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  • #16
    Originally posted by vintagekiki View Post
    There is a difference between electrical and acoustic power. Be careful not to replace terms.
    As the dB value is a ratio, absolute power doesn't matter.

    A 3dB increase in power means doubling the power. Doubling electrical power also doubles acoustic power in the speaker's linear range.

    As more knowledgable posters in the thread you linked state, a 1dB increase in loudness (corresponding to 26% more power) is discernable in direct comparison.
    A 2dB increase is definitely noticeable.

    As JMF stated, a V30 is definitely louder than a 25W greenback.
    Last edited by Helmholtz; 04-25-2021, 03:19 PM.
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    • #17
      Originally posted by Helmholtz View Post
      Doubling electrical power also doubles acoustic power.
      This can lead to confusion as we still don't perceive double the acoustic power as double the loudness (3db vs 10db).
      Not disagreeing with you but I think it is important to note the difference.

      Originally posted by Enzo
      I have a sign in my shop that says, "Never think up reasons not to check something."


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      • #18
        Originally posted by g1 View Post
        This can lead to confusion as we still don't perceive double the acoustic power as double the loudness (3db vs 10db).
        Nothing wrong with my statement.

        A 3dB increase in power or doubled power increases SPL by 3dB (factor of 2). Don't forget that speaker sensitivity is defined as SPL per watt.
        Acoustic/sound power is not the same as sound pressure but they change by the same dB value..
        Perceived loudness is a psychoacoustical measure and has to be determined from the curves of equal loudness. It depends on frequency/spectrum.

        No one said that doubled acoustic power means doubled loudness.

        I read one of Zollner's books on electroacoustics and must say the topic is confusing indeed.
        Much more complicated than electronics, at least to me.
        Last edited by Helmholtz; 04-25-2021, 10:29 PM.
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        • #19
          Doubling electrical power also doubles acoustic power in the speaker's linear range.
          Acoustics dear friend ... ...
          An increase in subjective volume of 10 dB feels like a twice as loud sound.
          One is the values on measurements and simulations, and the other is what the human ear perceives.
          Acoustics ... ...
          It's All Over Now

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          • #20
            Originally posted by vintagekiki View Post
            Acoustics dear friend ... ...
            An increase in subjective volume of 10 dB feels like a twice as loud sound.
            One is the values on measurements and simulations, and the other is what the human ear perceives.
            Acoustics ... ...
            Not sure about friends..

            I did not speak about the correlation between SPL and loudness.

            Everyone can read up on that him-/herself.
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            • vintagekiki
              vintagekiki commented
              Editing a comment
              If you say so, so be it, but ...

          • #21
            See?
            Originally posted by Enzo
            I have a sign in my shop that says, "Never think up reasons not to check something."


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            • #22
              Originally posted by g1 View Post
              See?
              But don't blame me for the complexity of electroacoustics/psychoacoustics.

              I know that doubled loudness (a subjective sensation) roughly means an increase of 10dB in SPL for a single frequency.
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              • #23
                continued from from #13

                How much power an amplifier can transfer depends on how much PT can support amplifier, at the same time active components (output tubes or transistors) do not exceed the allowable dissipation.
                To test the PT, in addition amplifier needed dummy load, signal generator, AC and DC voltmeter are required.
                Raise the signal from the generator until some of the monitored voltages start to drop.
                Click image for larger version

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                If the DC voltage drops and the AC voltage is stable, the cause may be poor filtration (first elco) or a rectifier.
                If the AC voltage on the transformer drops, it is a sign that the PT is at the limit of its projected capabilities, and the resistance of the primary or secondary wire begins to work as a kind of current limiter.

                If compare the schematic for 50 and 100W amplifier, the difference is only in power for PT and OT. The voltages are mostly almost the same, only the projected current is higher.
                A stronger PT will give to amplifier some more power. If the PT has more power from dissipation of active components, comes to their burnout.
                And now we return to the question 18W or 22W, difference which is noticeable only on the measuring instruments.

                Human hearing has its own story



                It's All Over Now

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