RoHS Directive...lets clear up the confusion.

[OverDriven]

In my research of RoHS, I have literally heard every angle on it and no one seems to agree. Some say that the lead free solder is as easy to work with as leaded solder. Some say that tin whiskers from lead free solder cause all kinds of problems. Some say that these whiskers only affect micro electronics. Some say that as long as you are selling your amps only in the USA, you can use leaded solder. Others have told me that California has adopted an RoHS-like directive and so you must comply even if you are selling only in the USA (unless you don't allow orders from people in CA). So what is the REAL deal? Can we please clear this up?. What I most want to know is if I can use non-RoHS compliant components and solder if I'm only selling in the US, and what the real deal about this California standard is. I'm also interested in reliability issues and what the best lead free solder alloy is.

Joe

[raiken]

In my research of RoHS, I have literally heard every angle on it and no one seems to agree. Some say that the lead free solder is as easy to work with as leaded solder. Some say that tin whiskers from lead free solder cause all kinds of problems. Some say that these whiskers only affect micro electronics. Some say that as long as you are selling your amps only in the USA, you can use leaded solder. Others have told me that California has adopted an RoHS-like directive and so you must comply even if you are selling only in the USA (unless you don't allow orders from people in CA). So what is the REAL deal? Can we please clear this up?. What I most want to know is if I can use non-RoHS compliant components and solder if I'm only selling in the US, and what the real deal about this California standard is. I'm also interested in reliability issues and what the best lead free solder alloy is.

Joe

California "RoHS-lite" is currently only for computer monitors and TVs, but you can bet the environmentalists and bureaucrats will expand that each year. They have already said as much.

You can still sell any amps with any of the banned substances anywhere in the US, as there is no RoHS here, yet.

Unleaded solder is a pain, because it melts at a higher temp and you can't tell a cold solder joint from a good one - they all look dull and grainy.

Tin whiskers shouldn't be a problem unless you are putting fine-pitch SMT components in your amps, although they can supposedly grow indefinitely, so they may eventually start showing up as a problem in larger-pitch devices.

Some more RoHS info:

http://www.pb-free.info/laymans_terms.htm

http://www.pb-free.info/rohsexemptions.htm

http://www.spring.gov.sg/Content/Pri...7-be6778ceca64

California RoHS:

http://www.dtsc.ca.gov/HazardousWaste/RoHS.cfm

http://www.rsjtechnical.com/WhatisCaliforniaRoHS.htm

http://www.greensupplyline.com/showA...leID=187201273




Randall Aiken

[OverDriven]

California "RoHS-lite" is currently only for computer monitors and TVs, but you can bet the environmentalists and bureaucrats will expand that each year. They have already said as much.

You can still sell any amps with any of the banned substances anywhere in the US, as there is no RoHS here, yet.

Unleaded solder is a pain, because it melts at a higher temp and you can't tell a cold solder joint from a good one - they all look dull and grainy.

Tin whiskers shouldn't be a problem unless you are putting fine-pitch SMT components in your amps.

Some more RoHS info:

http://www.pb-free.info/laymans_terms.htm

http://www.pb-free.info/rohsexemptions.htm

http://www.spring.gov.sg/Content/Pri...7-be6778ceca64

California RoHS:

http://www.dtsc.ca.gov/HazardousWaste/RoHS.cfm

http://www.rsjtechnical.com/WhatisCaliforniaRoHS.htm

http://www.greensupplyline.com/showA...leID=187201273




Randall Aiken

Randall, thank you! Coming from you, I know this is info I can trust.

I heard on another board that some time ago you had some trouble with the European RoHS. Is that true, and how did it turn out?

Also, to be RoHS certified, do you have to send your product to a lab to be tested? If so, about how much does something like that cost?

Thanks again Randall!

Joe

[raiken]

Randall, thank you! Coming from you, I know this is info I can trust.

I heard on another board that some time ago you had some trouble with the European RoHS. Is that true, and how did it turn out?

Also, to be RoHS certified, do you have to send your product to a lab to be tested? If so, about how much does something like that cost?

Thanks again Randall!

Joe

Don't trust me! Read the regulations for yourself.

I haven't had any trouble with RoHS, I just stopped shipping anything over to EU countries because of the potential for stiff fines (I think it is up to $10,000 per violation, or something like that - it is in the regulations).

There is no RoHS certification (another part of the lunacy), you simply have to keep on file a document from the manufacturer for every part down to the smallest lockwasher and resistor, stating that the part is RoHS-compliant. You must be able to produce this file on demand if you are ever asked for it. If your product is tested and determined to not be compliant, you are liable. There are facilities that can test components for the banned substances, but if you get each manufacturer to send you a compliance sheet for every part in your assembly, you should be okay without getting anything else tested.

All my new stuff will be RoHS-compliant. It is a pain, but you can bet RoHS will be coming to the US very shortly, so you may as well jump on board. I just hope they don't ban vacuum tubes, or we're screwed.

Randall Aiken

[Enzo]

And additionally, if some RoHS compliant piece of gear comes into your US repair shop, you don't need to make RoHS repairs. It only applies to the stuff over there.


So far...

[OverDriven]

I just hope they don't ban vacuum tubes, or we're screwed.

Geeze...you don't think that could happen do you? Are there banned substances in tubes?

[Enzo]

Well, for starters, the wires coming out the glass are soldered into the pins of the base. Would have to convert to lead free solder there.

[Steve Conner]

I ROFL'd at the thread title. Someone actually thinks it's possible to clear up the confusion surrounding the RoHS directive!

[tubeswell]

Well, for starters, the wires coming out the glass are soldered into the pins of the base. Would have to convert to lead free solder there.

But surely being sealed inside the glass'n'all would prevent environmental leakage (if there ever was a concern about it). Surely they can't legislate entire industries and technologies out of existence just like that.

[Steve Conner]

Sure they can. Just ask the companies who made radium water and tetra-ethyl lead.

[Enzo]

These wires are not sealed inside. A 6L6 is made just like a 12AX7 though larger. Plain wire leads come through the glass. Then those wire leads are slipped into the hollow pins of the base and soldered there. Look at one.

I don't know from tin whiskers, but I'd hate to see them growing from pins 2 and 3 towards each other.

[OverDriven]

Since tubes do contain solder as you stated, how are people in Europe able to buy tubes then? I've heard of no problems with tubes over there, which is really strange.

[MWJB]

"Sure they can. Just ask the companies who made radium water and tetra-ethyl lead." Weren't TEL & CFCs all down to the same guy? "Hero to zero" story if theree ever was one....

[jrfrond]

I wrote an article at another forum on this if it helps at all:

http://300guitars.com/index.php/arti...-to-musicians/

[Alex/Tubewonder]

Since tubes do contain solder as you stated, how are people in Europe able to buy tubes then? I've heard of no problems with tubes over there, which is really strange.

No problems here. Environmentally dangerous substances that were used in tubes (and are still present in NOS tubes) have been banned long before anybody even dreamed of RoHS. Substances used today are not on ROHS list.
Soldering to base pins is lead-free. JJ already declares their tubes RoHS compliant. Apparently Shuguang does too since TAD tubes are declared compliant on TAD website.

Just get properly informed and be done with it. And don't believe all and every RoHS horror story you read on the web.
Ah, yes, investing in modern soldering station and learning to use lead-free solder is a good first step.