butyrate color (pigment)

[belwar]

No I wouldnt want to do that. I'm friends with a few people there and I wouldnt want to take advantage of my friendship with them. Instead i go to all the work of making my own mold (with a partner) and spend thousands of dollars. me = smart.

Really I should just use their products on my guitars, since I am like 20 miles from them and they're great pickups, but i really like punishing myself.

bel.

[LtKojak]

No I wouldnt want to do that. I'm friends with a few people there and I wouldnt want to take advantage of my friendship with them. Instead i go to all the work of making my own mold (with a partner) and spend thousands of dollars. me = smart.

Really I should just use their products on my guitars, since I am like 20 miles from them and they're great pickups, but i really like punishing myself.

bel.

I don't think buying the bobbins from them would mean "taking advantage of" anything. I remember Evan saying that they've made enough butyrate bobbins for three lifetimes, as they're used only in their Antiquities series and those are surely NOT the bulk of their sales.

C'mon, Bel... is just a phone call... nobody's going to die or anything.

Inquiring minds would like to know!

[belwar]

They have been very gracious to me helping me with finding several suppliers. I have nothing of value to offer in return, except free guitars. I would just personally feel like I was taking advantage and I dont want to go down that road. I'm a douche, but not a Douche-bag.

[JGundry]

I don't think buying the bobbins from them would mean "taking advantage of" anything. I remember Evan saying that they've made enough butyrate bobbins for three lifetimes, as they're used only in their Antiquities series and those are surely NOT the bulk of their sales.

C'mon, Bel... is just a phone call... nobody's going to die or anything.

Inquiring minds would like to know!

I'm pretty sure Bel and his bobbin partner would like bobbins that are more vintage accurate than Seymour Duncan bobbins anyway.

[belwar]

i'm pretty sure bel and his bobbin partner would like bobbins that are more vintage accurate than seymour duncan bobbins anyway.

oh snap

[clown_luthier]

hey guys can anyone tell me a little about plasticizer
so this is my 3rd componenet in bobbin?

1. butyrate
2. dye
3. plasticizer
4. anything else

what type? plasticizer also must be organic base? where to buy it?

[belwar]

When you buy butyrate pellets, the plastisizer is already in it.

There are about 200 different butyrates listed, but only 3-4 that are commercially readily available since few use it anymore. If you want one of the the other 196 types then you'll need to order 10 tons worth. At 5 grams a bobbin you are looking at 2,000,000 bobbins.

The advise given to me (maybe that sam lee guy?) was take the least amount of plastisizer available.

[clown_luthier]

When you buy butyrate pellets, the plastisizer is already in it.

Thanx belwar, you guys are great
do you have any pics of your bobbins? pics of prototype?

[LtKojak]

There are about 200 different butyrates listed, but only 3-4 that are commercially readily available since few use it anymore. If you want one of the the other 196 types then you'll need to order 10 tons worth. At 5 grams a bobbin you are looking at 2,000,000 bobbins.

This is EXACTLY what Evan said! Looks like Seymour did go through with the 10 tons order after all.

Still no phone call...?

J/K

[belwar]

This is EXACTLY what Evan said! Looks like Seymour did go through with the 10 tons order after all.

Still no phone call...?

J/K

Personally when alayzing what other people do (particularly gibson), I try to keep occams razor in the forefront of my pee brain. However, when you are talking about people who are making PAF replicas occams goes right out the window. I thought I read an SD interview somewhere that said the Mr. Lover (coolest name ever) gave Seymour his notes with the original butyrate formula.

That being said, gibson would have just used what was cheap and available. That formula would likely be a eastman part number from the 1950's, probably listing plastizer content. Now maybe that formula mentioned includes coloring information.

[David Schwab]

That being said, gibson would have just used what was cheap and available. That formula would likely be a eastman part number from the 1950's, probably listing plastizer content. Now maybe that formula mentioned includes coloring information.

Exactly! They didn't pick that plastic because of some mythical tonal attributes, and they didn't even agonize over a cream color, since the bobbins were never meant to be seen. They ended up with off white bobbins instead of black probably because the supplier either had a lot of that color handy or ran out of black, or it was cheaper. What color is that plastic with no die anyway?

Everyone... stop the madness! Stop worrying about what Gibson did 50 years ago and do something better!

[Possum]

...

I really don't think Duncan would sell their proprietary parts to other pickup makers, and yes their butyrate bobbin aren't accurate.

I'm not sure how important using butyrate is anyway, they physical resonance of a CAB bobbin is slightly darker than black ABS or whatever is being used now. From my own messing around with dielectric effects its very very doubtful there is any of that going on that would make any noticeable difference. It takes quite a big "push" in dielectric effect to even be heard. From my perspective, what happens in the coil is more important than the type of plastic. Granted you can at least claim they are PAF correct if you get the dimensions right, but then again, that stuff shrinks over time and shrinks right out of the mold so there are even noticeable differences in authentic examples, plus Gibson made several changes along the way as well...

[Sam Lee Guy]

where to buy pigment for CAB like on this beautiful OTPG bobbins?



thanx guys

Photos velly deceptive with colour. Sam no want bobbins with colour of these photos, look green like lime or cully!

Real OTP bobbins pale beige then yellowed with secret ageing forumura!

[the great waldo]

Photos velly deceptive with colour. Sam no want bobbins with colour of these photos, look green like lime or cully!

Real OTP bobbins pale beige then yellowed with secret ageing forumura!

ELLO SAM

Methinks you need to set up your monitor or take of the raybans !

Cheers

Andrew

[David Schwab]

ELLO SAM

Methinks you need to set up your monitor or take of the raybans !

Cheers

Andrew

PC monitors often have a blueish cast.

They look like cream to me. (calibrated monitor)