Fender 2009 Strat pickup question

[jrfrond]

As long as I can't make a Pickup with 2 Cream Bobbins, They are not getting any of my Money.
And, that is my business.
Terry

Yeah, Larry DiMarzio made it a point to trademark that idea a long time ago. Can't say I blame him, as he built his empire on the look starting when he was winding pickups for Alex Axe guitars here in NYC. My understanding is that you CAN do double-cremes, as long as you don't sell them that way and hide them underneath a cover. I think Gibson is doing this.

[big_teee]

Yeah, Larry DiMarzio made it a point to trademark that idea a long time ago. Can't say I blame him, as he built his empire on the look starting when he was winding pickups for Alex Axe guitars here in NYC. My understanding is that you CAN do double-cremes, as long as you don't sell them that way and hide them underneath a cover. I think Gibson is doing this.

That's a hell of a deal.
Gibson Invented the Humbucker, then Larry gets a trademark on double cream, and gibson invented the cream bobbin.
So Gibson can't sell a double cream, and they invented the Humbucker, That's BullS**t!!!
See what I mean, He ain't getting any support or any of my bizz.
Call Me Cynical, or whatever.
I think you will find on the Pickup winders site, there is a whole bunch of Cynics Like Me!
B_T

[David Schwab]

Yeah, Larry DiMarzio made it a point to trademark that idea a long time ago. Can't say I blame him, as he built his empire on the look starting when he was winding pickups for Alex Axe guitars here in NYC. My understanding is that you CAN do double-cremes, as long as you don't sell them that way and hide them underneath a cover. I think Gibson is doing this.

I remember those Alex Axe guitars. They had the Dual Sound humbuckers and a phase switch. I played with a guy who had one and it got some cool tones for the time.

You can do dual cream if you don't have 6 poles per coil, as seen with the Carvin dual creams and the Bill Lawrence blade pickups.

Yeah, a lot of people don't remember that when Dimarzio started out they were really the only aftermarket company making pickups like that, and when you saw a guitarist with dual cream bobbins, it was a Super Distortion HB. That was as god as them having a logo on the pickup.

Ironically, now they say the standard color for their pickups is black! So while they hold on the trade mark, it's not their standard trade dress anymore.

[David Schwab]

That's a hell of a deal.
Gibson Invented the Humbucker, then Larry gets a trademark on double cream, and gibson invented the cream bobbin.
So Gibson can't sell a double cream, and they invented the Humbucker, That's BullS**t!!!
See what I mean, He ain't getting any support or any of my bizz.
Call Me Cynical, or whatever.
I think you will find on the Pickup winders site, there is a whole bunch of Cynics Like Me!

Gibson did not invent the humbucker, but they did get a patent on their particular humbucker design.

Also, Gibson never sold humbuckers with the covers off, so what ever color the bobbins where was due to what plastic the molder had on hand, and was inconsequential, since you would never see the bobbins. But by the time Larry started selling pickups, people were taking the covers off because they sounded better. Larry was smart enough to make pickups with no covers, because that's what the players wanted. Gibson was not smart enough to do this until some time later.

The fact that they had some "white" bobbins was not intentional. The fact that some became zebras was probably just because they got so many slug and screw coils in different colors.

Gibson could have trade marked the way the pickup looked, but they didn't.

Now Larry was just smarter than Gibson. You can't fault him for that.

Personally I think double cream bobbins are ugly. I painted my SDHB white!

[big_teee]

Gibson did not invent the humbucker, but they did get a patent on their particular humbucker design.

Also, Gibson never sold humbuckers with the covers off, so what ever color the bobbins where was due to what plastic the molder had on hand, and was inconsequential, since you would never see the bobbins. But by the time Larry started selling pickups, people were taking the covers off because they sounded better. Larry was smart enough to make pickups with no covers, because that's what the players wanted. Gibson was not smart enough to do this until some time later.

The fact that they had some "white" bobbins was not intentional. The fact that some became zebras was probably just because they got so many slug and screw coils in different colors.

Gibson could have trade marked the way the pickup looked, but they didn't.

Now Larry was just smarter than Gibson. You can't fault him for that.

Personally I think double cream bobbins are ugly. I painted my SDHB white!

Like I've Said before DS, Whatever you think, your the boss

[jrfrond]

Like I've Said before DS, Whatever you think, your the boss

Really now, you nor anyone else should get their panties in a wad over Larry's trademark any more than Fender and Gibson trademarking their headstock designs. It was all fair and legit. As Dave pointed out, bobbin color at Gibson was happenstance because they were covered. Guitar builders can't put their name on Fender or Gibson headstocks, and pickup makers can't sell double-cremes with 12 poles. I understand your ire, but it is what it is. Just remember: the aftermarket pickup world was started by Larry DiMarzio. He's your pioneer, like it or not.

Hey Dave, if you liked Alex Axes, you'll love this: The Guitar Lab. I practically grew up on 48th Street and have fond memories. FYI- some of the early ones were built using bodies and necks from Hofner.

[big_teee]

No Anger or animosity here.
I Aired My Two Cents Worth!
The Thread was just covering the same old Ground and that was My way of Bowing Out!
Later,
Piece!
B_T

[Sweetfinger]

Just remember: the aftermarket pickup world was started by Larry DiMarzio. He's your pioneer, like it or not.

They're certainly not pioneers in the field of dealer relations/customer service. I lost a good customer over their D-baggery.

[David Schwab]

Like I've Said before DS, Whatever you think, your the boss

Has nothing to do with what I think. Facts is facts. Look it up.

The only reason you care about their trademark is because you want to make dual cream pickups. I bet you didn't even think about it until you started making pickups, right?

People get hung up on things like Fender's headstock trademark and stuff like that because they want to make copies. But that's why we have trademarks and copyrights.

Just do something original and you wont have to worry about it.

[big_teee]

Has nothing to do with what I think. Facts is facts. Look it up.

The only reason you care about their trademark is because you want to make dual cream pickups. I bet you didn't even think about it until you started making pickups, right?

People get hung up on things like Fender's headstock trademark and stuff like that because they want to make copies. But that's why we have trademarks and copyrights.

Just do something original and you wont have to worry about it.

Whatever you Think!

[David Schwab]

Hey Dave, if you liked Alex Axes, you'll love this: The Guitar Lab. I practically grew up on 48th Street and have fond memories. FYI- some of the early ones were built using bodies and necks from Hofner.

Oh yeah, I have that website bookmarked. They do look like Hofner necks. The early Carvin guitars used their necks as well. I also used to spend a lot of time on 48th street. It was sad to see Manny's go. I also used to love to look at all the stuff in We Buy Guitars. I got my first Ric 4001 and a Peavy bass amp from Gracin's and Towne. Those were the days. Now it's almost all Sam Ash on 48th street.

The guitar my friend had was one of the dual offset cutaways, and it had the cool floral carving on he body. It was a nice guitar.

[David Schwab]

Whatever you Think!

I think you need at act your age. How's that?

[big_teee]

I think it's Neat to bring those trademarks and small Patents up every once in a while then the rest of the folks can see how Petty they are.
And, I do have the right to my Opinion!
At least when you come up with an Idea You have enough sense to cover it with Epoxy.
If someone has a new Revolutionary Product then get a Patent.
But, Just these so called improvement Patents, and color Trademarks, on things they didn't Invent IMO is Silly.
And, like was pointed out their standard color is black!
Now That is My Opinion, and I have the right to it.
You can say or think whatever you like, You won't change my Mind or The Opinion I have the Right too.

Peace,
T

[David Schwab]

But, Just these so called improvement Patents, and color Trademarks, on things they didn't Invent IMO is Silly.
And, like was pointed out their standard color is black!

What's real silly is when someone trademarks a certain color, like H&R Bloc trademarking a green square. But it's legal and they are allowed to get away with it. I also think DiMarzio should not be allowed to continue that trademark since they state that black is their standard color.

But I also have to wonder why people have to use the same two colors for pickups anyway? Why use cream bobbins at all? It's like the old boring beige computers everyone made until Apple decided to make the original iMac. Now look where things are.

People act like there are these rules that no one wants to break.. just keep making them exactly the way Gibson did or you will be excluded from the secret club.