Why do guitar amps never have the design considerations of hi-fi speakers?

[Dolmetscher007]

Nope. What we're saying is that if you plugged a typical guitar amp into woofers, tweeters and crossovers it would sound bad (subjectively) and is totally unnecessary at the instrument amp end of things. But recreating guitar sounds through woofers, tweeters and crossovers is done all the time on hi fi audio systems and sounds just fine.

Huh?

"Plugg[ing] a guitar amp into woofers, tweeters, and crossovers." I'm not sure what you mean by "plugging a guitar amp into a..." I meant designing an amp that has a... But maybe we mean the same thing, and I am just missing what you mean.

"...at the instrument amp end of things." I don't know what this means.

[The Dude]

Nope. What we're saying is that if you plugged a typical guitar amp into woofers, tweeters and crossovers it would sound bad (subjectively) and is totally unnecessary at the instrument amp end of things. But recreating guitar sounds through woofers, tweeters and crossovers is done all the time on hi fi audio systems and sounds just fine.

Not in the least untrue. It should be noted that, usually when this is done, there is a software or hardware cabinet emulator that makes the hifi speakers sound like guitar speakers, effectively doing away with the hifi.

[Justin Thomas]

Yess,,,, but could you kill small rodents within a 50 yard radius of my practice building

nosaj

Super Twin.

Justin

[Enzo]

They already have amps and speakers with woofers and tweeters that are all flat and wide band, they are called PA systems. You can plug a guitar into it, and you will hear the pale sound of a bare electric guitar. To most guitarists, that sounds "bad".


ALl that stuff that subwwoofers and tweeters make is not necessary in a guitar amp because electric guitar sounds don't venture into those regions.


In the learning process, you would be well served to ask why the industry does something rather than why doesn't it do something else.

[Chuck H]

In the learning process, you would be well served to ask why the industry does something rather than why doesn't it do something else.

I'm not sure that's the goal Don't you recognize the mo? Time will tell.

[Enzo]

Chuck, there are many times an OP is not really here to learn, but a thousand lurkers are. SO I try to provide reasonable advice to the general case.

[Chuck H]

Chuck, there are many times an OP is not really here to learn, but a thousand lurkers are. SO I try to provide reasonable advice to the general case.

I humbly digress (need bowing Kwai Chang Caine emoji).

[Enzo]

Grasshopper, when you can snatch the sound of one hand clapping from my grasp, you will be ready for entry level position...

[Dave H]

I'm not sure that's the goal Don't you recognize the mo? Time will tell.

I'm surprised someone who's been playing for 25 years doesn't know why already. (see #23)

[J M Fahey]

I think if the OP would just plug an electric guitar into his home hi-fi system, we would not be having this discussion. It is something best heard to understand.

Maybe the point is just "having a discussion"

In any case, our answers should be accurate (and are so) , to help those who really need them.

Simple Forum statistics show there are Thousands of people reading these pages, not becoming Members but hopefullly finding useful answers; that alone makes this worth it.

[catalin gramada]

When the ferromagnetic strings of a guitar vibrate through the magnetic flux created by a guitar pickup, the signal that is induced into the copper wire and sent to the output jack is made up of numerous frequencies ranging from 82.41 Hz to ~12 kHz, or realistically well beyond 40 kHz with all the overtones and harmonics possible.

Speakers that are designed to accurately reproduce an audio recording i.e. "Hi-Fidelity" speakers, are definitely, as you guys said, designed to represent the entire frequency spectrum in order to generate pressure waves through the air across the entire frequency spectrum audible to human ears. A piccolo will naturally produce pressure waves in the upper frequencies, where as the lowest string on a bass guitar will hang out in the lower registers.

But, unfortunately, none of that has anything to do with the fact that a metal guitar string produces frequencies between 82 Hz and 40+kHz, yet the device that we plug that guitar into, is not at all designed to accurately reproduce that signal. If there is some scientific reason for not attempting to accurately reproduce the frequencies induced by the vibrating guitar strings, that is totally cool, and I'd love to know more. But I'm wondering if it isn't more of a case of, "this is just how it has always been done."

Don't get me wrong! "This is how it has always been done" is often a perfectly fine answer. For example... 35mm film has a certain "fidelity" that was adopted by the film industry at one point, for whatever reason, and that was that. When digital cameras came along, and they began to realize that they could more accurately reproduce reflected light frequencies, beyond the "definition" of 35mm film, there was (and still is) a huge backlash of people saying that the new super-high-definition video is "too real" and now you can see every skin flaw, makeup smudge, nose hair, and taste bud on a 40 ft tall screen... saying that this new "HD" stuff doesn't look as good as the tried and true 35mm is a perfectly valid argument.

But... from the POV of an amp designer (which I clearly am NOT!!!), I think I would want to build an amp circuit that DOES reproduce the string vibrations as accurately as possible, and then send that amplified signal into a speak cabinet that WAS designed to reproduce that signal as accurately as possible. And then... use things like EQ, filters, and even intentionally designed speaker baffles to "color" the sound of my amp to sound like... well... however I want it to sound?

Man...
As well was all ready pointed here a guitar amp is a tone generator, most part of guitar tone, meant tone, harmonics or whatever comes from amplifier and speakers, some times such of way you cannot recognise the fundamental into a chord and harmonic intervals becomes unplayable due to the harmonic conflicts between those harmonics generate by speaker and amp. This is all about tone, guitar tone. If You want to deprive a guitar amp by its performance to generate such of tone by amp and speakers itself (transforming a guitar amp into a "linear device") you have to produce that tone in other place. This kind of things was done, unfortunately the feeling (interaction between player and instrument) get pretty wrong for a classic electric guitar approach.

[d95err]

But... from the POV of an amp designer (which I clearly am NOT!!!), I think I would want to build an amp circuit that DOES reproduce the string vibrations as accurately as possible, and then send that amplified signal into a speak cabinet that WAS designed to reproduce that signal as accurately as possible.

In the old days, before intentional distortion, gutar amps were designed to reproduce the sound of the guitar as accurately as possible. Many amps were designed to be multi-purpose (guitar, vocals, harmonica, accordion, ...). There was very little difference between a guitar channel and a microphone channel on the amps. However, as technology was limited and price was the dominating design goal, amps used crude and simple designs and speakers with very limited bandwidth. By accident, this did sound rather good, in particular as players started turning things up loud and getting distortion.

Digital modelling amps typically use the design philosophy of a tone-shaping preamp with a neutral poweramp and (near) full-range speaker. However, as discussed above, the tone shaping will result in the same limited bandwidth anyway, so adding tweeters or woofers would just add unnecessary cost and complexity without any real benefits.

[pdf64]

Linear speaker systems tend to be somewhat / significantly less sensitive (over the freq range relevant to regular guitar sounds) than regular guitar speakers, so amps of far higher power output would be required to generate the SPLs necessary to keep up with a drummer (ie playing real drums).

[Chuck H]

Grasshopper, when you can snatch the sound of one hand clapping from my grasp, you will be ready for entry level position...

High five would answer that koan.

I had a friend who did a funny master Po imitation. Complete with making the face. He would go into character and say "Grasshopper. Snatch the pebble... From my pants."

[Enzo]

I am like five-nine, my former business partner was a big guy at like six-three. One little shtick we used to do was claim "High five", and he'd hold his arm up straight, and I'd pretend to be unable to jump high enough. My pathetic leaps left me swinging and missing.