Are keeper bars 1018 or 1022?

[kevinT]

What alloy are carbon steel keeper bars made from and/or what should they be since they're supporting the polepiece screws. Should they be the same steel as the screws?

[Joe Gwinn]

What alloy are carbon steel keeper bars made from and/or what should they be since they're supporting the polepiece screws.

Both alloys will have been used; they are interchangeable.

Should they be the same steel as the screws?

Not necessarily.

[NightWinder]

Kevin, this comes down to preference, and the type of sound you are after. I use both, in different models. 1022 has something wierd.....I made 2 pickups identical as could be handfeeding, and when I swaped them, the other pickup took on its characteristics, which when recorded, there was something that the sound enginer couldn't manipulate to his ears, but the 1018 bar p>u had better qualitys and was very workable to achieve the sounds and more friendly with the enginer that the 1022 bar. Yes, we also did use just one pickup and swaped also.
Reminds me, get a few keepers from GJ. Now, you will be able to hear a shhhhh, or a szhhan in the high end for sure, and its a real hassel to get rid of in the studio. Its not the offset either, which is a few hundred turns or so. Best to use the same pickup. Personally, 1018 is better in the studio, 1022 is sweet and mean in the room, and GJ is just walking a fine line trying to get rid of the annoying highs, and a nasty shhhhhit. Has its uses, mostly in higher omhs, 22k, 24k, and thats where it can help bring the highs through without the shuuuuuuuuu.
If you want to anilate everything around......1022. Its meaner in the mids with great seperation. Its kinda like taping......when you are recording, you really would'nt use nearly the same amout of gain as you would live.
Good Question...........

[Possum]

Need a source....

I'm real tired of the shit keepers available out there and want to make my own, is it possible to order 1022 and 1018 steel rectangular rod cut to the width and height specs I need, then I just whack the stuff off to size when I need it? I don't have a way to cut 1/8" stock down to width, band sawing is too slow and inaccurate.....

[Joe Gwinn]

I'm real tired of the shit keepers available out there and want to make my own, is it possible to order 1022 and 1018 steel rectangular rod cut to the width and height specs I need, then I just whack the stuff off to size when I need it? I don't have a way to cut 1/8" stock down to width, band sawing is too slow and inaccurate.....

Cold rolled steel rectangles will work just fine. This is standard stuff, and widely available.

For instance http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PMAKA=82059122.

Or item 9143K146 at http://www.mcmaster.com/.

McMaster-Carr has a much wider selection of shapes and sizes than MSC. Both are well-respected industrial suppliers.

[kevinT]

can you tell by color?

I noticed that some keeper bars are darker in color and some are more silver. For example, GJs are really silver in color. Does this mean that there is less carbon? Whereas, SM's and TR's are darker (dark grey). Would that mean there is more carbon?

[NightWinder]

the GJ are plated.

[kevinT]

hmmmm,

i would of never thought of going through the extra expense of plating the keeper bar when it is a component that is never seen.

[David Schwab]

It's probably zinc plating. I buy plain steel bars for making blade pole pieces, and sometimes they are zinc plated, which are shiny silver. The last piece I got was not, and was a dark gray color.

Zinc plating is pretty standard on steel parts.

[Possum]

Cool, Joe

Joe, now we're getting somewhere, the keeper bars are about .192" wide. so if I got some 1/8 bar I'd have to cut them down somehow, so I"m stuck on that one. I don't have a lathe or a mill, any ideas how I could easily trim these down?

[David King]

Possum are you sure it isn't .188"? Why would they have used a bar stock that isn't readily available? That makes no sense...

[Possum]

dunno....

Well all the parts have to line up, magnet, keeper, and mount screw holes in the bobbins. GJ keepers are .196 wide, the other one is mid 50's. 3/16" is pretty close, but I don't want to change vintage specs as I'm pushing on vintage correct tones....

[Joe Gwinn]

Possum are you sure it isn't 0.188" [versus 0.192"]? Why would they have used a bar stock that isn't readily available? That makes no sense...

Some of the keeper bars I have were punched from 0.125" flat stock, so they would not have to be standard width.

0.188" is 3/16", a standard width.

0.192" is not close to any standard width. Look at the keeper bars of this width. Were they punched out from flat stock? I bet they were.

In any event: Possum, is it necessary to be this exact width, or would a standard width be close enough?

3/16" = 0.1875", so 0.192/0.1875= 1.024= 2.4% larger than 3/16.

1/4" = 0.250", so 0.192/0.250= 0.768= 77% the width of 1/4.

I've got to believe that 3/16 will work just fine.

If not, a big file will quickly get one from 1/4 to 0.192".

[NightWinder]

maybe something like 1010? thats quite low.....maybe that would be closer to "electrical iron"?

[Possum]

keepers....

Well it depends on what kind of tone you want, you could make the keepers even wider if you can fit them and darken up the tone some, maybe, skinnier would be a more clear tone. Anyway I'm going to be order some 1/4" and cut it down shouldn't be too hard to make some kind of jig or something to handle the stuff and make it repeatable easily. I need to see if they have 1022 too....