Why do we have tone controls anyway?

[J M Fahey]

We need to sort some things here which donīt belong together.

1) most important: do not mix *Bass Guitar* with completely different, should I say opposite? "Electric Guitar"
Worlds apart.

2) to put it simply: raw/"pure" Electric Guitar sound is BORING.

Plugging it straight to a Hi Fi amp or PA mixer yields BORING sound.

3) also do not mix Instrument so called "tone" controls which are HORRIBLE and all they do is murder highs and definition to Tone controls present in any amp, except earliest crudest Tweeds or earlier.

And even so, all *guitar* amps ARE equalized, even if "no tone control present".

But ... but ... but ... Champ has NO tone control or EQ of any kind!

Think again.

Schematic shows no tone control, panel has only a volume knob, BUT a Champ is plugged into a Guitar speaker, not a Hi Fi one.

Letīs check what it does to sound:



I see, relative to 400Hz midband:
* 11 dB Boost at 134 Hz
* amazing 16dB Boost at 2 kHz

and that, driven from an SS power amp (what speaker makers use in their anechoic chambers)

IF driven from a poor damping Tube amp, add about 6dB at resonant frequency 127Hz and some 3dB at already boosted 2kHz

That "invisible" EQ is same or more powerful than the purpose built one as shown by G1 graphs.

A HiFi amp has less EQ available than that at Guitar Frequencies, and you need a sophisticated mixer to match it.

EDIT: many thought me crazy when I got into the expensive and messy deal of manufacturing my own speakers, already in the mid 70īs, what no Guitar amp maker does , except a few Peavey BW and Scorpion or Bugera Jensen clones, all others order from Eminence and similar US makers, or UK Celestion or Fane.

But I knew it was literally 50% of the final sound and it was worth it.

[gui_tarzan]

We need to sort some things here which donīt belong together.

1) most important: do not mix *Bass Guitar* with completely different, should I say opposite? "Electric Guitar"
Worlds apart.

How so? Tone on a stringed instrument is tone no matter the style of instrument. One size doesn't fit all and the frequency range is entirely different but aside from that?

2) to put it simply: raw/"pure" Electric Guitar sound is BORING.

Plugging it straight to a Hi Fi amp or PA mixer yields BORING sound.

Boring? Acoustic instrument players might disagree with you on that and I'm sure some jazz/classical players on electric would as well. Your points are taken as well, it's nice to get opinions from so many different views.

[Enzo]

Oh lets not get semantic. Juan said electric guitar pure is boring. Acoustic guitar is a different animal, hence th name acoustic. So I call apples and oranges there.

Aside from freq range? Well bass amps rarely have reverb, they don't generally spend a lot of time on screaming dirt channels. Guys don't generally try to overdrive the output stages in a bass amp. A hifi approach that does not work for guitar, comes a lot closer for bass. Bass and guitar may both have strings, but they are very different instruments. I mean an oboe and a tuba are both wind instruments, but really...


There are a lot of fine bass amps, but I think over the years, something about the effortless flow of sound from the Trace Elliot amps caches my ears. I can make a good case for a 1400 watt bass rig, just to ensure my peaks are not lopped off or squashed. It isn't about being loud. On the other hand, I can't really see the need for a guitar rig over 100 watts, not unless you are trying to play Madison Square Garden without a PA system.

[gui_tarzan]

Oh lets not get semantic. Juan said electric guitar pure is boring. Acoustic guitar is a different animal, hence th name acoustic. So I call apples and oranges there.

I know he said electric but even so, it still holds true for a handful of music types on electric. That's my opinion, you guys have yours. As I said, I like getting all the different feedback and opinions.

I put together a Princeton(ish) type amp over the holidays and that's what I'm experimenting with as far as the tone stack goes. I'm undecided on the preamp design. So far I've tried a couple of simple ones but that is what sparked my original thoughts on this.

[eschertron]

From a historical perspective, we can know that electric basses have been recorded "straight into the board" for decades, on many a major studio release. Extra sweetening? Sure, but the main component of the tone is that minimal setup. We've been listening to that tone so we appreciate it and find it pleasing. Electric guitars? Through amps, where (as mentioned above) the tone is modified - or created! - to produce the pleasing result we come to love. We've been TRAINED to like guitars one way, basses another.

Have people experimented with their signal chain and come up with novel and appealing sounds? Yes. But the narrative provided by guitar and recording magazines (the 'historical record' I alluded to above) are predominantly about the "more" mainstream processing. I'm simply claiming that you - or everybody, if you prefer - like/likes the sound of the bass through the board for no other reason than that's the sound that gets recognized as the archetypal sound.

[aside] I use an active stack on my bass, and almost always employ a low-mid scoop on any amp or input channel I use. Just the way to get the bass sound I want (think/thank Chris Squire for that model). Flat, straight into a board? Sure, if that's what I want (or what the ensemble sound calls for), but generally I desire to sculpt the tone to an extent. [/aside]

[35L6]

What Eddie was doing was boosting output and preserving the resonant peak . I'm sure his amp had tone controls . Regardless of what "pure " is , there is a quality to the sound that pleases you . If you can determine what that quality is you can work on getting it from your bass and amp . Maybe something as simple as a buffer may do it .

[Mick Bailey]

Tony Iommi also has the tone control disconnected for the bridge position. When I watch Jeff Beck or Bill Kirchen play I see they're using the tone control a lot - much more than other guitarists. But when rolled off their tone doesn't get muddy and instinct. I think for them the tone control is a much more dynamic than the set and forget that any guitarists use.

Another plus for a tone control is the way a guitar interacts with a Fuzz Face. It's counter-intuitive - roll off the tone and the notes are crisper and better defined, and the fuzz more intense. So with that pedal at least the guitar is a lot more interactive and better off for having a tone control.

[Familyortiz]

"I could probably answer my own question with the fact that each instrument has its own frequency response, some sound better than others off the rack and tone controls help us compensate for that."

You answered it well. Also, many players like EVH, play pretty much one type of music. You can get away with removing tone controls if your sound isn't stretched too far. I had a CIJ Strat 54 reissue that was era correct with having the bridge pup out of the tone circuit and man, it just wailed in that position, so I could see a combo where one of the pups is not connected.

[stokes]

I've got the 3 way "tone switch" on my Gretsch.One position is a bass cut, one a treble cut and the middle is with the tone caps ground lifted, basically taking the tone shaping circuit out of the mix.I rarely stray from the middle position.I replaced the tone controls on my LP with the same switch.On small amps, I prefer no tone controls ala the Tweed Champ.On my bigger amps I set them and never change the tone controls.

[Chuck H]

The only way to get away with NO tone controls would be to voice the amp as typical for a guitar amp and then make it like the tone controls were set to ten (or 11 if you're Nigel ) Because a flat EQ (as indicated) would be very unflattering to any electric guitar that was overdriven. There IS a difference between "electric guitar" and acoustic guitar or any other instrument that doesn't create it's own signature resonances and overtones. This is what Enzo has been eluding to. Such a guitar amp would only have ONE TONE. (<period). That wouldn't work for any pro players and few amateurs. Because it leaves you with only ONE tone option. With the litany of pedals available and all the tones that can happen with different combinations and/or gain structures there really is no ONE tone. So designers need to make guitar amps that can do it all well enough, or do only one thing perfectly. Not exactly, but sort of like that. Players, the ones that create tones and music, need adjustment options to find what works in a given circumstance or for their own inspiration. Kudos to you for finding what you like. But that doesn't at all mean it's a one size size fits all for everyone. Some players (and designers, me included) want tone controls for their OWN reasons.

[Enzo]

Oh geez, what if I use two different axes? My Strat and my Paul, should I expect them to sound the same? Or should I expect one adjustless amp to be right for both?

I used to talk to guys all the time - younger ones - who were looking for "their tone", and thoroughly expecting to play everything exactly in that "tone".

[The Dude]

Or, what if you play a nice warm sounding bedroom and then go do a gig in a bright sounding gymnasium? Won't the amp require adjustment to get "your sound"? While I don't ever use tone controls on the guitar, I do adjust my amp's tone controls for the room quite often. I also find that humidity has a huge effect on amp sound when doing outdoor gigs.

[Helmholtz]

Even if amp tone settings are never changed, the tone stacks are still in the signal path and essential for the amp's signature sound.
Replacing the control pots with fixed resistors won't change anything.
It also matters where in the signal chain tone filters are placed.

Regarding instrument tone controls, it's easy to make them switchable.