Tele bridge base plates... why?

[mondo]

Now this may be bullshit but I heard from somewhere that Leo Fender used to test his lapsteel pickups on a test-jig. This particular test jig was sometimes borrowed by local california country players to record and gig with. They liked playing on the jig so much that Leo was inspired to make a production line guitar based on it called the Broadcaster. I don't know if this is true but why would someone make this stuff up? Sounds plausible to me. I also think it's pretty amazing at how the Tele holds it's own as an exceptional electric guitar while also having a primitive design. Leo Fender nailed it pretty well with his first shot.

[big_teee]

Now this may be bullshit but I heard from somewhere that Leo Fender used to test his lapsteel pickups on a test-jig. This particular test jig was sometimes borrowed by local california country players to record and gig with. They liked playing on the jig so much that Leo was inspired to make a production line guitar based on it called the Broadcaster. I don't know if this is true but why would someone make this stuff up? Sounds plausible to me. I also think it's pretty amazing at how the Tele holds it's own as an exceptional electric guitar while also having a primitive design. Leo Fender nailed it pretty well with his first shot.

Then Leo was sued for using the broadcaster name, thus it was un-named and called the NoCaster.
T

[Bruce Johnson]

To a large extent, it's the other way around. Leo created guitars that 1.) were relatively inexpensive, 2.) were capable of creating all kinds of weird new sounds at very high volume, and 3.) were really well suited for the showmanship of dancing around on stage. From there, the music exploded and evolved around what Fender guitars could do. Leo didn't spend years of R & D trying to fine tune the exact tone that Jimi Hendrix wanted. No, Jimi spent years exploring what could be done with Leo's crazy new instrument. And the music became Gospel. And now we go crazy trying to figure out how to precisely build a Fender that makes us sound like Jimi when we play his songs.

[Peter Naglitsch]

I have to differ a bit with the general opinion about the purpose of the steel base plate. Have everyone forgot the original "ash tray" cover that the Teles came with?

Those were there purely for shielding. If you take that into account the most likely reason for the base plate is also shielding. picture the complete assembly and the shielding reason just seems ...plausible.

[David Schwab]

probably as simple as screws wouldnt stay threaded in forbon, but will in steel.

So then he would have done that on the Tele neck pickup and on Strats.

It was probably for shielding purposes, which is the same reason the pickup is mounted on the bridge and the bridge had a cover. The neck pickup also has a cover.

This was one of Leo's first pickups, and you can see that later on he did things differently.

[Mike Sulzer]

Have everyone forgot the original "ash tray" cover that the Teles came with?

Those were there purely for shielding. If you take that into account the most likely reason for the base plate is also shielding. picture the complete assembly and the shielding reason just seems ...plausible.

I have always thought that the ash tray was for appearance. The ugly base plate with the strings over the pickup seem to be all the shielding necessary or effective.

[Alex R]

The fact that there wasn't much in the way of previous designs to go on when he sat down to design the Tele must be behind the strangeness of the Tele bridge pan.

If I was thinking without precedents to go on of a way of securing strings under high tension flat-pulling parallel to a flat solid wooden surface, I might go for something that went a good way back under the strings, to produce some security against the tendency for any kind of bridge to be levered towards the neck. I mean, secure the bridge pan firmly under or nearby the bridge itself, and a couple of inches of steel extending under the strings getting levered against the body looks like a good way of keeping the bridge at right angles to the body. Making it into a box shape helps stop the back part being pulled forward by the strings.

Those single-coil pickups pick up a lot of noise and he wasn't in a position to know that actually most of his customers wouldn't mind this too much, so the ashtray cover is an insurance against those issues arising and damaging rep and sales. Another product of the fact that the solid electric guitar was a new product.

The whole thing combines three functions - string retainer, bridge, and pickup shield. Remember the first design only had that one pickup.

[FunkyKikuchiyo]

I have always thought that the ash tray was for appearance. The ugly base plate with the strings over the pickup seem to be all the shielding necessary or effective.

I was under the impression that the aesthetic of the day was that pickup pole pieces and various pieces of hardware were extremely ugly and should be covered up whenever possible. Today we don't think much about what a three saddle or six saddle bridge looks like, but apparently they thought it was pretty nasty... like leaving wiring exposed or something. I don't buy that it was for shielding, because the covers over the bass pickups weren't grounded... at least, not that I've never seen. Perhaps the ones I've worked on have been modified.

[mondo]

Then Leo was sued for using the broadcaster name, thus it was un-named and called the NoCaster.
T

A bit off topic but is it true that the Broadcasters and NoCasters were built without truss rods? It's another myth I've heard but since I don't have a Broadcaster to play with I am unable to confirm or debunk it.

[belwar]

A bit off topic but is it true that the Broadcasters and NoCasters were built without truss rods? It's another myth I've heard but since I don't have a Broadcaster to play with I am unable to confirm or debunk it.

The very first broadcasters did not in fact have a truss rod - Though it became aparent very quickly that one was needed. Most likely via warranty claims. Nacho claims that most necks were replaced, or truss rods were added to existing necks. There are only a handful of trussrod-less broadcasters around today.

[David Schwab]

The fact that there wasn't much in the way of previous designs to go on when he sat down to design the Tele must be behind the strangeness of the Tele bridge pan.

Before Leo made the Tele, he made lap steel guitars. He used the same pickup design for the Tele as some of the lap steels that predated it. The whole bridge/cover makes more sense when viewed from a steel guitar angle, since their bridges were often covered.

a 1945 K&F "Student" Model Lap Steel. (not the same pickup)

[ken]

Originally Posted by mondo
A bit off topic but is it true that the Broadcasters and NoCasters were built without truss rods? It's another myth I've heard but since I don't have a Broadcaster to play with I am unable to confirm or debunk it.

I saw a photo awhile back of a Fender employee standing on a Broadcaster's neck that was suspended between two chairs, demonstrating the strength of the nontrussrod Fender neck. Of course, having a strong neck isn't any good if your guitar's action stinks and you can't adjust it out.

If you think of industrial 'art' back then, everything was as streamlined and covered up as possible. Even new steam locomotives were covered up so not much of their works showed. I do think the ashtray was an attempt to cover up the Tele's bridge assembly simply for looks, but players soon found out the ashtray made palm muting impossible.

I had a '72 sunburst Tele with an ashtray about 15 years ago, but it actually didn't do much from a shielding point of view.

David, tasty steel you've got there. Does it still play?

ken

[big_teee]

If you think of industrial 'art' back then, everything was as streamlined and covered up as possible. Even new steam locomotives were covered up so not much of their works showed. I do think the ashtray was an attempt to cover up the Tele's bridge assembly simply for looks, but players soon found out the ashtray made palm muting impossible.
I had a '72 sunburst Tele with an ashtray about 15 years ago, but it actually didn't do much from a shielding point of view.

ken

I really think the ash tray cover was mainly for cosmetics.
Same for the P and J bass.
They put the fancy ash tray covers over the pickups, Most bass players ripped them off as soon as they got them.
I think the P/U covers on the basses did little to help shielding.
They did put a brass plate under the early P-basses and it was a grounding and shielding arrangement.
I really don't think the P-bass baseplate did much except it made a nice ground point.
Terry

[David Schwab]

I also think the covers were cosmetic, since the bridges were not made to look nice. The covers for the basses were also palm rests for when you played with a pick. But my point was that using the early lap steels as a model, this is what electric guitars looked like, so Leo followed suit. Obviously the bridge cover on the Strat was purely cosmetic. But if you look at some early electric guitars they had a metal pickguard with all the electronic parts mounted on it. That was kind of standard practice for early electrics. I have read that they thought it was needed.

Ken, I don't own that guitar, I just found a photo on-line for reference. I did once own an old Harmony lap steel. I sold it to a guy back in the 70s who steel owns it.

[nickc35]

Found this thread in a search I did today. I know it's been a year and a half since the last post but I wanted to add something. I think another possibile purpose for the ashtray cover was sheilding but NOT electronic shielding. I think it was to cover the bridge pickup and shield it from the vibrations of the sound waves coming from the amp speakers. This would help to stop a squealing pickup and since the Tele bridge pickups are known for being squealers, it stands to reason the cover was to shield it to prevent microphonice feedback....or at least raise the threshold of volume with which the pickup could preform without feedback. Just a thought.