Glass Fiberfill Nylon Bobbin

[dor baruch]

where can i get Glass Fiberfill Nylon Bobbin
and what kind of Pole Pieces for humbucker do you use?

[David Schwab]

You mean like the ones Duncan uses? Unless they want to sell you some, and I'm sure they won't, you have to have them custom made, like they did.

[dor baruch]

i did an Experiment and build some paf in a Chromium nickel hosting its Influenced the sound i want to try 440c steel and the Glass Fiberfill Nylon Bobbin
maby there is something in it
do you know Who can make me that?
thanks david

[David Schwab]

Metal covers alter the tone because of eddy currents. Did you use nickel silver, or nickel? Nickel is magnetic, and that would probably mess with the tone in a bad way.

Duncan is using pole pieces that are stainless steel and nickel. I believe it's a hollow stainless steel tube with the nickel rod on the inside, but I forget at the moment. Thats different from a cover.

I've used stainless steel blades for pickups, and it has a bright edgy tone, at least in the pickup I tried it in.

I have no idea what affect the nylon bobbins would have.

[dor baruch]

i have one aluminum plated plastic cover and very thin (nickel zinc nickel) cover
yes he use hollow stainless steel tube with the nickel rod on the inside
why do you think he use nickel core and not all 440c steel? 650+_ is pure nickel permeability in a vacum.
the nylon bobbins would have no effect on the tone in a good way some pepole think the plastic have no effect but its Wrong
+the plastic and vulcanized fiber Vibrating with the guitar and the nylon bobbins almost not The resulting sound of the pickup is more stable
thin stainless steel blades will have bright adgy tone big and flat one not

[LtKojak]

the plastic and vulcanized fiber Vibrating with the guitar and the nylon bobbins almost not The resulting sound of the pickup is more stable.

A HB p'up will vibrate as a whole at the pivot points, which are the height screws being pressed by the springs in the p'up ring, so I don't see how/why you're assuming all parts in a p'up will freely vibrate undependently from each other?

[dor baruch]

ok
plastic is a hige q material and hige k constant material(dielectric)
Glass Filled Nylon Bobbins are low q and k material
(low q Refers to the bell curve of the resonance)
Relative permittivity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
and why this is Important?
*low q nylon is Less prone to microphonics then plastic(when i build unpotted pickup its Becomes Significant)
*Plastic changes the pickup's sound much more than nylon

"all parts in a p'up will freely vibrate undependently from each other " its jast work like that The result of all the vibration apart is the end result of them Together and its what the pickup "hear" if you have less q you get less Interference and Cleaner sound and Harmonics if you could have completely "Flood"? the pickups the sound will getting more "clean"

**This does not necessarily mean you want it
***Individual effect is quite small But when you are trying to reach a specific outcome...

[JGundry]

I think vintage strat pickup covers are nylon after they went away from bakelite. Is there a tonal difference between nylon and ABS strat cover? I never tested it but maybe someone has.

[David Schwab]

ok
plastic is a hige q material and hige k constant material(dielectric)
Glass Filled Nylon Bobbins are low q and k material

If you are talking about dielectric constants, what is the conductor that the bobbin is insulating the windings from? There isn't any. So that is not a factor.

All parts of the pickup do not vibrate freely from each other. How would they? Your pickup will squeal like a pig if it was that loose. All the parts on a guitar vibrate together. This goes along with people thinking that you need to transfer the string's vibration to the body and all that nonsense. Then you get people saying glue lines hamper vibrations, or that finish changes the tone. The guitar is a rigid frame to support the tension of the strings. The energy from the strings get's absorbed by the body in the form of vibrations, some of which you can hear. But everything connected to the guitar is being subjected to those vibrations, and on a solid body, they are very small.

But an easy test of this is to hold a pickup over the strings so it's not touching the body. Does it sound different? Not at all.

I make pickups that get encapsulated in epoxy. On some of my basses I have them both encapsulated and not. They don't sound any different, but the ones that are not encapsulated are a little more microphonic, but thats due to the way they are assembled. So if I tap on them with something hard you can hear it. A regular guitar humbucker is securely screwed to the baseplate and all, while my pickups are just sitting in the cover.

I think you are over analyzing this stuff, and will find it doesn't really matter.

Having said that, Frank Falbo from, Duncan says he could hear a different between the nylon bobbins and regular plastic.

[dor baruch]

yes the strat pickup cover are a type of nylon
there are many types of matirial for bobbins
*abs(fender)
*pvc
*high pressure styrene ( some dimarzio)
*butyrate (gibson+fender)
*polypropylene
*nylons
*glass fulled nylon
*phenolic(bakelite)
*nickel zinc nickel
*wood
"seymour duncan forum"

[David Schwab]

*nickel zinc nickel

I doubt anyone has ever used nickel for a bobbin. "Nickel silver" as used in covers and baseplates is usually made from 60% copper, 20% nickel and 20% zinc.

[dor baruch]

ok Maybe i over analyzing this stuff but i build electric guitars and know one thing or two on Acoustics
I will not hide the fact that you are a lot more Experienced then me in building pickups

*all part of the pickup vibrate Separately and Together all part of the pickup,guitar(bridge,neck,bluck,saddles,tuners...have Separate vibration antinode and nodes
and Different vibration frequencies the guitar sound is the sum of all of them Together

*finish changes the tone!!! Yes it changes the sound
(Thickness, texture, type, drying time...)

"on a solid body, they are very small" what is very small?

the parts of the guitar and the Construction method Emphasizes certain frequencies or deEmphasizes them

"But an easy test of this is to hold a pickup over the strings so it's not touching the body. Does it sound different"
My experiments prove the opposite!
the Vibration of the guitar called by the pickup and Add to the magnetic field reading of the pickup
(If this is desirable or not its your decision) If you want proof I'll be happy to provide one soon


its like to say unpotted in wax and potted good strat pickup have no Difference

[David Schwab]

No, finish does not change the tone, especially NOT on a solid body electric. Please explain how it does? Here's a good quote from Gregg Warmoth:

Yes, the Warmoth poly finish is paper thin. On acoustic guitar the type of finish should make a tonal difference. But on a body that is a solid wood of 1 3/4" thick or more, ah, hard pill to swallow that you can hear it in my opinion.Gregg-Warmoth Guitar Products

[David Schwab]

No, finish does not change the tone, especially NOT on a solid body electric. Please explain how that would be possible? And please stop shouting.

You are talking about a very thin film on top of a lot of solid mass. The finish does not affect how the strings vibrate.

The people who say it does also erroneously state things like; "the wood can't breath" The wood is dead. It doesn't breath.

Another good one is; "the wood can't dry out because of the finish" If finish can let moisture out, it will also let moisture in. The wood on a guitar is as dry as it's going to get, and the amount of moisture in it changes on a regular basis with the seasons.

Another good one is people claiming you need a very thin nitro finish, as opposed to a thicker poly finish, and that the old guitars, which sound better, used thin nitro finishes. Take an old Fender guitar from the 70s. Strip off the lacquer (which is often acrylic automotive lacquer). What do you have? You have a thick coat of fullerplast, a two part poly sealer. The stuff it practically bullet proof. Did it harm the tone of the guitar? Not one little bit.

Another funny one is that poly finishes are plastic, and therefore sound bad. What's nitrocellulous? Plastic, also known as Celluloid.

I'm sorry, but you are incorrect, and this is a common misconception. The burden is on you to produce some evidence that proves that finish changes the tone of a solid body guitar. I've played guitars that I built with and without finish, and also after refinishing them with a different finish, and they don't sound any different. There's absolutely no reason why they should.

[big_teee]

"the wood can't breath" The wood is dead. It doesn't breath.

Good One, I like that!