Wire coating - Poly vs Plain Enamel - any difference

[Mike McCardle]

As far as wire coating is concerned is there really any difference between poly and plain enamel coating that you can actually hear?

I think the only difference is the thickness of the coating, not the coating material itself right? And, if so, is the wire that Stumac sells as good as anything else?

If this has been asked before please point me to a string to search on.

Thanks!

[Spence]

It's not just about the thickness of the coating. I have used Plain, Poly and Formvar with varying thicknesses of coating. Plain Enamel and Poly with the same thickness of coating still don't sound the same as heavy Formvar. There must be something in the coating on a molecular level that contributes to this difference.

[Mike McCardle]

It's not just about the thickness of the coating. I have used Plain, Poly and Formvar with varying thicknesses of coating. Plain Enamel and Poly with the same thickness of coating still don't sound the same as heavy Formvar. There must be something in the coating on a molecular level that contributes to this difference.

Are all 3 kinds of wire currently being manufactured?

[corduroyew]

yeah, heavy formvar is what the vintage fender pickups used. I'm told that formvar isn't a durable as the others but if you are chasing the vintage sound of a fender strat then that is what you use.

[soundmasterg]

From what I hear, good Plain Enamel is getting hard to find.

[Mike McCardle]

From what I hear, good Plain Enamel is getting hard to find.

Ahhh yes, that's really why I ask if poly/SPN is 'as good, as' enamel - wrt sound - without subscribing to any kind of 'vintage-spec' hype.

What I did with components and amps/effects is that I just went out and bought Mullard... tubes, and very hard to find caps, etc and found that there is very little 'mojo' specific to vintage components that one could not simply engineer around and completely replicate with common components.

I'm wondering if this is the case with pickups and wire, though I think there is much more of a case for Single Coils than for Humbuckers.

If you've wound both, I would love to get your impressions...

[NightWinder]

Poly/solderon.Spn,,,these coatings have a "wet", compressed character. Plain Enamel sounds much "dryer", which is also called "organic" and "raw". Plain enamel has much better gain and harmonic structures too. Proof is in the pudding when comparing 2 pickups with different wires. Plain eneamel wins every time, Unless you are looking for certain tones from spn,etc. Hybrids are also nice( using 43 spn on the slug, and P.E on the screws), capturing the best of both. Get clear, or natural spn, the solderon seems to have a high mid spike thang going on, and the lowend seems boomy

[Spence]

Formvar is still readily available. If enough of us make enquiries, Shelhav may well supply direct. They are in Israel but normally will only supply your magnet wire dealer:

http://www.shelhav.co.il

Plain Enamel of good quality is still being made every day. No supply issues at all.

http://www.scientificwire.com

Providing Formvar is not old stock that's been hanging around, it's very reliable. Strat pickups made with formvar sound astonishingly good. plain Enamel clad Strat pickups just sound quite different.

[corduroyew]

spence, I'd team up with you for a large order of formvar. Do you know what there minimum order is?

[Spence]

I don't think it's much actually. Something like 6 or so 6lb spools and I know of at least one other guy in the UK who would go in on the deal if Shelhav were to cooperate.

[corduroyew]

I just contacted shelhav.co.il and they said they don't do formvar but if you call in the order then scientific does have formvar. If you order 1 kg then it's 23.80 plus vat. If you get 5 or more kg then it's 12.90 per kg plus vat. Not bad at all.

[Spence]

You see, that's not true. Check their website. they do make it but as I said, will only supply you through someone like Scientific. However, the people at Scientific are arrogant asswipes and will tell you that they don't stock it and will not buy it in just for you. speak to Ray ( who is OK when he knows you, otherwise he's right up his own ass ) because he knows what Formvar is. the tea boys would sell you jewellry wire in lilac if they could.