Cryogenic treatment of guitars warning

[big_teee]

CryoPlus Inc. in Wooster Ohio does small runs under 1 pound for $17-25 depending on how you specify it (parts? electronics? tools?).

Their generic process includes a 200F pre-heat to remove water, 10 hours at -300F, and a later 300F annealing UNLESS you specify otherwise. 300F is a little close for comfort for the P155 magnet wire insulation (155C = 311F).

CryoPlus Inc contact info:
2429 North Millborne Rd
Wooster, OH 44691
Phone: 330-683-3375
Fax: 330-683-2653
Email: Kathi@cryoplus.com

If you phone later in the day, you are quite likely speaking with the owner, Kathi Bond, so be nice.

Don't think The 300f will be good for pickups, especially if a plastic bobbin humbucker is involved.
I wax potted the strat pickup, at 300f, doubt there will be any wax left.
I vote for 150f before and after.
T

[salvarsan]

Someone should ask them if cryo only, no heat treatment is an option.

[Rick Turner]

The issue seems to be moisture, but if it's a wax potted coil, that shouldn't be a problem.

The info re. Alnico not particularly liking deep cold is interesting if for no other reason than it shows that cryo does have an effect on Alnico, even if the effect is a negative one. So at least we know that we can't say that there's no effect.

[Chuck H]

Maybe flip flop was too aggressive. I didn't say a thing about north/south. Certainly the polarity is moving. It's making AC! gosh, audio components can't change polarity without Barkhausen distortion? good to know. I'll alert the transformer manufacturers immediately. This is just another semantic nit with a contrary agenda. I tried to bury the hatchet but you act like a petulant child. Maybe you enjoy a circle jerk but I don't. You won't be hearing from me anymore on this thread.

[Chuck H]

If you do not like people correcting you, then stop posting nonsense.

If you don't like people correcting you, stop posting.

I'm cruising.

[Enzo]

I don't have a dog in this fight, I don;t deal with pickups.


No, I do not include that I USE guitar pickups to make sound while servicing amps.

I don;t make them or service them. I have been watching this thread, it is such a classic internet faceoff. Like tube versus solid state, or whatever, the same relative positions were grabbed and let the shit slinging begin. Everyone wants to hold their turf.


I see a mighty argument over the magnet "powering" the pickup. The disagreement? Power meaning providing some sort of actual power, while the pickup is passive on the one side. OR power means that which makes the thing function on the other. OK, there is no "power" in the passive pickup. But without the magnet it doesn't work. Is that really an argument?

My introductory physics courses and electronics courses were 50 years ago now, but we learned that a conductor moving in a magnetic field induces a current in the conductor. It didn't care whether the conductor moved in the field or if the field was moved around the conductor. The conductor could be plain old non-magnetizable copper.


It is all well and good That we use proper terminology, but is there real confusion here about the concepts?

[salvarsan]

It is all well and good That we use proper terminology, but is there real confusion here about the concepts?

Yup. Others have noted that, too.

Chuck H is unclear on the concepts and became both defensive and abusive with called on it. Does anyone else think that was questionable behavior for a moderator? You can't put a moderator on your ignore list, either.

Speakina moderators, Dr. Strangelove, a self-styled IMmoderator, is posting again.

[DrStrangelove]

If you don't like people correcting you, stop posting.

I'm cruising.

Well overdue, at that.

[The Dude]

Chuck H is unclear on the concepts and became both defensive and abusive with called on it.

Let's be fair. He's not the only horse in that race.

[Enzo]

I wasn't pointing at an individual.

Over in the amp section, someone may post that he plugged his speakers into the "speaker input" on the back of his amp. Well, that is clearly wrong, as the rear panel jacks are output TO speakers. But I knew what he meant. I might correct the usage, but at the same time I won;t pretend not to understand. I thought it was pretty clear what everyone was talking about, regardless of the correctness of the terminology.

No one gets a pass because the "other guy was wrong".

[The Dude]

I'm in total agreement with you Enzo. In fact, I posted nearly the same thing back at post #118 requesting some civility. Instead of calm, the post immediately following was just more of the same, which led me to block a user and move on. I'm still following the thread, but will no longer engage in what seems, IMO, to be a senseless argument.

[big_teee]

I thought there were several guys throwing some petty innuendos around.
No one got hurt, I don't see any Big Deal Really, lets move on!
We could all be a little more considerate to others!
T

[Rick Turner]

The Barkhausen Effect experiment by Jean-Louis Naudin

And plenty of other references. Here are some pretty pictures that do explain the phenomenon nicely:

Barkhausen effect in transformers - Google Search

Also, magnetic tape hiss is due to the Barkhausen effect.

And again...vocabulary...polarity means something...when one says that the poles flip flop in a magnetic circuit, it means that N becomes S, and S becomes N. It isn't a reference to voltage swing...which is another issue.

You can have a voltage swing without a +/- swing of electrical polarity...and we do with most pickups running as an unbalanced circuit or "single ended" preamp or power amp circuits. The signal modulates but it does't cross zero=ground, and so it's a matter of more or less of a single polarity.

But I digress...good night...gotta spray some guitars.

[Rick Turner]

Perhaps this forum needs a sticky glossary of terms and a tutorial in the basic physics involved with pickup design. It's incredibly difficult to have a civil and intelligent conversation when these things are treated unimportant and the language used is as loose as casual slang. Some of us would like to more deeply understand what the subtleties are of this endeavor, both to figure out the mojo of classic designs and to advance the state of the art. We have better and less expensive test gear now, so we should be able to start to measure more of what we hear, but if we're to communicate with one another, words have to have real meaning, and that meaning should be based in classic physics.

[DrStrangelove]

Everything in moderation, particularly moderation?

Let's be fair. He's not the only horse in that race.

Be fair? Chuck spooked that horse so much it fled the race, left the barn, and boarded a ship that sailed shortly after.

He resorted to ad hominem attacks when we pressed him on his inability to cite the science behind his intemperate denials.

Nice moderation skills, don't you think? I think that, rather than deletion, his commentary should remain to stand as monument to his temperate and even-handed ways (i.e., their absence).

The Immoderator has returned to duty.