OTPG -what is that?

[MacLoud]

Hi Chaps

Typical winders of PAF replicas advertise their products as "the most accurate PAF replica available" or "possibly the best all round PAF replica available" This may imply no difference in appearance from the original to the untrained eye.

So imaginary situation here, let us surmise that a pair of "PAFs" have been installed in a guitar that is not an expensive custom built "LP Standard" replica but just an average LP R9 of modern manufacture. So there is still a significant price differential but not the enormous price of a real 59 at hundreds of thousands, just $8K instead of $5K. This is a big profit on a pair of $400 pickups.

The instrument is advertised as having "REAL PAFs" and is therefore advertised at a premium price, much more that a normal R9 but because it is not claiming to be a real '59 does not alert the Les Paul Police on other forums.

There are now several pickup manufacturers making PAF replicas, so how does the average Joe Punter find out what is real and what is not.

It may be economically viable to employ an expert when the whole guitar needs to be validated but to employ the services of an expert for the authentication of a pair of pickups is not on.

There may be indentifying marks built into the manufacturing but no-one apart from the builder is privy to what they are. So, that is not helpful to the average Joe. Can we call you up and ask what marks you put on your pickups.
Many pickup builders do not even have telephone numbers on their sites, let alone Mr OTPG who is unreachable unless you know certain people.

It is very easy for the members of this forum to say "do your research" "caveat emptor" "look at all the vintage examples you can" and many other mollifying, soothing phrases but the average consumer will never have the advantage of the experience that the chaps here have got and will never be totally certain what they are buying.

Any answers?

Regards

MacLoud

[Sam Lee Guy]

Hi Chaps

the average consumer will never have the advantage of the experience that the chaps here have got and will never be totally certain what they are buying.

Any answers?

Regards

MacLoud

Yes! If you don't know for sure what you are buying, don't buy it!

[Spence]

Anyone want to buy a Rolex?

[Rick Turner]

Mr OTPG doesn't even seem to be one person, therefore "he" is by definition a company or a partnership or one person who subcontracts out a bunch of the work and then hides behind an alias and some folks who seem to want to flog "his" products as being "the best" fake PAF...and flogs it here where there are a number of really good winders who make sonic replicas of PAFs. Isn't that an insult?

I don't claim to make the best anything; I just make what I make, wind what I wind, sell what I can, and then go off in another direction...like making acoustic guitars. And then I come back to pickups and decide to do stuff like winding some of my horseshoe pickups with Teflon insulated wire...liking very much the results. I've learned a lot from the past, but I'm trying to move forward...

I've had a really wonderful time reinventing the 1943 Gibson J-45...the Buddy Holly guitar. Check out the project: Buddy Holly Guitar Foundation

And, no, they're not forgeries; I'm making certain improvements along the way, but I am using Adirondack spruce and hot hide glue...and carbon fibre and a two way truss rod.

And that's and analog of the kind of improvement I think we can all make to classic pickups where we can. Use better grade plastic and metals...as long as they're consistent with tone; use better lead-out wire; go to stainless steel screws instead of rust prone steel; learn what wind you like, and then be able to duplicate it.

And learn where the tone really comes from...and it's not eye candy details.

[David Schwab]

Of course you have to dress the part. I'm currently wearing my Mick Ronson outfit and striding around the kitchen singing into a replica EV 664 variable D microphone while the wife does the cooking and chores dressed as Marylyn Monroe in a replica outfit.
Later on we're gonna go cruising in my AC Cobra replica....you know, the one made entirely from Chey Metro parts. Looks the dogs bollocks!

OK, I'm a big Ronson fan. So that's acceptable.

Was it this outfit?



Spence, you're OK for a sheep shagger.

[Sam Lee Guy]

Mr OTPG doesn't even seem to be one person, therefore "he" is by definition a company or a partnership or one person who subcontracts out a bunch of the work and then hides behind an alias and some folks who seem to want to flog "his" products as being "the best" fake PAF...and flogs it here where there are a number of really good winders who make sonic replicas of PAFs. Isn't that an insult?



And learn where the tone really comes from...and it's not eye candy details.

All the posts I read show he is trying not to flog anything here or anywhere else. On his behalf, I reccommended buying from Spence, or Throbak, Possum, or any other winder wanting to sell. Where do you get the idea of trying to sell anything here? Again with the unfounded accusations.
He is really not deserving of your animosity.
Making a "sonic replica" of a PAF from off the shelf Korean or Chinese parts is fine but tone is subjective. Getting details correct as well is measureable and why so many shy away from this challenge. Only OTPG, Throbak, Shed, Holmes, Bareknuckle make every part. Your post suggests that if a maker attempts to copy the details of appearance, then somehow they have no knowledge of tone, but for all these makers, vintage appearance is just a bonus.

You, Mr Turner cannot see past your own nose and imagine a man who does not want to sell his product but it is good enough that he is harassed to provide it. And his customers don't have to look in the mirror pretending to be Jimmy Page although maybe some rock stars like to pretend to be others. Maybe Jimmy likes to look in the mirror and prentend to be Henrix? Who knows? Mr. Turner, you seem to believe that you are the only one with any understanding of tone. To come here and behave like that, now that is an insult.

[Sam Lee Guy]

And, no, they're not forgeries; I'm making certain improvements along the way, but I am using Adirondack spruce and hot hide glue...and carbon fibre and a two way truss rod.

And that's and analog of the kind of improvement I think we can all make to classic pickups where we can. Use better grade plastic and metals...as long as they're consistent with tone; use better lead-out wire; go to stainless steel screws instead of rust prone steel; learn what wind you like, and then be able to duplicate it.

And learn where the tone really comes from...and it's not eye candy details.

Oh, and by the way, with your great knowledge of tone, make as many PAF style pickups as you like with stainless poles instead of "rust prone steel" and hear what an improvement in tone you get, bearing in mind that stainless is also non-magnetic. Since there are no other "rust prone steel" screws in a PAF design, you can't have been suggesting anything else.

[David Schwab]

Rather than having everyone arguing about something that really doesn't involve this forum directly, I'm closing this thread.

I'd rather we talk about making pickups than speculate about people who make them.