Computer crash problem

[Prairie Dawg]

I've got a problem that maybe some of you guys can help on.

Recently I think the hard drive crashed on my backup box, which i use with a 21 inch color monitor to look at schematics while I'm working on an amp. It's in my shop. It was a 120gb Maxtor that I salvaged out of a dead Tivo box. At the time, it was installed in an IBM Aptiva 2174 with an AMD 833 mhz processor. I did an upgrade from W98SE to Windows XP Home. Subsequently I installed the hard drive in a Dell workstation running a P-4 2.8 mhz processor and everything seemed to work properly, upgrades and all. So I ditched the IBM and lived happily ever after until this past weekend when I started getting a slew of error messages, failures to boot, random shutdowns, and so on, all of which led me to believe that the hard drive was dying. Several attempts to reinstall the operating system failed miserably.

I went out and bought a WD hard drive yesterday-cooking grade 500 gb PATA number-and installed it. After effing around with the jumpers it finally told me "you gotta use the W98SE CD that came with your computer to redo the upgrade you did." Fine. I have that.

So I stick the W98SE disk in the drive and it tells me "Your BIOS won't work with that disk."

As I see it, I have a few options.

I can bite the bullet and purchase a clean copy of XP, which will cost me a bundle of cash.

I can try and find a BIOS that will work with my box long enough for me to install W98SE, upgrade it with the home edition, back out, and reinstall whatever is in there now.

I've got another Dell box that runs the same processor, and it has a legit copy of XP Professional with a good product code. I can install this with the product code from my update and see what happens. I probably won't like the results.

The Dell box that failed me has a label for XP Professional with a product code on it, and it is legit, bought surplus from a local college without a hard drive. I can reinstall my legit copy of XP Professional, use the product code from the label on the box, and see what happens.

I can take the hard drive I think crashed, set it up as a slave on my main squeeze, wipe it clean, and see if the problem with it was a software issue. If I can do that, I can maybe reinstall something-or not.

I can pay money to the local computer hacker shop to see if they can make this thing work and close my eyes to whatever it is they do, knowing that if it dies, I'll probably be back to where I'm at today.

Which of these looks most useful or likely to succeed?

Thanks.

[defaced]

The Dell box that failed me has a label for XP Professional with a product code on it, and it is legit, bought surplus from a local college without a hard drive. I can reinstall my legit copy of XP Professional, use the product code from the label on the box, and see what happens.

Don't say that I told you that this would be your best option.

Before you jump through these hoops, have you verified that the RAM in the machine is good? If not, you're wasting time. Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool

To me, and I've never had a system HDD die on me to take this for what it's worth, is very indicative on what happens when the RAM goes.

[tyru007]

I believe you can do a clean install with a Windows XP Upgrade version as long as you have the Win98 CD. You can wipe the drive and insert the XP upgrade disk. At some point during the install it will ask to insert the win98 disk for verification only. This may solve your issue. Good Luck

[Prairie Dawg]

Don't say that I told you that this would be your best option.

Before you jump through these hoops, have you verified that the RAM in the machine is good? If not, you're wasting time. Memtest86+ - Advanced Memory Diagnostic Tool

To me, and I've never had a system HDD die on me to take this for what it's worth, is very indicative on what happens when the RAM goes.

Go to the head of the class. I pulled out two of the four memory strips, as I recall I put them in last a couple of years ago. Then proceeded to go back to my old hard drive, with my copy of XP professional from my main squeeze, and installed in one seamless burst of happiness. I'm doing the updates and it has not yet asked me for a product code number.

As an update I successfully installed the operating system software on my old hard drive, downloaded Acronis true image and cloned it to my brand new 500gb hard drive, and it never once asked me for a product code. Do you think that was because it's on a network?

[Steve Conner]

XP Professional comes in two flavours: OEM and Corporate.

OEM is the one with the annoying product activation procedure, Corporate has it taken out to allow multiple unattended installs.

OEM can only be activated on one computer, once you've done that the product code is registered with Microsoft and you can't reuse it on any other machines. And changing the hardware too much will un-activate it. But Corporate can be installed on as many computers as you want using the same code, because it doesn't report back to the mothership.

If you have OEM, the code number displayed in Control Panel>System should contain the letters "OEM".

I don't know which of the above flavours "Upgrade" is, or maybe it's a third one.

The product codes from the two (three?) flavours are not supposed to be interchangeable.

If you've been messing with product codes, watch out for the "Windows Genuine Advantage" update, and SP3.

If you're stuck, I've heard ( ) that there are ways of getting rid of the activation thing completely on any copy of XP, but a respectable forum would not be the place to discuss such things.

[Prairie Dawg]

XP Professional comes in two flavours: OEM and Corporate.

OEM is the one with the annoying product activation procedure, Corporate has it taken out to allow multiple unattended installs.

OEM can only be activated on one computer, once you've done that the product code is registered with Microsoft and you can't reuse it on any other machines. And changing the hardware too much will un-activate it. But Corporate can be installed on as many computers as you want using the same code, because it doesn't report back to the mothership.

If you have OEM, the code number displayed in Control Panel>System should contain the letters "OEM".

I don't know which of the above flavours "Upgrade" is, or maybe it's a third one.

The product codes from the two (three?) flavours are not supposed to be interchangeable.

If you've been messing with product codes, watch out for the "Windows Genuine Advantage" update, and SP3.

If you're stuck, I've heard ( ) that there are ways of getting rid of the activation thing completely on any copy of XP, but a respectable forum would not be the place to discuss such things.

I hear you, and I'm not going to spend too much time trying to figure out how to hose Microsoft. This is my backup machine, and I use it with a 21 inch monitor for pulling up schematics on my workbench and displaying the occasional reference photo when I'm stumped.

The interesting thing was, I was ready with the product verification codes-both the one that came with my main computer and the one off the label on the standby box in my hot little hands, and it never asked me for either of them, throughout the verification process and the updates-all of which are now up to speed. It is on line only when this machine is powered up, so that may have something to do with it. It'll be interesting to see what shows up.

I have to tell you, it came at a damned inopportune time when I'm behind in my repair work.

[bob p]

If you've been messing with product codes, watch out for the "Windows Genuine Advantage" update, and SP3.

I started off using XP on a really old box, I think it was a Pentium-MMX 200 MHz. I've migrated to new systems a number of times, and I've always trashed the old box and put the same copy of XP on the new one. That same copy of XP got moved from a P1-200 to a P3-800 to an Athlon-XP 1400 and eventually to a P4-2400. I finally got to the point where "Genuine Advantage" killed my ability to use software that I had paid for a legitimate license to use. Microsoft made it hard for me to use legitimate software for a legitimate purpose, and to me "Genuine Advantage" was a Genuine Reason for moving to Linux.

What's up with SP3? I downloaded a CD image from the Microsoft site and installed it. What a mistake! Now Windows box is slower than molasses. I haven't done anything about it, because I'm primarily a Linux guy now, and I just keep the Win box around for comparability. The speed problem hasn't been a real priority for me, although whenever I'm on the Win box it is a real PITA.

If you're stuck, I've heard ( ) that there are ways of getting rid of the activation thing completely on any copy of XP, but a respectable forum would not be the place to discuss such things.

I'm stuck. And I don't think Ampage won't lose any credibility if you reveal your secrets, Steve.

[Steve A.]

If you're stuck, I've heard ( ) that there are ways of getting rid of the activation thing completely on any copy of XP, but a respectable forum would not be the place to discuss such things.

And your point is...?



Steve

[bob p]

Maybe he was thinking that talking about removing codes from Win XP on a site like this one would be considered as nefarious an activity as forming a syndicate to buy a dumble amp to clone it.

Which kind of makes the point that I was trying to make -- would anyone here would actually be against the idea?

[Steve A.]

OEM can only be activated on one computer, once you've done that the product code is registered with Microsoft and you can't reuse it on any other machines...

Not true- you do put yourself at the mercy of the agent on the phone but if you explain that your old computer died they can reauthorize it for your new computer. "Can", not "will". The last I heard the decision of the phone agent was final, with no recourse or appeal.

Of course if you didn't buy your copy of Win XP you are probably out of luck as the licenses that come with "store bought" computers are specifically for that vendor, and possibly just for a particular model or series of models (there are things that even I do not know).

Getting back to the original question if MS was called and told that the mobo had been replaced I believe that they would reauthorize it.

Steve A.

P.S. to Bob P. WGA is a pain in the butt! My observation was that if I skipped the WGA test my computer would slow down and certain features would not work right until I eventually took the test again.

Funny thing is that when I could not locate my legal copy and was running on a tainted Corporate copy I would get the WGA prompt at least twice a month. I must have passed it two dozen times before I finally flunked.

The failure said something about the authorization codes used were not approved for my region. I called MS and had my authorization switched to this computer/install I am using now and since then I have not got another WGA prompt.

So I think that they thought that there was something fishy about my tainted codes all along.

When you start getting that WGA prompt it is time to start looking for a tainted copy that is newer.

[defaced]

Getting back to the original question if MS was called and told that the mobo had been replaced I believe that they would reauthorize it.

WPA locks into ten different parts of the hardware. If you change too much stuff, you have to reactivate - the mobo is not a master item. If it won't let you reactivate, you have to call MS. My brother has had to do this an it's a painless process. I have had to activate over the phone, and it's fully automated.

Windows Product Activation (WPA)

[bob p]

That's a real a PITA.

What happens to you when Microsoft stops supporting Windows XP? I guess when your PC stops working you can't call anyone.

[Steve A.]

That's a real a PITA.

What happens to you when Microsoft stops supporting Windows XP? I guess when your PC stops working you can't call anyone.

When I was finally able to run SP3 (after trying for over a year!) all of the patches I was getting almost every day kinda disappeared. I still get updates to Windows Defender but I don't get all of the patches that they were issuing for SP2.

[defaced]

That's a real a PITA.

What happens to you when Microsoft stops supporting Windows XP? I guess when your PC stops working you can't call anyone.

5 minutes is not a PITA for me. It's better than getting directed to India. Then again, most evertying on a Windows machine is a PITA (and no, I don't run a Mac or Linux (which is the real PITA of the three)) Though I get where you're coming from and I keep backups of my wpa.dbl file for this reason.

[bob p]

I guess I'm missing how you solve the problem in 5 minutes. Can you explain that?

I was thinking that when MSFT announces that they'll no longer support XP (like they did with 98) then everyone is going to be SOL. If you have to change a motherboard or a network card, then you need to call MSFT to get a new activation code. But MSFT won't be giving any more of them out once they announce that they will no longer be supporting XP. That means that XP is a time bomb that will eventually stop working and there's nothing that anyone can do about it. At least an old version of Win 98 will run forever as long as suitable hardware can be virtualized.