at uni as a land use planner and have worked in that field for 17 years and am now serving as an environmental policy analyst)

I too, being in my mid forties, have had several career changes, after trying to start out as a 'professional' muso at the tender age of 18, ended up going to uni at 23 to study sociology, physical anthropolgy and then another degree in planning. Gave up music for 16 years (having trained on the piano from the tender age of 6, guitars from 13 and having played music continuously until I was 23), then in my late 30s taking up guitars again, and tube amps in my forties. The learning fun never stops!

I believe the key to learning is passion for what you want to learn. This gives you the energy to persevere.

[Shontsy]

OK, LAST post on this thread, but I need help. WHAT RCA manual and ARRL books exactly am I looking for? There are SEVERAL of both at amazon.com. RCA manuals look to be just different copyright dates, maybe, but the ARRL stuff has several different titles. Can someone clue me in? Thanks. Found Pease!

[martin manning]

Maybe there should be a references area. Here are some links:

http://music-electronics-forum.com/s...ctronics+books

Jack Darr's book is very practical, and you can download a copy free.

I think most would say RC30 is the RCA tube manual to get. It is mostly (75%) tube reference data though. Antique Electronic Supply sells a very good reprint for about $25 I think.

The Radiotron Designer's Handbook (4th Edition, 1953) is said to be the bible of tube audio, and is very often referenced. Probably everything is in there somewhere, but it is a little hard to use since the publisher seems to have just kept adding chapters without reorganizing it. You can pay a lot ($100 and up) for one but if you are patient you can find a good deal. I got one a while back that is in very good shape except some guy Frank McIntosh wrote his name in the front.

Look here for some other suggestions:

http://www.aikenamps.com/Bibliography.html

Come to think of it, there is a lot of very good technical reference material on Aiken's site too.

[Enzo]

There are two RCA reprints selling, the RC30 is the last one they issued and is the most up to date. the older RC17 or whatever it was is too old and doesn't cover tubes like El34 that we see all the time.

If I had to start a reference shelf from scratch, it is the first book I'd buy. Well worth the $25-30 they ask for it.

I used to buy a new RCA book every couple years - I wear them out.

The RDH is a great book covering electronics in general from the tube era. It has been scanned and is online from several sources. Here is one, download it at your liesure:
http://headfonz.rutgers.edu/RDH4/

I learned a lot of my electronics from the ARRL book back in the 1950s and early 1960s. The Radio Amateur's Handbook. They put a new issue out every year. It evolves with the industry. Recent editions won't cover tubes very well, if at all. By the 1970s, there were still tube tutorial chapters, but the majority of material was transistors. Look for an old copy from like 1965 or earlier.

The ARRL does have a ton of publications related to the various aspects of amateur radio. SOme are very specific like Antennas. Others are more general. But the one that would be most valuable is the Radio AMateur's Handbok.

I like Bob Pease, the guy is a real clear thinker, but I think his book wouldn't be of great value to you yet. It won't talk tubes at all (unless you get him talking about the old tube-based op amp modules from Philbrick) but it will talk about components and circuits. Get a little more familiar with the electronic concepts first. Then it will emerge as a great book.

On the other hand, Pease writes a lot, and you can find him at National Semiconductor. Their web site has a ton of tutorial stuff. They have what they call "Analog U." (Analog University) You can learn about all manner of things analog. Worth exploring.


MSU. Yes Michigan State. I used to be director of field operations for a company with business all over the vountry, and I had accounts at also Memphis State University and Mississippi State UNiversity. We had MSUs coming out our ears.

[mooreamps]

. I want to know how to buy $350 worth of tube amp parts and put together an amp worth $2500. Now THAT is useful knowledge!

That's why I'm here.

You and me both, buddy..... You and me both...

-g

[Steve Conner]

If you want to make a million building boutique amps, it helps to start out with 2 million. The topic has been covered a lot on this board before.

[mooreamps]

If you want to make a million building boutique amps, it helps to start out with 2 million. The topic has been covered a lot on this board before.

I'm already worth a couple million. I just want to biuld amplifiers.

-g