My bias against EMGs

[Possum]

...

As a man who runs his amp on cheese I take high offense at that comment :-) Jack cheese has the best tone, and if you get PEPPER jack you're in tone heaven :-)

I wouldn't be so sure about batteries not affecting tone. Duane Allman used some kind of pedal early on and always insisted on using carbon 9volt batteries that were near dead. I could see there being some kind of sag in that kind of battery maybe, its not too far fetched.

[greenfingers]

Duane Allman used a Fuzz Face with a almost dead battery, there is a difference in tone. I did a test with my Fuzz Face,
Apparently Eric Johnson can hear the differences between Duracell and other brands.

I have to dissagree with Possum though, Jack cheese is just that JACK, What you need is some "Stinking Bishop"

[David Schwab]

Oh yeah, if you run a circuit on lower voltage it will sound different! Look at Van Halen running his Marshall at a lower voltage with a Variac.

But as long as the battery powered circuit has adequate headroom you wont hear a difference between batteries and DC power.

And Jack Cheese is the best for playing Tex-Mex stuff!

[MattT]

you have an analytical-sounding pickup that has no microphonics,

Can we at least put this myth to bed. EMGs are VERY microphonic! Put em in your guitar and tap on the body...thump...thump...louder than many passives!

I've heard more than one person say that EMGs sound the same in every guitar or even a 2x4 because they have no microphonics. Total BS...do these people even listen to them before they make these comments?

This is why I seem to always be defending EMG even though I don't use any of their products. You hear the same BS being said over and over and it's obvious that the person just wants to bash a 'non-vintage-technology' product and they really have no clue.

The cheese used to power your amp is different than the cheese used for pedals. It's called...head cheese.

[David Schwab]

Can we at least put this myth to bed. EMGs are VERY microphonic! Put em in your guitar and tap on the body...thump...thump...louder than many passives!

Yeah, that's what I was saying too. They just don't squeal.

I've heard more than one person say that EMGs sound the same in every guitar or even a 2x4 because they have no microphonics. Total BS...do these people even listen to them before they make these comments?

They do sound pretty much the same, no matter what you put them in.

It's not because they aren't microphonic, but because they have a built in EQ. They certainly have their own sound. My bass used to sound totally different with EMG's. Now with my pickups it sounds like it does unplugged if you put your ear to it. They are passive pickups, but I do have a preamp in the bass.

I stopped using EMG's because I couldn't get them to sound like anything but EMG's, which is what the thread was all about. I wanted smoother highs and bigger lows too.

This is why I seem to always be defending EMG even though I don't use any of their products. You hear the same BS being said over and over and it's obvious that the person just wants to bash a 'non-vintage-technology' product and they really have no clue.

There's a big neovintage/anti-modern thing going on, like the person who said batteries sound like toys, even though just about every "vintage" tone came from something using batteries, be it Clapton's Rangemaster for the "Beano" tone, Jimi's slew of pedals, Billy Gibbons' custom Rockman, and how many Tube Drivers and Rat's are used on a zillion records? That's how they got their tone. How ever your get your tone, that's your tone. People who think it's all guitar to amp are smoking bad cheese! It can be, but usually isn't. And everyone needs to stop trying to copy other people's tones already!

The cheese used to power your amp is different than the cheese used for pedals. It's called...head cheese.

The stuff for pedals is toe jam!

[kevinT]

Can we at least put this myth to bed. EMGs are VERY microphonic! Put em in your guitar and tap on the body...thump...thump...louder than many passives!

When we talk about microphonics in this context we mean microphonic feedback. I have never heard EMGs feedback. Furthermore, if you tap on any pickup, you will get a thump.

I've heard more than one person say that EMGs sound the same in every guitar or even a 2x4 because they have no microphonics. Total BS...do these people even listen to them before they make these comments?

If someone says that is what he hears, who are you to tell him any different. You are no expert from what I can tell. Where do you come off telling folks what they should be hearing? If that is his experience with EMGs that is what he believes to be the case. Apparrently you have a problem with other folks' opinions.

This is why I seem to always be defending EMG even though I don't use any of their products. You hear the same BS being said over and over and it's obvious that the person just wants to bash a 'non-vintage-technology' product and they really have no clue.

I hope you're not referring to me here. No one is bashing anything, at least not me. I've used EMGs since the 80s but haven't used them in years. I recently bought a guitar with them in it and they sound really different to my ears. I like EMGs (not my favorite however) and they are fine in other folks' applications...but not mine anymore.

Again, apparently you have a problem accepting other folks opinions about a certain kind of pickup. I have used EMGs before they became popular. And from what I can tell by your attitude and the obvious chip on your shoulder, probably before you were out of your diapers.

For someone that doesn't use emgs and doesn't have much knowledge of them, I am assuming that you're just having a bad day and are on this forum to vent.

Hope you have a lucky day.

[MattT]

kevin, I said I used them for years...several models. The 81, 85, 60, SA, S...with the SPC/EXG. I've gigged with them quite a bit. And it's not that I have a problem with opinions...it uninformed opinions (what you accused me of). Many of the folks saying they are sterile or sound the same in every guitar are the ones that haven't tried them (or haven't tried them in any 'controlled' way). They just want to start threads that preach to the 'vintage technology' choir. I've compared them with a lot of pickups in the same guitar, same amps, same everything except pickups. It's exactly what you are accusing me of that I'm rallying against.

Now, David says they sound the same to him and I do trust his opinion. It just doesn't agree with my experience. When I put them in a dark guitar...it sounded dark. When I put them in a bright guitar...it sounded bright. It's true that they have their sound...but every pickup that I've ever had does so that's a push. And I don't use them anymore so I must not like them all that much...but that's also true for a boatload of pickups. I actually still have them in an old Kramer Focus Floyd Rose thingamabob that I never play anymore (an 81/SA/S combo from the mid 80s or so).

If you mean the 'good' sustaining feedback...they do that just fine. If you mean the bad microphonic squeal...I never had mine do that.

You said you're not bashing them? You started a thread called 'My bias against EMGs'. So if by 'not bashing' you mean 'thinly-veiled bashing' then I agree.

Sounds like you might be the one having a bad day...hope it gets better.

[David Schwab]

Yeah, I meant they have a certain tone. I'm mostly talking about the bass pickups. And each model has its own tone. When I first built my basses I used EMG-40P5's at the neck, and 40J's at the bridge. They sound pretty much like a P in parallel and a J pickup. I thought the P would sound better in series, and the J needed more low end, but I liked them.

I was less enthralled with the EMG-40DC. I had met Doug Marhoffer back in '95 and told him the DC had a chirpy top end that you couldn't get rid of. He said it wasn't meant for the bridge position, as it was a Music Man clone, so it had a bite engineered into it. But it always sounded brittle. It also lacked low end. I also told him the pickups sounded better with 100K pots, but he said that didn't make sense. I did an A/B test with a number of pot values in a box with a rotary switch. Of course it does make sense since the output impedance of EMG's isn't as low as it should be.

On my basses I got to hear them with EMG's and with various pickups of my own design, and I now feel I have something that sounds truer to the bass than with the EMG's.

I like their guitar pickups better, and since they are made to more or less sound like the pickups they are replacing, they don't sound all that out of place. I used an 85 in my lucite guitar for a while, and when I had a passive pickup I used to use a compressor, but didn't need it with the EMG.

In my Charvel mutt I had an SA and one of these:



It's a nice sounding mini humbucker. I guess it sounds like the 60.

I don't have any EMG's in any of my instruments now, but I do have a BTC preamp in my bass.

[kevinT]

it uninformed opinions (what you accused me of). Many of the folks saying they are sterile or sound the same in every guitar are the ones that haven't tried them (or haven't tried them in any 'controlled' way). They just want to start threads that preach to the 'vintage technology' choir. I've compared them with a lot of pickups in the same guitar, same amps, same everything except pickups. It's exactly what you are accusing me of that I'm rallying against. .

I'm not accusing you of anything and I'm not going to get into a pissing match... but the way that I see it is that you're not defending EMGs, you're defending your specific experience and your opinion of them and your methodology at arriving at your opinion.

The way that you see the world of tone is not how everyone else sees or hears tone...other folks have opinions whether you agree with them or not.

I actually still have them in an old Kramer Focus Floyd Rose thingamabob that I never play anymore (an 81/SA/S combo from the mid 80s or so)..

My EMG has been in this Kramer Pacer since 1985 or 86 and I've used it quite a lot during that era.

You said you're not bashing them? You started a thread called 'My bias against EMGs'. So if by 'not bashing' you mean 'thinly-veiled bashing' then I agree..

Maybe you need to change your definintion of the term "bashing" because I don't think it gels with most folks here. Having an an opinion (which, if you think about it, is generally a bias) and describing what they sound like and expressing this to my colleagures and asking for their opinion, I don't think would be considered bashing a product.

As I said before, to me, EMGs sound sterile. That is the way that my ears hear them. They are not as dynamic as passive pickups. That is my opinion of them at this point. Whether or not you agree is your business.

Sounds like you might be the one having a bad day...hope it gets better.

Actually, it couldn't be better.