P90 and A8?

[orangedrop]

I know a lot of people love the sound of P90:ies. I too like the sound of a P90 in the neck position but the P90 sucks in the bridge position. They are thin and needs a lot of pre gain pedals to distort like a HB. I tried many different brands of P90:ies, like Lollar, SD, Lundgren and of course Gibson, but to me no one is great in the bridge position.
Actually I do like the original Gibson P90 a lot.

So, I thought I should try Alnico 8 to get more power … Problem is it needs to be two A8’s?
Have any of you gentlemen tried this? Could it be that it’s OK with just one A8? Or, if anyone has tried 2 x A8 – what about string pull?
And how did it sound?

Bjorn

[madialex]

I dont think 2 A8's would be good, too much string pull and probably a lot more harsh in the top end. Have you tried moving it as close to the strings as you can without having the strings buzz at the last fret? P90's operate better and sound much better when set up this way, of course adjust the neck to sound right with the bridge output. I like an A2 and A3 mix myself, or an A4 and A5 mix may be good..

You didn't like the Lollars?? Man, Jason makes some of the best P90's around.
Lindy Fralin's P90's have a distinctive bite with a good bottom end as well, A lot of people love his P90's.

[orangedrop]

You didn't like the Lollars?? Man, Jason makes some of the best P90's around.

Just to be very clear, Lollar seems to be a great guy I do like his work a lot, the few times I’ve had business with him he’s been very professional. I would recommend him to anyone.

My problem is I don’t seem to like any P90 in the bridge position. It’s no meat, too thin, doesn’t happen.
I did adjust the bridge PU near the strings as you described (with the screws all the way down), (the neck is way down with the screws up a bit). That gave a bit more power and a bit less high treble. (I also have a 250K vol and tone pot for the bridge PU). Maybe a mix of AL8 and AL2 would be nice? I agree that two AL8 may be a bit risky concerning string pull and High end.
I’ll give it a try and will get back.

No one tried AL8 in a P90?

Bjorn

[David King]

It is my understanding that A8 magnets are weaker than A5. They are stronger than A2. Am I not reading the charts correctly?

[kevinT]

It is my understanding that A8 magnets are weaker than A5. They are stronger than A2. Am I not reading the charts correctly?

nope. A8 is the strongest out of all available Alnico bar mags. Even surpassing ceramics. I did some gauss readings a while ago and posted my results. I'll do a search for the thread.

here's a thread i started a while ago about different gauss levels.

http://music-electronics-forum.com/s...t=gauss+levels

[Possum]

...

This is kinda going in the wrong direction, if you want a powerful bridge pickup it should be wound that way to begin with. I used to wind my bridge pickups at 9.25K now I wind them at 10.5K and use alnico 5 and players really like that. I also use alnico 3 in the lower wind ones for a real vintage kind of tone. I think Gibson's P90s are mostly around 8k like the original ones usually were; alot of vintage P90s were both the same value for bridge and neck, modern players can't deal with that :-)

[David King]

Kevin thanks for that. That's what I had thought originally but then I got ambiguated on the subject.

[madialex]

I wound one last week to around 11K using 43, with A3 and A5, sounds really nice, still has good high end, somewhat smoother than if I had used 42 and the bottom end is big but not boomy and has a good mid push. With a Pedal I can get some good Rock tones and even get into some Metal territory..

[orangedrop]

I think Gibson's P90s are mostly around 8k like the original ones usually were; alot of vintage P90s were both the same value for bridge and neck, modern players can't deal with that :-)

Right, actually the neck is 8,3 K and the bridge 8,1. It would be interesting to try a 10 K P90 in the bridge position. Maybe I'll come back on that one

Still, I do have some All Star Magn. A 8 and I'll try them and get back.

BTW did you get my mail?


Bjorn

[Possum]

...

Yes got your email, we're getting closer, I have a big old dealer order thats in the way and a couple older orders, slow going but getting there. I've about finalized my Vintage Lab set, I'll let you know when I post an update on YouTube, I think I finally nailed what I've been after for a long time. I'll be glad when its over, I spend alot of time on research and experiments but it does pay off....

I've done alot of P90s and pretty much everyone has liked them better than Gibson's. You might just try unwinding your neck pickup, that would balance the set....

[orangedrop]

I've done alot of P90s and pretty much everyone has liked them better than Gibson's. You might just try unwinding your neck pickup, that would balance the set....

I do think Gibson P90 Sounds good. I thought about unwinding the neck PU but that's a bit going the wrong direction - I want more from the bridge not less from the neck PU. That said I might try it anyway.

Bjorn

[David Schwab]

This is kinda going in the wrong direction, if you want a powerful bridge pickup it should be wound that way to begin with.

I was about to say that. A stronger magnet might just make it brighter. But that allows for extra windings to get a fuller tone.

I used to wind my bridge pickups at 9.25K now I wind them at 10.5K and use alnico 5 and players really like that. I also use alnico 3 in the lower wind ones for a real vintage kind of tone. I think Gibson's P90s are mostly around 8k like the original ones usually were; alot of vintage P90s were both the same value for bridge and neck, modern players can't deal with that :-)

I had a set from a 70's SG that were both wound around 9K. Then I had a 60's ES-330TD with the chrome dogears, and they were around 8K.

I unwound one of the SG pickups to 8K and it sounded really nice in the neck position. I paired that up with a patent label humbucker at the bridge in a Sekova LP Custom copy I used to have.

As far as a stock P-90 at the bridge... worked well for Leslie West!

[orangedrop]

As far as a stock P-90 at the bridge... worked well for Leslie West!

Yeah, I know. But, needless to say - I'm not him. (Currently he's into HB's I think).
I like the thought that a brighter magnet allows more turns -> fuller tone, that's needs to be tested ...

Some P90 tone I've heard is very near a good PAF sound, But I can't seem to nail that tone myself. I tried the BFG thing but it doesn't look right

Bjorn

[Possum]

....

Leslie seems to be turning into a product "endorser." I'm starting to see ads with him endorsing a bunch of junky stuff. Yeah, he's like into metal tone these days, endorses Dean guitars, plays dropped tuning alot, his signature guitar is the only guitar they make that has any class IMHO. Still, he's a freaking great talent; one of my last design jobs before I quit that career was Mountain's Masters of War album, really a great piece of work. He was fun to deal with, nice guy.

I read somewhere that he likes his P90's set low below the strings, probably because he plays so loud it lessens feedback problems I bet.

P90s have alot in common with PAFs, same keeper, same amount of winds, same pole screws. I've heard some old blues records where you can't tell if it was P90s or PAFs being played, listen to Freddie King, he played both and got similar tone.

[David Schwab]

I got to see Freddie King live once, opening for Grand Funk... probably about 1973, a few years before he died. He was great.